22.58pm Durham to Leeds why so long?

[northernrail2009]

I am booked onto the 22.58pm Service from Durham to Leeds Tonight(Monday) and just wanted to know why it takes so long at 2hrs and 45 mins when services early on only takes 1hr 15 Mins?

what is the reason for this and what route does it take?

Also i always though you could only get Advance tickets up to 6pm for travel next day but i got a Advance ticket for tonight at 10pm(Sunday night).

 

[Jordy]

Its booked to go via (and reverse at) Doncaster! Not a passenger stop. From there it runs non stop to Leeds via Wakefield Westgate.

 

[northernrail2009]

Its booked to go via (and reverse at) Doncaster! Not a passenger stop. From there it runs non stop to Leeds via Wakefield Westgate.

A bit out of the way!!!!

is that due to works or something?

 

[Anvil1984]

Yep and it has a lot of extra time as well timetabled an hour and a half from Newcastle to York probably incase it has to run "wrong" direction on SIMBIDS

 

[northernrail2009]

Yep and it has a lot of extra time as well timetabled an hour and a half from Newcastle to York probably incase it has to run "wrong" direction on SIMBIDS

Sorry what is SIMBIDS?

 

[Anvil1984]

Sorry if I remember right Simplified Bi-Directional Signalling.Basically allows wrong direction movements if there engineering work on. I dont know much more as I dont work that way

 

[yorkie]

I am booked onto the 22.58pm Service from Durham to Leeds Tonight(Monday) and just wanted to know why it takes so long at 2hrs and 45 mins when services early on only takes 1hr 15 Mins?

See http://www.opentraintimes.com/schedule/G02315/2012/2/13 (and change 'Public' to 'Advanced' in the top right corner) for the full schedule, including passing times.

Sorry what is SIMBIDS?

See http://www.railsigns.co.uk/sect12page1/sect12page1.html

Simplified bi-directional signalling (SIMBIDS) schemes were introduced from 1988. This is an economical form of bi-directional signalling for use on double tracked railways worked by the Track Circuit Block system, where 'wrong direction' movements are normally only made during emergencies or engineering work. A cost-saving feature of this is that no AWS is provided for signals that apply in the wrong direction. Additionally, the AWS provided for normal direction signals is not suppressed, nor are any cancelling indicators provided. Lineside signs are provided to mark the start [12.8] and finish [12.9] of this special AWS working. Further provision of SIMBIDS schemes ceased in 2002.

 

[Anvil1984]

Dont be surprised if it sits 20 mins in York as a result as well to add insult to the journey time

 

[northernrail2009]

Dont be surprised if it sits 20 mins in York as a result as well to add insult to the journey time

I dont mind as it only cost £4.30 with Railcard.

will that service be busy at that time of the night from Durham to Leeds?

 

[DavidBusDriver]

Interesting that on the Brighton Main Line, SIMBiDS is available, but there are no commencement and termination of AWS signs. Having never actually driven the SIMBiDS I am not sure whether the AWS is suppressed either, certainly given me some food for thought there, see if I can pester one of my managers

 

[Aictos]

A lot of late night trains have extra padding in their timetables simply to cater for delays due to engineering works - The 21:15 Newcastle to Kings Cross for example is given 40 minutes between Peterborough and Stevenage when it's usually timed to take 30 minutes so always run early.

As a example, at Stevenage it is due in at 00:21 to set down only but normally can be running anything up to 15 minutes early.

 

[ValleyLines142]

It's due to arrive at Doncaster at 0039 on platform 4, reverse and then leave at 0049 (I'm not sure why they didn't make a scheduled stop), and then it passes through Wakefield Westgate at 0124

 

[westcoaster]

Interesting that on the Brighton Main Line, SIMBiDS is available, but there are no commencement and termination of AWS signs. Having never actually driven the SIMBiDS I am not sure whether the AWS is suppressed either, certainly given me some food for thought there, see if I can pester one of my managers

Iirc they do have to be cancelled as you go over the aws, never done it personally but have been held at keymer junc waiting to go on it only to get a green as the tree had been removed from the down line.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

I quite often travel on that service out of Edinburgh, its the last southbound of the day from Edin.
Now that it begins in Aberdeen, then it can be reasonably well laden, First Class can actually reach the dizzy capacities of around 25%!. But it used to be formed from an electric set starting in Glasgow, which not only meant it was quiet, but (due to the lack of OHLE between Colton and Neville Hill) that it was impossible to get from York to Leeds directly, and so the route with the reversal at Doncaster was established.

 

[Max]

I think this must be due to engineering works on this occasion though. Last time I did this service (since the switch to a HST) it went via Garforth.

 

[Tomnick]

Looking here, it's booked to go direct from York to Leeds - this shows STP amendments (not always involving Doncaster) on quite a regular basis though!

 

[theblackwatch]

I travelled on this train on Friday. A lot of people appeared to alight at Edinburgh, beyond there it wasn' particularly full. I got off at York, where it is due to arrive at 00.13, although I was actually in my car by midnight!

 

[43095john]

1E30 (18:16 ABD-LDS) Currently takes this Long due to a Diversion Via Doncaster and Wakefield (As Mentioned), this is expected through February and March.

This Normally goes via Micklefield and Cross Gates (Arr Leeds 00:50). But there is Currently a Weekday Engineering Possesion Between Micklefield and Church Fenton after 22:00 Mon-Fri Throughout February and Some of March.

TPE is diverted via Castleford Overnight, and the Last 2 Northern Stoppers are Turning Back at Micklefield.

I don't see why EC don't divert via Milford and Castleford Like they Sometimes do. (They only Problem with this is the set would arrive Leeds in Reverse)

 

[YorkshireRider]

Now that it begins in Aberdeen, then it can be reasonably well laden, First Class can actually reach the dizzy capacities of around 25%!. But it used to be formed from an electric set starting in Glasgow, which not only meant it was quiet, but (due to the lack of OHLE between Colton and Neville Hill) that it was impossible to get from York to Leeds directly, and so the route with the reversal at Doncaster was established.

York was its final stop pre May 2011, it then made a York to Newcastle service to connect off the then 2200 KX-York. The train then went to Heaton depot. The only exception to this was the Saturday evening service.

 

[dzug2]

Also i always though you could only get Advance tickets up to 6pm for travel next day but i got a Advance ticket for tonight at 10pm(Sunday night).

Some companies will sell up to midnight - not sure which

Could even be 2.30(??)am - never stayed up long enough to check

 

[Anon Mouse]

It's due to arrive at Doncaster at 0039 on platform 4, reverse and then leave at 0049 (I'm not sure why they didn't make a scheduled stop), and then it passes through Wakefield Westgate at 0124

Weird that, Years ago it used to have a scheduled stop there. Must make sense to somebody in Ivory Towers

 

[YorkshireRider]

It doesnt have a scheduled stop at Doncaster because as has been said it is only going that way due to engineering work and is not advertised to stop there on the passenger timetable. Also it allows the service to go a different route from York to Leeds if need be, for example if the engineering work has been cancelled the signaller may just decide to route the train direct to Leeds instead.

 

[daniel3982]

It goes via Doncaster because it's a class 91 and so needs the wires which don't exist on the direct route. However the last 2 times I've been on that service it has terminated at York and people for York have been taxied to Leeds. It's usually fuller than you think (50% occupied I'd say).

 

[YorkshireRider]

It goes via Doncaster because it's a class 91 and so needs the wires which don't exist on the direct route. However the last 2 times I've been on that service it has terminated at York and people for York have been taxied to Leeds. It's usually fuller than you think (50% occupied I'd say).

This service starts at Aberdeen so is booked HST unless some disruption earlier in the day meant it had to start from Edinburgh as a 91??

 

[ainsworth74]

It goes via Doncaster because it's a class 91 and so needs the wires which don't exist on the direct route.

Erm it isn't as it originates from Aberdeen (unless it's starting short for some reason) so unless someone wired that route without anyone noticing...

 

[Welshman]

Even with its revised timings it seems to have a lot of padding between Doncaster and Leeds! [departing Doncaster 0049 and arriving Leeds 0141, and that's without calling at Wakefield!]

 

[calc7]

Even with its revised timings it seems to have a lot of padding between Doncaster and Leeds! [departing Doncaster 0049 and arriving Leeds 0141, and that's without calling at Wakefield!]

Assuming it's:

• To hit the PPM
• To "miss" last connections at Leeds to avoid liability in the event of a delay

 

[Anvil1984]

Ooh this didnt look like a good journey if LDB is to be believed. 36 late after being 22 early passing Wakefield Westgate so if its correct 2 hours from York to Leeds - uh oh

 

[northernrail2009]

Ooh this didnt look like a good journey if LDB is to be believed. 36 late after being 22 early passing Wakefield Westgate so if its correct 2 hours from York to Leeds - uh oh

Yes it ended as a bit of a mess after being told that we would arrive in Leeds 20 Mins early at 01.20am but it didnt turn out like that due to a problem with the Power cars brakes over heating and Locking up so could not move for about a hour do got into Leeds at about 02.20am.

There was a lot of Smoke coming from the Front power car which soon filled the 1st few units with smoke so was not nice and have to say we was not told anything about what was going on and the Train Manager run to the front of the train and that was it we did not hear from him for almost 30 mins after we stopped and then just after we got on the move.

so a bit of a cock up.

oh and we was at York almost 30 mins as well.