VOLUNTEERS - the next generation.

[Preserved]

Somebody said on another forum, "Ask not what your railway can do for you, but what you can do for your railway." That attitude certainly sums it up for me – I don't mind what jobs I am asked to do, as long as I can hang around the engines I love.

 

[PUFFINGBILLY]

A further thought or two or three.....

When I applied to volunteer at a well established aviation museum (NOT state funded) I was advised everybody receives a contribution towards travel costs. There is the option to opt out if volunteers are too proud or wish their contribution be used as a donation.
I work a half day a week for a disabled charity and get breakfast lunch and afternoon tea free, a Christmas box and an anuual dinner at a posh hotel.
Also I help out at a local NHS hospital and get free parking and ALL food and drink at half price.
On a heritage railway as a volunteer the last time I went to pay for a volunteer discounted coffee and a Mars bar the manageres shouted across the crowed cafe in a loud voice "NO STAFF DISCOUNT ON BRANDED GOODS".
Sod it - I now take my own food and drink or go down the road to a friendly caff.
So heritage railways wake up it's 2012 and expectations and demands are different. Keep your head in the sand and whinge about lack of funds for those who are central to your continued existance, but don't complain when you cannot get the free help you have always assumed will be on hand.

 

[fordylad]

Maybe I deserve the stick I'll get for posting this,
In a society where unemployment is high, couldn't heritage railways be used as training ground for people looking for work.
The way I see it, is that it is a 2 win situation, the railway gets much needed help, and the unemployed get working experience,

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Maybe I deserve the stick I'll get for posting this,
In a society where unemployment is high, couldn't heritage railways be used as training ground for people looking for work.
The way I see it, is that it is a 2 win situation, the railway gets much needed help, and the unemployed get working experience,

Most heritage railways are used for training people. Mine has been used for training NR surveyors, Atkins testers and I believe even some Indian Railway signal engineers came over for some training.

I don't think however, they'd be suitable for training people out of work. There would be no guaranteed hours to get out of these people, so for the training you put it there may be no actual comeback.

 

[YorkshireBear]

I was welcomed very nicely at KWVR, taught the basics and involved in everything that goes on. Soon you find out if you act interested they will respond and since have progressed to being a bit higher up, now working on some of my own little projects within the department.

And those who say staying single is better i got to say i disagree strongly. Been with my girlfriend for over 4 years and whenever i go to keighley she (despite not giving a crap about railways) asks me what ive been up to listens and is always proud if ive achieved something new. She knows its healthy to have hobbies away from each other....

 

[PFX]

@ PUFFINGBILLY - Maybe I'm misunderstanding you but basically, what it sounds like you're saying, is that you don't mind providing your time voluntarily, as long as there's something in return for you? It's a bit mercenary to expect all charities should pay you (albeit in kind) surely? If they can fine, but I'd say the majority would not be able to afford such a luxury.

You contradict yourself in the final paragraph by saying how charities/railways complain about a lack of funds. Do you think that this situation is improved by handing out cash/perks/freebies to volunteers? It isn't about what volunteers should expect to receive from the charity, quite the reverse in fact.

Preserved's quote, above hit the nail on the head as far as volunteering goes.

 

[splashoutradio]

I might be an odd one out here, but I recently started volunteering at the East Lancashire Railway and have been welcomed with open arms. They've been more than helpful in getting me trained and ready for action. My only gripe is that they've been a bit slow at times but it's all done by volunteers, so can't complain.

 

[ChrisCooper]

I worked for a charity a couple of years ago that's volenteer workforce was mostly made up of those sent by the job centre to do volentary work to boost their CVs and confidence and ultimatly the chance of getting a job. Most did 1 or 2 days a week, totally volentarily (i.e they were doing it because they wanted to, not because the job centre was forcing them into it on threat of benefit cuts). This meant that they were there because they wanted to be and were as good as any other volenteers, infact during my time I only knew of 2 people who were "sacked", and to be honest I didn't agree with either and it was part of the reason for me leaving (put it this was, had they been paid employees they would both have had strong tribunal cases). Training wasn't that complicated, beyond the usual health and safety inductions most of it was done on the job by either the few paid staff or other volenteers, and of cource we got back more than we put in as these were useful members of the team, and many we were sad to see go when they found proper work (often thanks to us).

I imagine this sort of thing is very much an option for heritage railways and similar organisations. It's important to remember there are many more jobs than the operational side, and they can be just as hard to find volenteers for. At the museum I volenteer at a problem can often be getting staff for the less glamerous and skilled jobs, often requiring skilled staff to be moved to those positions. Sometimes moving up the ladder can be just as much restricted by the ability to replace you at a lower position as the availability of openings further up.

 

[PUFFINGBILLY]

Maybe I deserve the stick I'll get for posting this,
In a society where unemployment is high, couldn't heritage railways be used as training ground for people looking for work.
The way I see it, is that it is a 2 win situation, the railway gets much needed help, and the unemployed get working experience,

No stick from me although slightly at a tangent from the original topic theme.
Those out of work yet seeking to do something if only for nothing may well find that a spell volunteering in any form on whatever project community of otherwise will enhance their CV and prove a work ethic.
Agreed there is a limit to the amount of non-skilled work on a restored railway and that additional staff/volunteers may have to be found to carry out any required training.
How many labourers were needed to make good the landslips at the SVR for instance? There is always undergrowth clearance and cutting back needed, or just cleaning painting and decorating.

 

[jnrsnr]

I am 14 and am a volunteer at Heaton park tramway working both on the trams as a trolley boy and doing bits of engineering work to help keep the tramway going. All people involved at the park are volunteers and there are an increasing number of young people getting involved. Feel free to pay us a visit on Sundays.

 

[ChrisCooper]

No stick from me although slightly at a tangent from the original topic theme.
Those out of work yet seeking to do something if only for nothing may well find that a spell volunteering in any form on whatever project community of otherwise will enhance their CV and prove a work ethic.
Agreed there is a limit to the amount of non-skilled work on a restored railway and that additional staff/volunteers may have to be found to carry out any required training.
How many labourers were needed to make good the landslips at the SVR for instance? There is always undergrowth clearance and cutting back needed, or just cleaning painting and decorating.

That's the thing though, there are many non-skilled or low skilled jobs (at least things that take a few hours to train, not weeks or months). Remember that whilst the operational side is important, there is a lot that goes on behind the scenes too. There are the shops, cafes, buffets, ticket offices that all need staff. There are plenty of jobs that people with none rail backgrounds can provide valuble skills too, admin, sales, computers, gardening and groundkeeping, building maintenance (including things like painting and decorating, plumbing, electrical).

 

[Mvann]

Maybe I deserve the stick I'll get for posting this,
In a society where unemployment is high, couldn't heritage railways be used as training ground for people looking for work.
The way I see it, is that it is a 2 win situation, the railway gets much needed help, and the unemployed get working experience,

Wasn't there a problem on a railway where the unemployed that volunteered were threatened with benefit cuts because they were deemed not available for work or not actively looking for work

 

[AlexS]

No, voluntary work is permitted and encouraged for unemployment benefit claimants. You have to be available to attend a job opportunity or mandated appointment with a minimum of 48 hours notice though (so if you're booked to be a guard on a train on Saturday as a volunteer, and on the preceeding Monday, you're told to go to a job fair or something, you have to cancel). Obviously it also can't get in the way of you finding paid work too.

 

[ChrisCooper]

No, voluntary work is permitted and encouraged for unemployment benefit claimants. You have to be available to attend a job opportunity or mandated appointment with a minimum of 48 hours notice though (so if you're booked to be a guard on a train on Saturday as a volunteer, and on the preceeding Monday, you're told to go to a job fair or something, you have to cancel). Obviously it also can't get in the way of you finding paid work too.

IIRC you can also do a maximum of 15 hours, just like you can do 15 hours education of training. Of cource what you do and what you tell the job centre is totally different. At the place I worked we would arrange hours with people and that would be co-ordinated through the job centre, but we often had people coming in an extra day now and then and what the job centre didn't know didn't hurt them. The big problem we found was that the job centre had a habit of arranging appointments for people on the days they were volenteering. Luckely we were not far from the job centre (5-10mins walk) though so people could pop to their interviews and come back, although we operated a collection and delivery service so sometimes had to shuffle people around if they were supposed to be out on that and had to be at the job centre.

 

[Greenback]

This is an interesting thread. As I see it, we have had a generation or two who have benefitted from a free university education, and the opportunity to take early retirment. This has meant a relaible supply of people in their 50's who are time rich, and with a comfortable lifestyle, who are able to spend many hours helping out at a wide range of not for profit concerns, from charity shops to hospitals to preserved railways.

The main point for me is whether or how this will continue. Yes, there will always be young people, unemployed people and retired people who will be willing to help, but with people having to work later in life to deal with the increased levels of debt, it seems that the pool of available, fit, healthy people will inevitably become smaller. Add on the likelihood of much higher petrol costs and this will also mean that some will struggle to devote as much time to these things as they do presently, if only because they might struggle to find the money to get there and back unless they live very close by.

 

[PUFFINGBILLY]

This is an interesting thread. As I see it, we have had a generation or two who have benefitted from a free university education, and the opportunity to take early retirment. This has meant a relaible supply of people in their 50's who are time rich, and with a comfortable lifestyle, who are able to spend many hours helping out at a wide range of not for profit concerns, from charity shops to hospitals to preserved railways.

The main point for me is whether or how this will continue. Yes, there will always be young people, unemployed people and retired people who will be willing to help, but with people having to work later in life to deal with the increased levels of debt, it seems that the pool of available, fit, healthy people will inevitably become smaller. Add on the likelihood of much higher petrol costs and this will also mean that some will struggle to devote as much time to these things as they do presently, if only because they might struggle to find the money to get there and back unless they live very close by.

Thanks. If I read your post correctly you have effectively repeated and re-phrased my initial thread.
My main concern is the mindset of those tasked with managing any organisation that relies on volunteers. If they don't get on board with accepting and adapting to social and lifestyle changes imposed on our population and the differing attitude and decreasing availablity of volunteers then the future or such organisations are threatened.
Read again my reference to the UK needing more and more volunteers to run more and more services that cannot be paid for.

 

[Greenback]

Thanks. If I read your post correctly you have effectively repeated and re-phrased my initial thread.
My main concern is the mindset of those tasked with managing any organisation that relies on volunteers. If they don't get on board with accepting and adapting to social and lifestyle changes imposed on our population and the differing attitude and decreasing availablity of volunteers then the future or such organisations are threatened.
Read again my reference to the UK needing more and more volunteers to run more and more services that cannot be paid for.

Yes, I think I have. I must admit, I didn't re-read your original post today, but I did read it a few days ago. I thought that was what you were getting at, but the thread seemed to have drifted away from the original post a bit. So I thought I would try and start the discussion again, as well as try and reinforce the original point.

I'm not so sure I agree with the last bit; the current drive towards cost cutting in government might only be temproary. I hope so, because like you I can't see that relying on more and more volunteers will be possible in the long run. I think that even a change in the mindset of those that run things like preserved lines won't help much, even though it would be welcome.

 

[AlexS]

IIRC you can also do a maximum of 15 hours, just like you can do 15 hours education of training. Of cource what you do and what you tell the job centre is totally different. At the place I worked we would arrange hours with people and that would be co-ordinated through the job centre, but we often had people coming in an extra day now and then and what the job centre didn't know didn't hurt them. The big problem we found was that the job centre had a habit of arranging appointments for people on the days they were volenteering. Luckely we were not far from the job centre (5-10mins walk) though so people could pop to their interviews and come back, although we operated a collection and delivery service so sometimes had to shuffle people around if they were supposed to be out on that and had to be at the job centre.

Not correct, time is not formally limited provided you are still committing an appropriate level of time to acting seeking employment you may volunteer to your hearts content, providing as I said you are able to drop what you are doing with 48 hours notice. Obviously if you're spending 50 hours per week at it it may be questioned whether you are doing enough to find a paid job, but there's been a big push towards encouraging the unemployed to work voluntarily to develop their skills. There's no defined time limit in the JSA regulations however for voluntary work, unlike part time work or education/training.

Please see below for further information:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/HomeAndCommunity/Gettinginvolvedinyourcommunity/Volunteering/DG_064299

 

[ChrisCooper]

Not correct, time is not formally limited provided you are still committing an appropriate level of time to acting seeking employment you may volunteer to your hearts content, providing as I said you are able to drop what you are doing with 48 hours notice. Obviously if you're spending 50 hours per week at it it may be questioned whether you are doing enough to find a paid job, but there's been a big push towards encouraging the unemployed to work voluntarily to develop their skills. There's no defined time limit in the JSA regulations however for voluntary work, unlike part time work or education/training.

Please see below for further information:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/HomeAndCommunity/Gettinginvolvedinyourcommunity/Volunteering/DG_064299

Wonder if they have changed it then as I'm sure it used to be the case that you were limited. Either that or I'm getting it confused with part time work and education and training. Whilst I did work at a charity that had volenteers from the job centre it was someone else who was incharge of the volenteers and co-ordinating their hours and everything. I just did IT and Admin and helped out with other things if required. I was on job seekers years ago myself so perhaps it was the case back then (I know then they didn't seem to look at volentary work as well as they do now).