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185 strange idling

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ashley84

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I travelled on a class 185 for the first time (I think) recently, and noticed what seemed to me to be very strange idling behaviour at stations - the engine RPM seemed to rise and fall dramatically, a bit like in a idling car if the driver presses the accelerator hard once every second or two. Seemed normal once we got going but this came back at every station. Any ideas what this is about / is this normal for these trains?
Thank you
 
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driverd

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I travelled on a class 185 for the first time (I think) recently, and noticed what seemed to me to be very strange idling behaviour at stations - the engine RPM seemed to rise and fall dramatically, a bit like in a idling car if the driver presses the accelerator hard once every second or two. Seemed normal once we got going but this came back at every station. Any ideas what this is about / is this normal for these trains?
Thank you

Just the engine hunting for the idle rpm. Very common on the 185s.
 

800301

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It’s just grumpy that it’s got to work another day and can’t sit in the depot
 

185

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Yes it's "normal", nothing "new" at all
It isn't normal. Although the trains are 20 years old now, when the trains were new for the first ten years, there was never this idling racket. There have been so many engine modifications, it now sounds ridiculous. I'm aware of a noise complaint, 1am, 300 metres from the line by several nearby residents. The local nightclub was initially blamed for the "awful constant booming noise"... turned out it was a 185 at a signal, caught up in an emergency possession for 45 minutes. I know Network Rail have now started paying attention to this, not just in our local area. The huge exhausts seem to be part of the noise problem.
 

tfw756rider

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It isn't normal. Although the trains are 20 years old now, when the trains were new for the first ten years, there was never this idling racket. There have been so many engine modifications, it now sounds ridiculous. I'm aware of a noise complaint, 1am, 300 metres from the line by several nearby residents. The local nightclub was initially blamed for the "awful constant booming noise"... turned out it was a 185 at a signal, caught up in an emergency possession for 45 minutes. I know Network Rail have now started paying attention to this, not just in our local area. The huge exhausts seem to be part of the noise problem.
Well, I take back what I said then.
 

185

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Well, I take back what I said then.
You're kind of right in that many of them do this, and it isn't unexpected, but the underlying point is that Siemens didn't design or build them to sound so ridiculous. Even more ridiculous than me. :D
 
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Believe it's something to do with eco mode on them if I remember right. If eco mode is enabled, the weird revving will occur due to cross-feeding or something like that
 

driver9000

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Believe it's something to do with eco mode on them if I remember right. If eco mode is enabled, the weird revving will occur due to cross-feeding or something like that

When cross feeding the engine will idle slightly higher. The engine hunting is a known issue and while it doesn't cause damage a solution is being worked on.
 

josh-j

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Someone posted on here a few years ago that this was caused by some kind of sensor getting blocked (I think). Something along those lines. Unfortunately I've not been able to find the post.
 

WirralLine

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A friend of mine noticed at Manchester airport the other day the engines only started hunting when the driver keyed into the desk, he noted it on 2 units - idling with no active cab they idled nicely!
 

Msq71423

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I always thought this was just how they are, something to do with them having a unique hydraulic diesel engine I always thought, they often make the up and down revving noise while going along a straight section of track near me. Reading the above comments maybe I'm wrong. You can certainly identify a 185 from some distance away with its unique sound.
 

TRAX

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I always thought this was just how they are, something to do with them having a unique hydraulic diesel engine I always thought, they often make the up and down revving noise while going along a straight section of track near me. Reading the above comments maybe I'm wrong. You can certainly identify a 185 from some distance away with its unique sound.
What do you mean a unique hydraulic diesel engine ?
If I’m not mistaken it’s just a standard diesel engine, it’s the transmission that’s hydraulic…
 

hexagon789

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What do you mean a unique hydraulic diesel engine ?
If I’m not mistaken it’s just a standard diesel engine, it’s the transmission that’s hydraulic…
And also used by 180s, 220s, 221s and 222s
 

tfw756rider

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Exactly, the Cummins QSK19 engine is used in 180s and 185s with 3-speed hydraulic transmission, and in 220s, 221s and 222s with electric transmission. However, 185s change "gears" at lower speeds than 180s, because of their different ratio final drives that give the 185s their lower top speed.
 

voyagerdude220

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A friend of mine noticed at Manchester airport the other day the engines only started hunting when the driver keyed into the desk, he noted it on 2 units - idling with no active cab they idled nicely!
Maybe when the Driver puts the 185 into Forwards, the engines change how fast they're revving, similarly to how the engines on 220/221s very notably rev up a bit when the Driver puts them into Forwards, even when they're idling?
 

tfw756rider

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Maybe when the Driver puts the 185 into Forwards, the engines change how fast they're revving, similarly to how the engines on 220/221s very notably rev up a bit when the Driver puts them into Forwards, even when they're idling?
Except that in this case, two simultaneous different rpm signals (an increased one and a non-increased one) could be interfering?
 

driver9000

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Maybe when the Driver puts the 185 into Forwards, the engines change how fast they're revving, similarly to how the engines on 220/221s very notably rev up a bit when the Driver puts them into Forwards, even when they're idling?

The engine idle speed doesn't change when the Driver selects a direction on a 185 or 180. A solution to the engines hunting at idle is being worked on.
 
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