Virgin Pendolino query

[AGV-Fan]

Hello there,

I was on a Virgin Pendolino from Manchester to London Euston yesterday travelling in coach C. On approaching Macclesfield there was a bright flash outside of the train, and a number of the lights went off, as did the air conditioning system.

On reaching Macclesfield we were informed that the train had coasted in to Macclesfield after losing power. The flash of light obviously was the pantograph detaching from the overhead wire. A recorded annoucement then played saying that the steps couldn't be deployed. The train doors didn't open for about 5 minutes, and there were still only a few lights and no air-conditioning.

On leaving the train, I noticed that the front pantograph had been raised, which obviously restored the power, but my query really was in instances when something like this happens far away from a station, what are customers supposed to do? The pendolinos get very hot and stuffy very quickly! Also, in the event that a train loses power and needs to be evacuated, can the doors be manually opened?

 

[Geezertronic]

Without any knowledge of how the 390s work, I would say that it is a given that the doors can be opened manually given the door release panels by the side of every door - I expect that was/is a H&S requirement. However it is very dangerous for a passenger to operate one unless instructed to do so by a member of staff for fear they will step down onto an active/live track and get mowed down by a passing train.

Customers should follow the lead of the onboard staff

 

[headshot119]

I'm not sure if it's the 390s that have them, but doesn't one set of power door stock carry "door guards" so that the doors can be opened and a guard placed across them to get air in but not allow people to fall out.

 

[Bridge189]

Look back at that hullabaloo over the 225s a few years ago when about five all lost power between Peterborough and St Neots. People over threw the crew and opened the doors themselves by using the pull and slide toggle dispite being told to stay onboard. Mind you it was over 40 degrees inside and they had been stuck for over two hours. All 225s now carry door grills in the DVT to get put into use should the same happen again. I believe all plug door stock operators had them recommended by the DFT but I don't know if Virgin introduced them. Eurostar obviously didn't have them after the drama the other year.

 

[Mike C]

Look back at that hullabaloo over the 225s a few years ago when about five all lost power between Peterborough and St Neots. People over threw the crew and opened the doors themselves by using the pull and slide toggle dispite being told to stay onboard. Mind you it was over 40 degrees inside and they had been stuck for over two hours. All 225s now carry door grills in the DVT to get put into use should the same happen again. I believe all plug door stock operators had them recommended by the DFT but I don't know if Virgin introduced them. Eurostar obviously didn't have them after the drama the other year.

I was there that day on the ECML at Huntingdon... DAMN it was hot. We got off our train though. Those up at Conington weren't so lucky. Got photos of it too.

 

[Bridge189]

I heard it was harsh with people passing out etc. Did an HST eventually push the train at Conington? I seem to remember something like that anyways.

 

[Mike C]

I heard it was harsh with people passing out etc. Did an HST eventually push the train at Conington? I seem to remember something like that anyways.

As I recall this is what happened:

A frieght train failed on the down fast at Huntingdon (or just South of the station to be exact). It failed big-time - seized traction motor. All northbound traffic was routed past on the down slow through Huntingdon station and then back on to the fast line just north. A GNER 91 was making that transition from slow to fast at Huntingdon North when it snagged the wires. Being headspan catenary, the whole lot came down. Now we had 4 lines without power, one line blocked by a freight train, and the crossover just down from that blocked by the 91 tangled in the wires. Of course all lines had lost traction current in the OLE by this point from Little Barford (St Neots) to Holme (just South of Peterborough) and it was just hitting Friday rush hour.

Chaos.

On top of that it was a genuine 32C that day. Properly hot. Eventually, a class 66 that had originally been sent to rescue the failed freight train ended up pulling the now dead 91 back into Huntingdon once it had been unhooked from a spectacular screw-up of overhead lines. In the end they unbolted the whole pantograph. I have a photo of the loco (91117 I think...) sans pantograph. If an HST was sent to rescue those stuck at Conington (the train where the passengers staged a "mutiny"), it never got there. As I recall, it was pulled back into Huntingdon platform 2 by a 67. I spoke to a guy on the platform at about 9pm that night who was trying to get to Newcastle and the line was still blocked. He gave up and found a B&B in Huntingdon. Water was being handed out, confused and angry passengers littering the Huntingdon station car park, replacement buses in place and dead trains literally filling all tracks in the station. Never seen anything like it before or since!

 

[Bridge189]

The Conington set arrived at Huntington empty yes? I'm sure I read at the time that after the mutiny people we're mostly in the fields/trackside and refused to get back onboard so coaches were dispatched to a nearby farm to take them to Huntington instead.

 

[Pumbaa]

Information from another forum, but Pendo drivers of past (as the drivers on here haven't yet commented) but they were of the impression 390 pantographs are more susceptible to failure than others. The pantograph is a fairly well tested design but it is mounted on a a tilting plate that tilts to counteract the tilt of the vehicle (so when the vehicle tilts left at 8 degrees, the pantograph tilts to the right at 8 degrees so its constantly upright at the normal).

This ingenious design is very good, but occasionally seizes up or doesn't work as it should and so drops the pantograph. I have no idea on the procedure to restore power though.

 

[ChrisCooper]

Information from another forum, but Pendo drivers of past (as the drivers on here haven't yet commented) but they were of the impression 390 pantographs are more susceptible to failure than others. The pantograph is a fairly well tested design but it is mounted on a a tilting plate that tilts to counteract the tilt of the vehicle (so when the vehicle tilts left at 8 degrees, the pantograph tilts to the right at 8 degrees so its constantly upright at the normal).

This ingenious design is very good, but occasionally seizes up or doesn't work as it should and so drops the pantograph. I have no idea on the procedure to restore power though.

The Pantographs are the Brecknall Willis High Speed which has been around for many years (developed for the ATP) and is used on the majority of overhead electric stock in Britain (including many trams) and also around the world. On all tilting trains where the powercar tilts the pantograph is mounted on a frame which keeps level as the train tilts. On older designs such as the APT this is mechanically linked to the bogies, but on more modern designs like the Pendolino it's electrically operated in conjunction with the tilt mechanism. If the system fails there is a "pan tilt fail" warning light in the cab which will light and the tilt system cannot be used and the train can't run at EPS. Pendolinos, like some other trains (modern and older) have a second pantograph which can be used in the event of a failure of one. Raising the pantograph when moving is not allowed though so in the event of one dropping the train would have to be brought to a stand first. Presumably before doing this though they would have had to make sure the reason for the pantograph dropping and that the wires themselves hadn't been damaged.

 

[Pumbaa]

The Pantographs are the Brecknall Willis High Speed which has been around for many years (developed for the ATP) and is used on the majority of overhead electric stock in Britain (including many trams) and also around the world. On all tilting trains where the powercar tilts the pantograph is mounted on a frame which keeps level as the train tilts. On older designs such as the APT this is mechanically linked to the bogies, but on more modern designs like the Pendolino it's electrically operated in conjunction with the tilt mechanism.

Yes that's the bit I remember - one of the drivers involved in commissioning posted a video looking down on it from above in the depot when it was undergoing static tilt testing. Fascinating stuff.

Part of the pre-amble was it was a brand new system that hadn't been tried before, but I can't remember what it applies to particularly. And thanks for the pantograph name, I couldn't quite muster the energy to go and look for it on Wikipedia!

 

[Mike C]

Slight spelling error - Brecknell Willis is the manufacturer. The basic design of the pantograph is used in many applications, but there are slight differences between the different flavours available. The DC pantograph on our trains is one of the BW high speed units, but you couldn't swap it for one from a Pendolino for example.

 

[317666]

I was on 390008 in the summer from Preston (I think) to Oxenholme. Stopped at Lancaster for 5-10 minutes, all the lights went out and an announcement was made that there was a power problem. After a short delay we were on the move once again, although when I got off at Oxenholme I noticed that the front pantograph was raised, instead of the rear one.