EMT to reopen buffets?

[tom1649]

I've been served by EMT staff in first class on a Saturday recently, and it wasn't one of the two breakfast trains either. Obviously the Rail Gourmet trolley wasn't available. The in house EMT cup of tea taster better and was bigger than the Rail Gourmet equivalent.

 

[WillPS]

If it's true that RailGourmet bid based on the 2 years performance up to April 2008 - forgetting that there was significantly less retail available at St Pancras for most of that period, then I doubt their renewal will be anything like as competitive.

 

[Bridge189]

There was what seemed to be an EMT onboard catering preview stand at Sheffield today....

 

[Skymonster]

If it's true that RailGourmet bid based on the 2 years performance up to April 2008 - forgetting that there was significantly less retail available at St Pancras for most of that period, then I doubt their renewal will be anything like as competitive.

Well that's more or less what more than one EMT train manager has told me... I'm lucky to be able to travel FC and go for HSTs where possible, and try to sit in F where e kitchen/buffets are when I can... Some train managers can be quite talkative if you express an opinion on the catering and RG...


Andy

 

[Helvellyn]

What do the FC hosts do for the return workings of the weekend brekky trains?

On the couple of trains I've been on it was sitting in First Class eating the bacon butties they'd just made themselves!

 

[calc7]

On the couple of trains I've been on it was sitting in First Class eating the bacon butties they'd just made themselves!

And getting paid for it - can't be bad!

 

[bengolding]

The first class catering during the day isn't microwaved, as Midland Mainline were very good in specifying the 222s kitchens to a high standard. This includes 3 steam ovens which are used to cook the meals in first class.

I definitely recommend the £4.95 hot meals offered in First. Sampled the Thai Chicken Curry recently and the quality was excellent with the portion being of a generous size. Sampling the EMT £9.95 breakfast soon which I'm sure will be an improvement on the Virgin freebie!

 

[yorksrob]

I see they've just trebled the 1st class prices on the trains I use, so it'll be back to steerage on the main line for me I'm afraid.

 

[bengolding]

I see they've just trebled the 1st class prices on the trains I use, so it'll be back to steerage on the main line for me I'm afraid.

At off peak times, you can get great value First Advances on EMT. In contrast, in the evening peak out of St Pancras, even booking in advance I can only get an eye watering First Anytime ticket (on the non-stop xx55s to Sheffield), with 1 cheese and 2 crackers as an "enhanced service".

 

[Skymonster]

I see they've just trebled the 1st class prices on the trains I use, so it'll be back to steerage on the main line for me I'm afraid.

Wow... Well I hope they don't treble the FOR Nottingham-St.Pancras as I think my boss would take a dim view of that when I put in a claim! No point in trying for an advance either up in the morning peak or down in the evening peak - I'm not sure I believe such tickets exist. The hot food catering offer in 1st can be good good - the breakfast grill especially so - as it comes from the kitchen... It's just RG and the trolley that's crap.


Andy

 

[Blindtraveler]

oo great, another RG Bashing opportunitty. This is
almost
as much fun as anti voyager/XC ism! my EMT trips are few but my standard experiences, most recently sheffield to London have been abismal from a catering pov with rood staff, lack of stock and on the return leg of same no trolley at all!

In contrast my few FC trips with EMT have been great as have the breakfast at the hot meal for under a fiver!
I notice theres a few friends from the EC meals thread kicking around here and must say that I prefer EMTs meals (sorry yorkshire rider)
agree also on qualitty, size and refrigeration comments from others. In short, bring back buffets!

 

[ainsworth74]

I notice theres a few friends from the EC meals thread kicking around here and must say that I prefer EMTs meals (sorry yorkshire rider)!

Indeed compared to the all-day offer (which EMTs is probably most comparable to) it really is stark the difference between the two TOCs.

 

[Smudger105e]

I travel EMT from Derby to London quite regularly, and I have to say that I very rarely use the trolley service, as the prices seem rather high, and the range rather limited (obviously). I usually do a (pre-journey) nip in to the co-op and buy what I need there. For example 12 330 ml cans of coke at £3.65, compared to £1.50 for a 500 ml bottle from RG I think it is...

I must say though that I have never seen any RG staffs being anything less than helpful and polite, I don't understand the comments here about 'rude and unhelpful' RG staffs, not my experience.

But I agree, bring back the buffet!!

 

[Blindtraveler]

yeh im with you there loco fitter
if Im doing a Std EMT trip chances are its a megatrain £2 special meaning a supermarket/£land picknick is a must. If i cant do that then go on a cheepo FC advance as never normally need to use that run in the peaks.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

oo great, another RG Bashing opportunitty. . . . . .

Ha Ha!
Every day RG operates on the UK network is another opportunity!

But I'm no longer able to lay blame for any faults (and there are many) entirely at the door of Rail Gourmet. Its the TOCs who have surrendered responsibility for stock manangement, prepping, delivery, washing and trolley sales who must be questioned. If they didn't know what service their passengers would receive from RG when they entered into their contracts, they certainly know now. And if those TOCs are happy to leave those arrangements in place, then the TOCs are just as culpable.

The excuse of "its not us but our suppliers" doesn't wash after a while.

 

[ainsworth74]

Just of curiosity what alternatives do TOCs have other than bringing catering and everything that goes along with it back in house? Are there any other companies that could supply catering on the same scale as RG?

 

[Martin222002]

I definitely recommend the £4.95 hot meals offered in First. Sampled the Thai Chicken Curry recently and the quality was excellent with the portion being of a generous size. Sampling the EMT £9.95 breakfast soon which I'm sure will be an improvement on the Virgin freebie!

The EMT Great British Breakfast is very good, and it has been said it's one of the best on-train breakfast around (though I've only ever sampled EMTs). I've also had the premium cheeseburger, served with potato wedges and salad, which is also very good, and a friend of mine has said that the Nachos with cheese are also very nice.

For people in standard on EMTs breakfast trains if there are any bacon or sausage baguettes left over after serving FC then a FC host will go into standard to sell them to standard class passengers.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

Are there any other companies that could supply catering on the same scale as RG?

Well lets see now.
There's SSP who seem to be one of the world leaders in transportation catering.

Their brand list include Upper Crust, Costa Coffee and they represent Burger King, M&S Simply Food, Starbucks, Pizza Hut 'Express' and many others, including a specialist on-board catering brand . . . .

. . . it's called Rail Gourmet.

Hmm. Maybe not.

- - - - - - -

[I'm well aquainted with a business owner who 'dipped their toes into' this market a few years ago (and then withdrew!), and with whom I had some exploratory discussions when it was becoming clear which way East Coast were going. I won't post financial information on here, but its a tough business to get right consistently.]

 

[Blindtraveler]

so in short theres no alternative. Grrrrr

 

[tom1649]

so in short theres no alternative. Grrrrr

What's wrong with it being in house? Outsourcing seems to be a national obsession these days.

 

[Aictos]

What's wrong with it being in house? Outsourcing seems to be a national obsession these days.

Outsourcing means lower running costs, lower running costs means greater profits - what could be simpler?

 

[Yew]

Outsourcing means lower running costs, lower running costs means greater profits - what could be simpler?

but if the oursourcing company takes a slice of profit, thats a slice that could have been in your pocket.

 

[tom1649]

Outsourcing means lower running costs, lower running costs means greater profits - what could be simpler?

It doesn't necessarily mean improved quality though does it? You'd think quality would be important to an InterCity operator than making a fast buck, obviously not.

 

[ainsworth74]

What's wrong with it being in house? Outsourcing seems to be a national obsession these days.

Another point would be the very high start up costs that bringing catering in house would suffer.

 

[tom1649]

Another point would be the very high start up costs that bringing catering in house would suffer.

Perhaps it should never have been outsourced in the first place then.

 

[Aictos]

It doesn't necessarily mean improved quality though does it? You'd think quality would be important to an InterCity operator than making a fast buck, obviously not.

I know that,

 

[ainsworth74]

Perhaps it should never have been outsourced in the first place then.

Perhaps but it was cheaper and simpler to do so.

 

[Blindtraveler]

within a year of taking over First Scotrail brought catering in house and its great!

 

[ainsworth74]

within a year of taking over First Scotrail brought catering in house and its great!

To what extent? Is it fully Scotrail operated by which I mean they provide the staff on the train as well as sourcing all the items on the trolley and having the catering depots to handle those stocks? Or is it Scotrail staff on the train serving from trolleys that are stocked by RG?

EDIT: Having looked at RG's website I would guess my second thought is the correct one as Scotrail are listed as a client of RG. It's not totally up to date but its only a year or two old.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

There's several ways one could compare RG's operation with one brought back in-house.
But just to make any comparisons as appropriate as poss, I'd recommend spending 30 minutes at Kings Cross observing the operation in and around the RG site (on plat 8). Note the slow and systematic way in which materials and carts are loaded, marked up, checked out and trolleyed to each train, wait on platforms, are unloaded, trolley back, checked in, unpacked etc.
Meanwhile, observe the EC catering crews gather at the end of their next train's platform, just waiting. Though when they do have a train arrive, they move with some speed.

Then remember how it was - on-board crews had more duties to complete during their run, including more of the washing up and prepping.
Its a complex operation, but as EC (and other TOCs) employ so many CS staff, then there has to be many ways in which duties could be re-allocated which would still work, even during disruption (which is where a shore-based operation can be a benefit).