• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Potential new service from Birmingham to Manchester Airport

L

lowe1409

Member
Joined
6 Feb 2024
Messages
224
Location
Cheshire
amahy said:
I ask, because Styal is currently managed by Northern, which wouldn't make much sense if no Northern services will serve there any more.
Click to expand...
So are local stations between stalybridge and Huddersfield. However they're only served by TPE. And what will it matter in a couple years anyway once GBR comes to fruition.


amahy said:
Also, I'm not sure the people of Styal will be too happy, losing their direct train to central Manchester.
Click to expand...
They're direct train currently stops in the airport for a bout 15 minutes. It's a lot quicker to alight there then change onto the xx.04 tpe service to reach Manchester
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

S

SCDR_WMR

Established Member
Joined
17 Dec 2017
Messages
2,616
Location
Crewe
ayubdaud said:
Aside from some of the other points mentioned, they would also need to be 4-car to allow for permissive working at Manchester Airport as the curtailed Northern service would likely need to arrive on the B end.


I don't believe Alderley Edge is a proposed call


Looking at the existing timetable, towards Manchester I suspect platform 1 is achievable by extending the existing WMT path, but would only be the minimum 2 minute dwell. On the way back I think platform 1 would be used by Northern until it departs at xx:46. I doubt WMT would want to use the existing Northern path as it sits at Wilmslow for a while and also does not give them a decent turnround at the Airport. So the only other plausible gap is to run later but before the next Avanti arriving at Wilmslow (to Manchester). That only leaves platform 5 available at Crewe which would be interesting. Or you'd have to run even later but I imagine that loses a path further south to Birmingham.
Click to expand...
Northern won't be running to Crewe though so P1 will be free. Or that's my understanding of what will be happening.
 
L

lowe1409

Member
Joined
6 Feb 2024
Messages
224
Location
Cheshire
SCDR_WMR said:
Northern won't be running to Crewe though so P1 will be free. Or that's my understanding of what will be happening.
Click to expand...
Will they not still be using it for the Crewe via Stockport however? Without massively changing the timetable for the Stockport train, it's going to have to sit in Crewe for around fifty minutes as it arrives at xx.58 and leaves Crewe at xx.46
 
317 forever

317 forever

Established Member
Joined
21 Aug 2010
Messages
3,272
Location
North West
lowe1409 said:
Crewe to Piccadilly via Stockport is to remain unaffected. As I understand it, the Crewe to Piccadilly via airport is being split with northern running the leg between the airport and Piccadilly and LNWR running the leg between Crewe and the airport.

I imagine LNWR will be keen to offer cheap Birmingham - Manchester tickets changing at airport or Wilmslow, likely for a northern service on to Piccadilly, to compete with XC in a similar way to what they've done with Manchester to London via TFW changing at Crewe. Will be nice to see some better competition to XC anyway. I believe they are expecting it to be a very busy service when it starts.
Click to expand...
I hope there will be good fares from East Didsbury and Burnage to London via Crewe.

Admittedly I used a similar LNR/Northern Manchester - London ticket but with local stations instead of Piccadilly as my start/end destinations.
 
J

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
10,096
Location
Wilmslow
lowe1409 said:
Will they not still be using it for the Crewe via Stockport however? Without massively changing the timetable for the Stockport train, it's going to have to sit in Crewe for around fifty minutes as it arrives at xx.58 and leaves Crewe at xx.46
Click to expand...
There is an EMU stabling siding at Crewe.
 
RealTrains07

RealTrains07

Established Member
Joined
28 Feb 2019
Messages
1,901
According to an interview with the deputy MD of West Midlands Trains in the July issue of Modern Railways it seems the plan regarding the birmingham to manchester airport via Stoke service has changed and are expecting the Birmingham to Crewe leg to start with the December 26 timetable change and the Crewe to Airport leg won’t now be introduced until May 27.

It seems WMT are still confident the new service will be going ahead with discussion ongoing about the number of stops between crewe and manchester airport.
 
S

SCDR_WMR

Established Member
Joined
17 Dec 2017
Messages
2,616
Location
Crewe
RealTrains07 said:
According to an interview with the deputy MD of West Midlands Trains in the July issue of Modern Railways it seems the plan regarding the birmingham to manchester airport via Stoke service has changed and are expecting the Birmingham to Crewe leg to start with the December 26 timetable change and the Crewe to Airport leg won’t now be introduced until May 27.

It seems WMT are still confident the new service will be going ahead with discussion ongoing about the number of stops between crewe and manchester airport.
Click to expand...
This has been confirmed internally this last week.

From December services runs Crewe via Stoke to Stafford, then Wolves via Tame Bridge to New St. Will call at Darlaston and Willenhall.

Airport extension from Crewe to "launch in May as per Network Rail's request" (internal document wording not mine)
 
S

SCDR_WMR

Established Member
Joined
17 Dec 2017
Messages
2,616
Location
Crewe
lowe1409 said:
What reason could network rail have for wanting the service delayed untill may?
Click to expand...
No idea. Unless there are other changes being made and NR want to limit the amount of change in December or they want to launch the Tame Bridge extension first to check issues with timings/reliability etc.

I would imagine it's come from Dft tbh but I'm merely passing on the reasons given to us ground staff.
 
T

The Mercian

Member
Joined
9 Apr 2024
Messages
156
Location
Henbury, Macclesfield
SCDR_WMR said:
No idea. Unless there are other changes being made and NR want to limit the amount of change in December or they want to launch the Tame Bridge extension first to check issues with timings/reliability etc.

I would imagine it's come from Dft tbh but I'm merely passing on the reasons given to us ground staff.
Click to expand...
That seems like good planning for an all stations stopping service from Brum to the Manchester conurbation get the Brum to Crewe bit working properly then extend it into the Airport when you know you’re not importing delays. There’s enough moaning on here about importing delays across the network without adding fuel to the fire. It also gives TfGM, Cheshire East and Northern a bit of time to work out what should the Mcr - Crewe service, either via the airport or not, look like.
 
S

SCDR_WMR

Established Member
Joined
17 Dec 2017
Messages
2,616
Location
Crewe
The Mercian said:
That seems like good planning for an all stations stopping service from Brum to the Manchester conurbation get the Brum to Crewe bit working properly then extend it into the Airport when you know you’re not importing delays. There’s enough moaning on here about importing delays across the network without adding fuel to the fire. It also gives TfGM, Cheshire East and Northern a bit of time to work out what should the Mcr - Crewe service, either via the airport or not, look like.
Click to expand...
Which is fine, given that was the service prior to what we have now with no reliability issues. But obviously timings for other services may have shifted since then so I guess we shall see.
 
L

lowe1409

Member
Joined
6 Feb 2024
Messages
224
Location
Cheshire
The Mercian said:
It also gives TfGM, Cheshire East and Northern a bit of time to work out what should the Mcr - Crewe service, either via the airport or not, look like.
Click to expand...
I imagine this is probably the case as I don't see lnwr calling at all the local stops along the line, nor would doing so be potentially beneficial anyway. But then this leaves Alderly edge, Holmes chapel and Sandbach down a train which I imagine wouldn't be particularly popular.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Bald Rick said:
It’s not just NR
Click to expand...
Who else then has requested it?
 
S

SCDR_WMR

Established Member
Joined
17 Dec 2017
Messages
2,616
Location
Crewe
lowe1409 said:
I imagine this is probably the case as I don't see lnwr calling at all the local stops along the line, nor would doing so be potentially beneficial anyway. But then this leaves Alderly edge, Holmes chapel and Sandbach down a train which I imagine wouldn't be particularly popular.
Click to expand...
Why would it not stop at local stations, it will.

Why would it not be beneficial? There are regular commuters from south of Crewe to Sandbach/Alderley Edge.
 
daodao

daodao

Established Member
Joined
6 Feb 2016
Messages
3,601
Location
Dunham/Bowdon
SCDR_WMR said:
Why would it not stop at local stations, it will.

Why would it not be beneficial? There are regular commuters from south of Crewe to Sandbach/Alderley Edge.
Click to expand...
Even if the replacement rail service from the West Midlands calls at the existing stops, it is not intended to extend it to Central Manchester, so the service frequency to the primary destination from these stations, which is Central Manchester, would be reduced.
 
G

goldisgood

Member
Joined
5 Mar 2018
Messages
445
daodao said:
Even if the replacement rail service from the West Midlands calls at the existing stops, it is not intended to extend it to Central Manchester, so the service frequency to the primary destination from these stations, which is Central Manchester, would be reduced.
Click to expand...
Agreed - but the time penalty of going via the Airport adds almost as long as waiting for the next service (even south of Alderley), and connecting at Wilmslow gets you to Central Manchester faster than staying via the Airport would. With pathing constraints between Alderley and Crewe there clearly isn’t a perfect solution, but it seems hard to argue these changes as a major reduction in connectivity imo (as someone who semi-regularly uses the line)
 
L

lowe1409

Member
Joined
6 Feb 2024
Messages
224
Location
Cheshire
SCDR_WMR said:
Why would it not stop at local stations, it will.

Why would it not be beneficial? There are regular commuters from south of Crewe to Sandbach/Alderley Edge.
Click to expand...
Depending on exactly what path it takes will impact whether it is able to call at those stops without impacting the Avanti/TFW. Plus surely there becomes a point where there's too many stops an it slows the service massively. Though admittedly it doesn't cause the existing airport to Liverpool service to be unpopular.
Bald Rick said:
Not all of them… (it wouldn’t fit in the timetable if it did)
Click to expand...
Goostry and chelford certainly will be skipped as per the existing service.

daodao said:
Even if the replacement rail service from the West Midlands calls at the existing stops, it is not intended to extend it to Central Manchester, so the service frequency to the primary destination from these stations, which is Central Manchester, would be reduced.
Click to expand...
In my experience, outside of maybe the morning peak, it feels like most people on that train are traveling to/from the airport. The turnover is significant, especially on the northbound, the train can be practically empty after arriving at the airport.
 
L

lowe1409

Member
Joined
6 Feb 2024
Messages
224
Location
Cheshire
pokemonsuper9 said:
Maybe anyone heading for Manchester would have changed for the Scotland TPE which gets into Piccadilly 9 minutes earlier than staying on the train.
Click to expand...
Undoubtedly some, along with the fact it's the easiest way from a lot of Cheshire east towards Preston and beyond. However, it feels like the vast majority don't change. It's still 5 minutes quicker to change at Wilmslow onto the TFW if you only want to get to Piccadilly
 
B

Bald Rick

Veteran Member
Joined
28 Sep 2010
Messages
35,736
lowe1409 said:
Goostry and chelford certainly will be skipped as per the existing service.
Click to expand...

Of course. And others, which currently are served by the stopping service.

I’m not convinced this service will ever get beyond Crewe.
 
S

SeanM1997

Member
Joined
2 Feb 2016
Messages
570
West Midlands Railway have indicated that the new Birmingham - Manchester Airport will actually run to/from Birmingham International - meaning direct connectivity between the two airports:


Birmingham/Crewe: WM Trains aspirations are to introduce extended journeys between Birmingham International and Manchester Airport in both directions. For this application the southern portion is being requested of this journey between Birmingham and Crewe, these services will be using the existing rights and requesting additional rights as a part of this application, this will be displayed as Crewe – Birmingham and Birmingham – Crewe.
Click to expand...
 
T

The Planner

Veteran Member
Joined
15 Apr 2008
Messages
19,669
SeanM1997 said:
West Midlands Railway have indicated that the new Birmingham - Manchester Airport will actually run to/from Birmingham International - meaning direct connectivity between the two airports:

Click to expand...
No, its one service at 05.39 from International to Manchester and one in the other direction on a Saturday at 20.11.
 
S

SeanM1997

Member
Joined
2 Feb 2016
Messages
570
www.londonnorthwesternrailway.co.uk

Destination Manchester

Read about out exciting plans to begin serving Greater Manchester from 2027.
www.londonnorthwesternrailway.co.uk www.londonnorthwesternrailway.co.uk

New Birmingham New Street - Manchester Airport services launching in May 2027.

We are pleased to confirm that our proposed new train service linking Birmingham New St with Manchester Airport will be launched in May 2027, in time for the summer holiday season.

The new service will be introduced in two phases to help ensure operational robustness. Phase 1 will see our existing Crewe – Stoke – Stafford service extended to & from Birmingham New St from December 2026. Phase 2 will then see this service extended further to & from Manchester Airport, in May 2027.

In headline terms, the new service will deliver:

  • Direct train services between the West Midlands & Manchester Airport.
  • New rail connectivity to the south of the airport – current services only operate as far as Crewe.
  • Later evening trains between Crewe and the airport, with new last trains at circa 22:00 vs 20:00 today.
  • Enhanced Sunday frequency between Crewe and the airport, with 1 train every hour vs of 1 train per 2 hours today.
  • Hundreds of new one stop rail connections across the Midlands for airport travellers, via Birmingham & Stoke On Trent.
  • An additional train each hour between Stafford & Birmingham
  • Improved frequency of trains at new stations in the Black Country.
We believe that the new direct train service will offer an attractive and affordable alternative to travelling by private car, as well as offer greater simplicity and comfort vs road or multi-mode public transport options.

What stations will the new service call at?​

From December 2026, the service will operate between Birmingham New St, Tame Bridge Parkway, Darlaston, Willenhall, Wolverhampton, Stafford, Stone, Stoke-on-Trent, Longport, Kidsgrove, Alsager & Crewe (both directions).

From May 2027, the service will go on to call at Sandbach, Holmes Chapel, Wilmslow, Styal & Manchester Airport (both directions).

What happens next?​

We will continue to work with Network Rail and fellow train operators as we move towards launching the service. Final timetables will be available and visible in journey planners in late September for the December changes, and February for the May changes.

Tickets will be available for sale approximately 12 weeks ahead of travel.

Identifying opportunities for future growth in Greater Manchester​

As a progressive rail operator and part of the publicly owned railway, we’re committed to continue looking for new opportunities to develop new services and connectivity to help provide a better travelling experience for both our current and potential new customers. We are ambitious in this area and our team continually seek innovative solutions to create new journey opportunities.

We recognise that improving connectivity between Greater Manchester and destinations on our existing network could deliver sustainable growth which in turn could help fund investments in the wider railway network.
Click to expand...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Top