Old Hill Bank
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http://www.londonmidland.com/news/l...n-midland-and-for-first-transpennine-express/
On the LM website today
On the LM website today
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New 350s for TPE and LM
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DarloRich
Veteran Member
Seinsible that they go for Desiro - it will alllow for fleet wide integration.
On whihc services are the new LM train to be used? In to and out of Euston or on the more northern runs?
On whihc services are the new LM train to be used? In to and out of Euston or on the more northern runs?
Lampshade
Established Member
I imagine they'll go on Crewe services where the extra top speed will have more use.
BlythPower
Member
It'll be interesting to see if the ones which stay with LM long term are for strengthening/increasing services or for replacement of the 323s...
sprinterguy
Veteran Member
321s you mean, surely? Eight new Desiros would be nowhere near enough to replace LMs' twenty six 323s.
The delivery of the eight new LM units strikes me as the logical replacement for LMs' seven(?) 321s.
jonesy3001
Established Member
Does that mean the LM 323s will go to Northern to join the rest of the fleet, when the OHL work is done?
sprinterguy
Veteran Member
Only if London Midland were to get a much bigger order of Desiros than that specified at the moment...
Northern should be receiving 319s cascaded from Thameslink for the North West electrification (Unless a more complex series of cascades involving the 319s in the south is effected), not 323s from LM.
Who says they are replacing anything? LM website says:
It is expected that approximately 32 of the new vehicles (probably in 8 x 4-car unit formation) will be for use in expanding London Midlands existing fleet of electric multiple units to provide additional capacity on London Midlands services.
my bold
sprinterguy
Veteran Member
I know that is what it states, it is just my opinion that eight new Desiros would be a very tidy replacement for LMs' small micro-fleet of 321s. Plus there's no knowing whether its' just TOC speal or not and whether 8 Desiros to replace seven 321s counts as the expansion of the fleet. Just speculation.
London_Midland
Member
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Full details will be available in due course, but faster, extra trains will enable us to address capacity and pathing issues from London. The 321s will remain unless further additional trains can be procured.
LNW-GW Joint
Veteran Member
People on here know the very logical reasons, but it will be interesting seeing how Hammond and Villiers spin the award of yet another contract to Siemens.
I bet they are not keen to stand up and shout about it.
LM give a surprising amount of detail for a deal still only at the preferred supplier stage.
I wonder what is implied in the comments about the interior design of the TPE units?
This sounds like they will be "more inter-city than 350/1".
I bet they are not keen to stand up and shout about it.
LM give a surprising amount of detail for a deal still only at the preferred supplier stage.
I wonder what is implied in the comments about the interior design of the TPE units?
This sounds like they will be "more inter-city than 350/1".
185
On Moderation
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Yay! Lets buy some trains without putting the wires up yet!!
Fail.
Fail.
Lampshade
Established Member
Isn't electrification to Newton-le-Willows to be completed by the end of 2013?
DarloRich
Veteran Member
thanks - i thought they might be for Eustoin services.
I got a 321 out of Euston last night. It made a nice change.
I guess there wasnt enougth cash to get the extra units to allow a 100% desiro fleet. That must be an annoyance.
the sniper
Established Member
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Indeed. Here's hoping the mainstream press don't hear about it, as it'll only give them a further opportunity to display their ignorance...
Well seeing as there is some question as to whether or not the new trains will actually be in service in time for the wires I'm not sure how it's a fail. It's more like "New wires and no trains to use them yet".
northwichcat
Veteran Member
This bit is good to see:
Negotiations with the preferred supplier in respect of the units destined for the Manchester to Scotland service are likely to include certain interior design changes which reflect the longer distance journey patterns on this route.
I think they should do the LM 8 in the same type and then put those on to the Liverpool-Birmingham route, leaving the 350s on that route currently for other routes.
Negotiations with the preferred supplier in respect of the units destined for the Manchester to Scotland service are likely to include certain interior design changes which reflect the longer distance journey patterns on this route.
I think they should do the LM 8 in the same type and then put those on to the Liverpool-Birmingham route, leaving the 350s on that route currently for other routes.
150222
Member
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The 321's won't go unless 350's can be cleared on the st albans abbey line.
Chris125
Established Member
You have to laugh - normally the DfT shout from the rooftops about new train orders, instead its left to the TOC's website.
Chris
Chris
185
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Agreed .... if it is merged, thats one heck of a lot of stations from Euston to Glasgow.
As for my earlier comment, I have genuine doubts that NR can get the wires up on Chat Moss in two years. Things don't happen as fast nowadays, the ECML went up in comparitive light speed 20 years ago.
As for my earlier comment, I have genuine doubts that NR can get the wires up on Chat Moss in two years. Things don't happen as fast nowadays, the ECML went up in comparitive light speed 20 years ago.
northwichcat
Veteran Member
They only need to do half of Chat Moss by December 2013. If the units are arriving in the Autumn then I would have thought the drivers can learn to sign them on bits already electrified.
But isnt the St Albans Abbey line set to go over to Tram Train operation anyway in the myths of the near future?
As for the contract awarding - Good! About time too! And hopefully by the sound of the description, they will be more of a 350/1 Interior design than a 350/2 (Though for such a longer distance route, 444s would have potentially have been more ideal, but cant complain too much - 4 cars instead of 3 with corridors to double up services) And yes, it certainlly will be interesting to see if it gets any press coverage - no doubt something like the RMT union / Gutter Press will call it unfair and complain that its not a fleet of cheap o stars :roll:
Lampshade
Established Member
Not as ludicrous as it sounds, extend the Crewe service to Wigan/Preston and portion work it with the Scotland TPE.
May take the best part of 6/7 hours but knowing LM they'd put a £15 OPS on it, I can imagine they'd pack the train out.
northwichcat
Veteran Member
LM's dream revisions are:
* Birmingham-Liverpool service which runs semi-fast between Crewe and Liverpool to be diverted to Preston with additional call at Hartford.
* Euston-Crewe service diverted away from Stone and extended to Liverpool with calls at Hartford and Winsford.
* Manchester-Stoke service taken over from Northern and extended to Birmingham via Stone. (Combined with one of XC's Manchester-Bournemouth services diverted via Crewe as per WC RUS.)
They planned to make these changes from December 2012 but they were rejected until at least the next time the WCML timetable is fully recast.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
No route is going over to tram-train until the Sheffield-Rotherham service has been trialled.
Makes sense - especially the LM / Northern Stoke service takeover! Shame they've been rejected really! Just as LMs Liverpool service, Manchester to London would probably do quite well for London Midland & their advance fares!
Ah - Ok, cheers for clearing that up!
Which reminds me - and in true BBC style, Here's One I Made Earlier!
Attachments
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Whistler40145
Established Member
I agree with FTPE using Class 350 EMUs for Manchester Airport to Scotland services.
Is the Max Speed of 100 mph sufficient for paths north of Preston?
Also, I maybe being picky, but is the quality of Class 350 seating ok for such a long journey?
Is the Max Speed of 100 mph sufficient for paths north of Preston?
Also, I maybe being picky, but is the quality of Class 350 seating ok for such a long journey?
northwichcat
Veteran Member
The answers are in the above posts and on the link in the OP.
They should be revised to run at 110mph and "negotiations with the preferred supplier in respect of the units destined for the Manchester to Scotland service are likely to include certain interior design changes which reflect the longer distance journey patterns on this route."
WatcherZero
Established Member
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The rumour was they were looking to make these 350's 110mph capable. I believe todays press release confirmed it.
MidnightFlyer
Veteran Member
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At the minute it's fine, and in the future it shouldn't be too much of a problem either. Preston-Glasgow at 125mph is only 12 or so minutes longer than doing it at 100mph.
350 seating is fine by me (though the seats on /1s are better than those on the /2s; maybe it's just the layout that causes that though). Dare I that 350s have the best AC unit seating?
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