Chiltern Railways m-ticket purchased, phone stolen

[shinkansen1966]

Last night, bought an chiltern railways m-ticket for travel next Saturday 1 October. M-ticket bought on and via iPhone app.

My iPhone has just been stolen and thus m-ticket with it. Called Chiltern Railways would not acceptable responsibility.

What are my options ?

 

[yorkie]

I don't know what time you are travelling, but assuming your origin is London and your destination is Birmingham, there are £5 tickets on these departures:

0700
0800
0820
1130
1200
1230
1300
1330
1400
1430
1500
1530
1600
1630
1700

If those times do not suit, there are other fares at £7.50 or £12.50.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

Why would Chiltern accept responsibility? The ticket was in your possession.

Your only options are:

1) Recover the phone before you travel.

2) Buy a new ticket.

3) Don't travel.

 

[radamfi]

If the iPhone is replaced before 1 October and the app restored from iTunes, will the m-ticket be restored? If shinkansen1966 has an iPod Touch or can borrow one then maybe the Chiltern app could be installed on that with the m-ticket restored?

 

[AlterEgo]

If the iPhone is replaced before 1 October and the app restored from iTunes, will the m-ticket be restored? If shinkansen1966 has a iPod Touch or can borrow one then maybe the Chiltern app could be installed on that with the m-ticket restored?

That is an interesting option. It's worth a try isn't it?

 

[Tomonthetrain]

can also get the app on android and blackberrys...and samsung Genio touch

 

[AlterEgo]

Yes, but he won't be able to retrieve his existing ticket.

 

[radamfi]

Yes, but he won't be able to retrieve his existing ticket.

Is the m-ticket stored in the app on the actual device or is it merely stored in the account? If it is in the account, presumably you can retrieve a m-ticket by logging into to your account on any device with the app.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

can also get the app on android

My Android phone won't download the Chiltern app, even though I can get the new XC app.

 

[Solent&Wessex]

9. Electronic Tickets
In some cases a Train Company, a travel agent or other authorised person may issue you
with a ticket where the details of the trains you are entitled to use, together with any
rights to goods or services supplied by another person, are stored only in electronic form.
Such a ticket is referred to in these Conditions as an Electronic Ticket. Any reference in
these Conditions to the term “ticket” includes an Electronic Ticket unless specifically
stated otherwise.

.....

24. Lost, stolen or mislaid tickets
A ticket is your evidence of your right to make a rail journey and it is your
responsibility to keep it safe. If you lose or mislay a ticket or a Smartcard or it is stolen, it
will not be replaced nor will any of the cost be refunded.

I think that is self explanatory really. Chiltern are under no obligation to replace your ticket at all.

 

[shinkansen1966]

Thanks for the advice.

Thought as much. I've lost my ticket.

 

[exile]

That makes no sense at all. surely the "ticket" still exists on the OP's account? The whole point of electronic tickets is that they cannot be "lost".

 

[LondonJohn]

I am surprised by this as I bought one of the Chiltern advance tickets and got it text to my phone and the battery had run out. I just gave my telephone number to the RPI at Marylebone station and he located the ticket and let me through.

This was a couple of years ago though.. not sure if their policies have changed.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

It is the passengers responsibility to show the ticket though, not the medium on which it is held (oyster excepted). If the RPI/Guard/other wants to chase it up then I'm sure they are free to do that, but there is no obligation for them to do so.

 

[AlterEgo]

Common sense and instinct tells me that Chiltern staff may be particularly helpful, given the huge fanfare about Mainline. They're trying to increase their market share on the Brum-London route quite aggressively - and they really can't afford not to pull it off IMO.

 

[cumfy]

Borrow or get another phone by 1/10.

 

[shinkansen1966]

Borrow or get another phone by 1/10.

Tonight, I should another iPhone. So we shall see if the m-ticket can be transferred from one phone to another.

 

[exile]

It seems TOCs go out of their way to sell customers the right to travel and then withdraw that right on technicalities. OP has paid for a journey, not a ticket.

 

[snail]

I don't see why they should do anything. Would they replace a ticket if I had my wallet stolen? Just claim for it on your insurance, as part of the phone's value.

 

[exile]

I don't see why they should do anything. Would they replace a ticket if I had my wallet stolen? Just claim for it on your insurance, as part of the phone's value.

But this is an electronic ticket, consisting of a row of zeroes and ones in a database. It's not a physical object. That's one of the advantages of them.

I used an electronic ticket in Spain last time I visited. I didn't lose it, but if I had done I could have printed it off again at any time. No doubt if it had been in the UK the TOC would have deleted it as soon as I printed it off once.

 

[shinkansen1966]

I don't see why they should do anything. Would they replace a ticket if I had my wallet stolen?

This is what Chiltern Railways told me. Nothing on their m-ticket FAQs about lost/stolen/damaged mobile phones.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

But this is an electronic ticket, consisting of a row of zeroes and ones in a database. It's not a physical object. That's one of the advantages of them....

As a passenger, it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to show you have paid the fare, not the train company's.

Chiltern have provided the ticket, regardless of how it is sent, and it has been received, the TOC is no longer responsible for it's safety.

 

[exile]

As a passenger, it is YOUR RESPONSIBILITY to show you have paid the fare, not the train company's.

Chiltern have provided the ticket, regardless of how it is sent, and it has been received, the TOC is no longer responsible for it's safety.

So the TOCs are trying to enforce 19th century terms and conditions to 21st century technology.

 

[snail]

But they know they have sent you the ticket. If they refuse to supply the service you have ordered AND PAID FOR (I emphasise this given that so many manage to travel without this small detail), which is, to transport you from A to B, anywhere else but TOC land they would be in trouble.

The same argument applies to paper tickets collected from a TVM. My point still stands, they wouldn't allow you to collect a duplicate ticket if you lost it after collection.

As for 'anywhere else but TOC land' what about theatre or event tickets? Lose one of them and generally speaking you are stuffed, even though you may have a credit card or online booking receipt.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

So the TOCs are trying to enforce 19th century terms and conditions to 21st century technology.

No "trying" about it!

You have the option of "21st century" tickets or "19th century" tickets, they have the same restrictions, conditions, terms and responsibilities, just as it should be.

 

[radamfi]

We all know that the regulations for book ahead tickets require physical receipt in the shape of a paper ticket or m-ticket that cannot be reproduced. Similarly, e-tickets need the original bank card used to pay for the ticket so if the card is lost then the e-ticket has no value. The question is, should these regulations be changed so that in the event of loss alternative arrangements can be made in the passenger's favour?

Megatrain and Italian Railways only require the reservation number to be presented. Why are they happy to do things this way? Why don't they take a no tolerance attitude to lost physical evidence on single train validity tickets? There must be a rationale for either stance.

One possible reason is that there is an administrative cost in keeping a record of reservation numbers so by saying 'tough, you've lost your ticket', TOCs don't incur this cost and probably extra revenue in the passenger buying a new ticket. On the other hand, this could lead to bad customer feeling leading to lost revenue in the future as the passenger chooses not to take the train on future trips.

 

[Bungle73]

No "trying" about it!

You have the option of "21st century" tickets or "19th century" tickets, they have the same restrictions, conditions, terms and responsibilities, just as it should be.

Then what's the advantage of having an electronic ticket?

 

[hairyhandedfool]

Erm....It's....Erm....Well....erm....No idea, but who cares because now your phone/music player/games console/web surfing device/book/shopping list/etc can now be your ticket, isn't it great!
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

.... One possible reason is that there is an administrative cost in keeping a record of reservation numbers so by saying 'tough, you've lost your ticket', TOCs don't incur this cost and probably extra revenue in the passenger buying a new ticket. On the other hand, this could lead to bad customer feeling leading to lost revenue in the future as the passenger chooses not to take the train on future trips.

Is there a particular reason that a TOC should provide extra tickets (or protection for the original ticket) just because the fare payer can't look after it?

 

[Bungle73]

I've tried looking at Chiltern Railways' ticket FAQ page to see if it says anything that might help, but it doesn't work; you click on a question and nothing happens! :roll:

 

[radamfi]

Is there a particular reason that a TOC should provide extra tickets (or protection for the original ticket) just because the fare payer can't look after it?

It depends on how important future business is. It could be argued that trains are busy enough as it is so if the passenger goes by car instead in future then that doesn't matter. Many would say that trains are just a business and can choose to turn away business as they please and they are not responsible for cutting congestion or saving the environment.

On the other hand, it can be seen from Ryanair that limited customer service can mean a lower cost of operation and therefore lower fares and more bums on seats. If the TOC saves the cost of good customer service (for example, by helping passengers with lost tickets), then they can offer cheaper fares in the first place. This theory assumes that more passengers are gained from lower fares than those lost because of poor customer service.

In short, the railway has to decide whether it is more like Ryanair or more like M&S.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

So the question is, would you pay more to have the "safety net" of a replacement ticket?

The fact is that *most* people want cheaper fares and I'd wager they don't often (if at all) lose their tickets (or have them stolen).