Greater Anglia to Abellio - confirmed

[Eagle]

Bit confused....

I go to a ticket machine at (say) Finsbury Park (my local station). I buy a ticket from (say) London Bridge to (say) Hildenborough. How can that be open to fraud ?

Doughnutting.

That is (for instance) buying a Cambridge–Foxton and a Finsbury Park–King's Cross to operate the barriers at either end, and travelling all the way from Cambridge to London.

 

[swt_passenger]

Bit confused....

I go to a ticket machine at (say) Finsbury Park (my local station). I buy a ticket from (say) London Bridge to (say) Hildenborough. How can that be open to fraud ?

How about go to Southampton. Buy a ticket to St Denys. Then buy another ticket from Vauxhall to Waterloo. Hide in the bog and save £40 quid...

 

[Mojo]

Which anyone could easily buy online.

 

[swt_passenger]

Which anyone could easily buy online.

Yes, but there's an automatic audit trail for online purchases - people wouldn't risk it so much.

 

[talltim]

Yes, but there's an automatic audit trail for online purchases - people wouldn't risk it so much.

Or buy from a ticket office, where there isn't

 

[Eagle]

Or buy from a ticket office, where there isn't

No one would ever do that. I don't think any ticket sales clerk in their right mind would sell someone a CBG–FXN single and a FPK–KGX single in the same transaction. You'd have to be braindead not to notice that the customer is clearly being fraudulent.

 

[A60K]

This is pure Abellio (NS) with no Serco involvement, just to answer the question earlier.

 

[shinkansen1966]

How about go to Southampton. Buy a ticket to St Denys. Then buy another ticket from Vauxhall to Waterloo. Hide in the bog and save £40 quid...

Well, I had not thought of that.

Well SWT better step up their on board ticket inspections. And at same time, allow passengers access to a greater numbers of tickets from TVMs.

 

[ginger]

Let's face it.....and this is the really important thing......

Look at the current arrangements:

Turnover £500m appx
Premium payment to Gov £100m appx
Profit for NX £20m appx

The new arrangement is a Management Contract only......meaning that out of the £500 the gov will get appx £120m (less the agreed annual management fee which will no doubt be far less that the profit element NX took))

All the listed improvements are DIRECTLY funded and approved by the Dft/Gov.....and the government has stated that in the new long term franchises they EXPECT the TOCs to actually put their hands in their own pockets for improvements such as proper train refurbs / station improvements etc.....as envisaged under the original privatisation plan..... for example the text disruption service....one of the good things NX actually did but then withdrew upon their near brankruptcy in 2008....they are only reinstating it is the ERUF and passengers have lobbied bitterly for NX to do!!!!

So expect no real improvements.....all this actually does is shuffles the deckchairs on the Titantic after being holed by NX 8 years of neglect and racketeering!!!!

The only real good news is bye bye NX! Lets hope the management bullyboys stay with NX Group and Abelio instal some human beings in their place!

 

[Zoe]

Most (if not all) ticket machines won't even sell an off peak ticker until the official end of the peak even though in some cases there isn't much time between the end of the peak and the first off peak train. If this is done as they don't trust people not to try and use an off peak ticket on a peak train then I doubt they are going to start allowing you to buy a ticket that starts from another station as this could be taken advantage of.

 

[Schnellzug]

Interesting. Why would TVMs selling tickets between any two points or advance tickets be susceptible to fraud in this country ? They do in Germany.

Because in the UK, everyone is assumed to be guilty of wanting to defraud until they can prove that they're not. That, at least, is the attitude of a significant proportion of Train operators.

 

[swt_passenger]

Well SWT better step up their on board ticket inspections.

It is highly unusual not to have ticket inspections on longer distance SWT services, in fact it is also almost inevitable on any SWT service in Hampshire IMX. So it's really only SWT's London area where there is a real risk of doughnutting (aka dumbelling). Whatever, no TOC is likely to make anything possible if it increases opportunity for wrongdoing even by a slight amount, and that's unfortunately where we are now...

 

[shinkansen1966]

Because in the UK, everyone is assumed to be guilty of wanting to defraud until they can prove that they're not. That, at least, is the attitude of a significant proportion of Train operators.

There are times now, when buying a ticket feels more like a tiresome legal agreement than opportunity for a pleasant train ride. And then when you board the train, you're reminded of the penalties for transgressions.

 

[mappman1000]

Well, I had not thought of that.

Well SWT better step up their on board ticket inspections. And at same time, allow passengers access to a greater numbers of tickets from TVMs.

Someone I know who is a Waterloo guard, is employed to sit in the back cab of a 455, and operate the doors, what a waste of resources!!!!

 

[Schnellzug]

Whatever, no TOC is likely to make anything possible if it increases opportunity for wrongdoing even by a slight amount, and that's unfortunately where we are now...

God forbid they should do anything that makes travel easier or more convenient fior the passengers ....

 

[bicbasher]

Does the new franchise cover the London suburban routes out of Liverpool Street?

 

[Eagle]

Does the new franchise cover the London suburban routes out of Liverpool Street?

Yes; it's exactly the same franchise as the current one; and the next one starting in 2014 will be the same, except for the transfer of Shenfield stoppers to the Crossrail franchise in 2019ish.

 

[swt_passenger]

God forbid they should do anything that makes travel easier or more convenient fior the passengers ....

Like extendending Oyster PAYG to Hertford East and Shenfield?

 

[bicbasher]

FasTIS machines for the ticket offices on the Shenfield/Hertford East lines then?

 

[mawallace]

Any idea what they will call the new franchise?

 

[Schnellzug]

Any idea what they will call the new franchise?

how about two?

 

[Nym]

how about two?

"Twee"?

Or

"Twee Oost-Engeland"

Or maybe...

"De busmaatschappij die deze franchise had was nutteloos en nu zullen we beter doen vanuit Nederland."

 

[Aictos]

FasTIS machines for the ticket offices on the Shenfield/Hertford East lines then?

Not really, the only stations that can issue new Oyster cards and all Oyster products on the FCC routes is:

London Blackfriars
City Thameslink
St Pancras International

Essex Road
Drayton Park
Finsbury Park

However all TVMs within the London Fare Area do have Oyster retailing devices fitted.

It's a sure thing that the same would apply for the Shenfield and Hertford East routes.

On a side note, isn't it nice to have a proper rail company be successful for once rather then have another bus company come in,

 

[Zoe]

except for the transfer of Shenfield stoppers to the Crossrail franchise in 2019ish.

The Crossrail concession is expected to take over the Shenfield to Liverpool Street all stations service around April 2015 as stated in the invitation to tender document for the franchise just awarded.

 

[dk1]

I'm hoping it'll mean mutual free travel between Northern/Merseyrail/Greater Anglia!

Heard many hopes of this from post 97 NXEA staff.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

how about two?

Please God no. The least said about that ridiculous idea & the embaressment it caused the better. Horrible days :cry:

 

[185]

Foorst Groot Oostern? National Express Edam Angular?

 

[sonic2009]

How about.

London East Anglia Railways?

 

[sprinterguy]

If it doesn't have the word "Anglia" in the title then I will be selecting one of my more nutritious looking hats to eat. Abellio franchise titles seem to do exactly what they say on the tin in a very simple manner.

 

[dk1]

How about.

London East Anglia Railways?

LEAR - London East Anglia Railways

EAT - East Anglia Trains

FEAR - First East Anglian Trains

Have to think of the shortened title .

 

[185]

First Anglia Rapid Trains

Anglia Railways South East