Delay repay compensation volume jumps 55% in a year

[David57]

I have an ongoing claim with LNWR from mid July, it took five weeks for them to acknowledge that they had received it by post, and said that they needed more information, quite how I can provide information when I have sent them the physical tickets?

Raised the matter with customer services, who say that they will get back to me, but have heard nothing.

It's a trifling sum of money, but I will keep on at them through principle.....

 

[A S Leib]

In what way?

Reducing the effort the claimant has* to put into things such as writing emails, as has been the case in sectors such as employment tribunals.

*I don't trust AI nearly enough to do less work than I would have had it not existed; I'm aware that that's far from a universal view.

 

[Essexman]

I travel regularly long distance on GWR, mostly between Torquay & London. This summer I had eight consecutive trips where one or both of outward or return was delayed by more than 15 minutes but no major delays. The most common cause of delay was connections at Newton Abbot (Exmouth trains) being late. It's nice to get a bit of money back but I feel 15 minutes delay doesn't really merit it. No other mode of transport offers such compensation.

 

[AlterEgo]

Reducing the effort the claimant has* to put into things such as writing emails, as has been the case in sectors such as employment tribunals.

*I don't trust AI nearly enough to do less work than I would have had it not existed; I'm aware that that's far from a universal view.

Delay repay is usually claimed by filling in a form online and attaching files, which is more difficult to get a consumer AI to do effortlessly. As others have pointed out the increase in payouts has been due to the railway suffering an unusual number of severe disruption incidents in the relevant period.

 

[brad465]

I think the argument about tax payers money is quite compelling. Is Delay Repay really justified? If so, does it need to be as generous as it is? if you drive and are extensively delayed due to road closures or road works, there is no compensation despite having paid road and fuel tax for the privilege. If you fly then you might get compensation if severely delayed and it was the airline's fault. It strikes me there may be better ways to spend public money than handouts for minor delays.

If Delay Repay incentivised TOCs to improve punctuality, it would be worthwhile, but often the delays are not entirely within their control, whether because an external factor causes it, or solutions to internal ones are not being permitted by the DfT (e.g. more reliable rolling stock, more staff, etc.).

 

[sharpener]

I've noticed a rise in the guards (and even drivers on DOO) telling us over the tannoy to claim delay repay when we hit 15 mins late.

Happened to me last Friday. Driver was clearly hacked off that the Cambridge - Brighton semi-fast was given the road just as he was arriving from King's Lynn https://www.railforums.co.uk/thread...-of-on-gtr-great-northern.283224/post-7981297.

ETA can't be bothered to claim, my onward journey to Bournemouth went to plan and it's quite a hassle for less than a tenner compo.

 

[Haywain]

I have an ongoing claim with LNWR from mid July, it took five weeks for them to acknowledge that they had received it by post, and said that they needed more information, quite how I can provide information when I have sent them the physical tickets?

Raised the matter with customer services, who say that they will get back to me, but have heard nothing.

It's a trifling sum of money, but I will keep on at them through principle.....

Without knowing what additional information is being asked for it's difficult to comment.

 

[Stephen98]

I've noticed a rise in the guards (and even drivers on DOO) telling us over the tannoy to claim delay repay when we hit 15 mins late.

I think it's part of the DFT mandated Service Quality Excellence regime criteria to announce how to claim delay repay when the threshold is met. Something that gets secret shopped on from time to time as well

 

[D1537]

I've claimed with LNER, TPE and TFW in the last 2 weeks and have got all the funds already. I'm still waiting for an Avanti from August...

 

[Horizon22]

Figure 3.1 has approval rates by Operator, 100% for Caledonian sleeper, but a whopping 57% not approved on Elizabeth line

Looks like the (part) nationalised railway, is worse than when more was private

TfL don't seem to pay out for various reasons that is not an issue elsewhere, so I imagine Elizabeth line and Overground are quite low.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: Yesterday at 19:41 ==

Actually, I mean that blame and attribution are the same thing. Delay attribution or delay blame, but either way the delay is the thing that is being dicussed.

Delay attribution is also incredibly useful for performance analysis too.

 

[Dr Hoo]

Delay attribution is also incredibly useful for performance analysis too.

Quite! Which is why British Rail (anybody remember them?) invented Delay Attribution in the first place.

How many times does this need to be explained on these Forums?

 

[andy33gmail]

Delay repay is usually claimed by filling in a form online and attaching files, which is more difficult to get a consumer AI to do effortlessly. As others have pointed out the increase in payouts has been due to the railway suffering an unusual number of severe disruption incidents in the relevant period.

I use ChatGPT to put together multiple tickets on the Great Northern delay repay form. But that’s just an adaptation to iPhones having rubbish image editing software & their process requiring multiple images but form wanting one

 

[Djgr]

Just to reiterate something thats in the first post

So the vast majority of the increase is an increase in delays. Not more people claiming. But more delays.

Indeed. Passing the buck reachs new levels. If it wasn't for all those pesky customers claiming...

 

[The exile]

Just to reiterate something thats in the first post

So the vast majority of the increase is an increase in delays. Not more people claiming. But more delays.

Or more delays that just tip over the threshold (which isn’t quite the same thing). In general, the only tangible difference between a 14 minute delay and one of 16 minutes is the eligibility for DR.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: Today at 08:10 ==

Delay repay is usually claimed by filling in a form online and attaching files, which is more difficult to get a consumer AI to do effortlessly. As others have pointed out the increase in payouts has been due to the railway suffering an unusual number of severe disruption incidents in the relevant period.

Not AI, but I’m sure the GWR process didn’t use to “remember” the ticket you’d already uploaded, which makes repeat claims on a season a lot less hassle. It does now.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Is Delay Repay really justified? If so, does it need to be as generous as it is?

Which bit of the scheme do you think is generous? The delay thresholds at which payment is made? The percentages of the fare paid used to calculate the payment?

And should this apply right up the chain? TOCs get delay payments from Network Rail for lots of things that aren’t really the fault of Network Rail.

I think the system is fair. You get a percentage of your money back if you’re late. Much better than the TfL system where you get told to swivel.

removing delays where the railway is not at fault, e.g. trespassers, suicides, health emergencies on the train etc

The operator may not be at fault, but I’m not quite so happy to agree that the railway aren’t at least partially at fault for trespassers and suicides. Trespassers get access to the railway because the railway don’t secure their premises properly. Even with suicides, similar applies; I honestly think there’s a direct correlation between reduced staffing at stations and the increased number of platform jumpers at suburban stations.

 

[The exile]

The operator may not be at fault, but I’m not quite so happy to agree that the railway aren’t at least partially at fault for trespassers and suicides. Trespassers get access to the railway because the railway don’t secure their premises properly. Even with suicides, similar applies; I honestly think there’s a direct correlation between reduced staffing at stations and the increased number of platform jumpers at suburban stations.

And also need to be reminded (by receipt of claims) of the consequences for the passenger of subsequent operating decisions - eg no trains other than the Trans Wilts serving Chippenham following an “incident” on the London side of Reading.

 

[JamieL]

Which bit of the scheme do you think is generous? The delay thresholds at which payment is made? The percentages of the fare paid used to calculate the payment?

And should this apply right up the chain? TOCs get delay payments from Network Rail for lots of things that aren’t really the fault of Network Rail.

I think the system is fair. You get a percentage of your money back if you’re late. Much better than the TfL system where you get told to swivel.

I am not sure the system is very fair to taxpayers. Should someone who suffers a mere 15 min delay really get a bonus payment from the taxpayer?

The operator may not be at fault, but I’m not quite so happy to agree that the railway aren’t at least partially at fault for trespassers and suicides. Trespassers get access to the railway because the railway don’t secure their premises properly. Even with suicides, similar applies; I honestly think there’s a direct correlation between reduced staffing at stations and the increased number of platform jumpers at suburban stations.

I don't agree with this. The railway spends far too much time and money fencing off the tracks and someone who trespasses has clearly made a decision to do so. In Europe railway tracks are often completely open and accessible by the public. The UK obsession with spending money to fencie off the tracks is wasteful and inefficient.

 

[Djgr]

Or more delays that just tip over the threshold (which isn’t quite the same thing). In general, the only tangible difference between a 14 minute delay and one of 16 minutes is the eligibility for DR.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: Today at 08:10 ==

Well it could be, but I'm not that there is any evidence to support this.

 

[AlterEgo]

I am not sure the system is very fair to taxpayers. Should someone who suffers a mere 15 min delay really get a bonus payment from the taxpayer?


I don't agree with this. The railway spends far too much time and money fencing off the tracks and someone who trespasses has clearly made a decision to do so. In Europe railway tracks are often completely open and accessible by the public. The UK obsession with spending money to fencie off the tracks is wasteful and inefficient.

We don't agree on much but on these we probably do. DR15 is extremely generous when benchmarked against peer railway systems and does not encourage passengers to come back. It's just free money for what is usually mild inconvenience. It may have been good politics ten years ago but in further straitened times where the taxpayer is underwriting the cost it does appear to be at risk of being rolled back.

 

[Djgr]

I am not sure the system is very fair to taxpayers. Should someone who suffers a mere 15 min delay really get a bonus payment from the taxpayer?

It's not bonus though. It is acknowledging that you didn't get what you paid for.

And whilst a 15 minute delay might often have trivial consequences, at times it might "break the camel's back" and trigger significant non insurable losses e.g. missed concert, missed holiday

 

[Haywain]

And whilst a 15 minute delay might often have trivial consequences, at times it might "break the camel's back" and trigger significant non insurable losses e.g. missed concert, missed holiday

If a 15 minute delay has such consequences, then the traveller simply hasn't allowed themselves enough time.

 

[andy33gmail]

It's not bonus though. It is acknowledging that you didn't get what you paid for.

And whilst a 15 minute delay might often have trivial consequences, at times it might "break the camel's back" and trigger significant non insurable losses e.g. missed concert, missed holiday

It has the effect of discounting unreliable operators such as Great Northern, which perhaps has a benefit in terms of reducing the risk of modal shift back to private transport

 

[AlterEgo]

And whilst a 15 minute delay might often have trivial consequences, at times it might "break the camel's back" and trigger significant non insurable losses e.g. missed concert, missed holiday

So what is £2.72 going to do there then?

 

[Goldfish62]

If the railways actually got their collective act together and provided a reliable service we wouldn't be here discussing this topic now.

 

[Tetchytyke]

It's just free money for what is usually mild inconvenience

DR15 came about because 20-30 minute delays are not “mild inconveniences” when we’re talking about commuters who are paying a lot of money for 20-30 minute commutes.

The political pressure was needed to make operators actually operate the service they said they would. Back in the days when I was commuting into London from Hemel it was literally one trip in ten which arrived on time. A good half were heading towards 10-15 minutes late; LM had no financial incentive to fix it, so they didn’t. I kept a spreadsheet.

Even back when it was a 30-minute threshold I was getting several hundred pounds back each year just through London Midland’s incompetence. And it was nearly always their fault. A common one was to cancel the Tring terminators, and with a 30-minute frequency why wouldn’t they? They save the cost of running the train and they don’t have to pay out a penny in compensation. Half an hour standing on Apsley station on a January morning was always a load of fun…not.

This is the thing to bear in mind: in isolation a 15-minute delay is no big deal. But when it is happening 3-4 times a week, as it did with me when I was commuting with LM, it is a big deal. On a bad week I’d be losing two hours a week to their incompetence.

It’s also not “free money”, it is compensation for the railway’s failure to deliver the service paid for. Delay Repay is tied to the amount paid for the ticket, so the compensation can’t exceed the amount actually paid to them in the first place.

 

[kkong]

Scotrail was pathetically slow 75.7% within target time

From Annex 2 of the report:

A change to ScotRail’s customer contact system resulted in a number of delay compensation claims being closed automatically. This occurred during April 2026 to March 2027 Period 2. These were historic claims that had remained open on the ScotRail system whilst awaiting information from the customer. The precise number of claims affected is unknown; however, it is likely that the closure of such claims contributed to the fall in the percentage of claims closed within 20 working days and the percentage of claims approved during Period 2 and Periods 1 to 4 evaluated in sections 2 and 3 of this publication.

 

[mmh]

This is the thing to bear in mind, though: in isolation a 15-minute delay is no big deal. But when it is happening 3-4 times a week, as it did with me when I was commuting with LM, it is a big deal. On a bad week I’d be losing two hours a week to their incompetence

And in many jobs you'd be on your way to being dismissed. But that's fine, because it's the railway and you should leave the house earlier and wait around for an hour before work.

 

[a_c_skinner]

Slightly off topic who actually pays delay repay? Obvs. it is HMG for a publicly run/owned service but for the rest. Under management contracts post COVID HMG gets all the ticket money so do they cough up for delay repay.

 

[Tetchytyke]

The railway spends far too much time and money fencing off the tracks and someone who trespasses has clearly made a decision to do so.

And the railway has made a financial decision not to put in sufficient fencing to prevent them from doing so. There’s a cost/benefit analysis to it, turning the entire network into a high security prison isn’t realistic or sensible. But the railway can’t leave their back door wide open and then try and claim they don’t share culpability if they get burgled.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: Today at 13:22 ==

And in many jobs you'd be on your way to being dismissed. But that's fine, because it's the railway and you should leave the house earlier and wait around for an hour before work.

Absolutely. If I turned up to work 15 minutes late every day for two weeks I’d be on the end of a stern talking to from my boss. In many jobs you lose an hour’s pay if you are 15 minutes late. But when the railway does it it’s just a “mild inconvenience” and everyone can just shrug their shoulders.

As I’ve edited my last post to say, London Midland always had a fondness for cancelling the Tring terminators which, at the time, were the only trains to serve the smaller inner-WCML stations. Under the old system they had every incentive to do so: they saved the cost of running the train and the passengers left waiting had absolutely no recourse against them.

Others have compared to the UK to other rail systems in Europe and used it to argue the UK is too generous. But I’ll tell you what: Deutsche Bahn wouldn’t offer such a terrible service if it cost them money when they delayed a train.

 

[JamesT]

Slightly off topic who actually pays delay repay? Obvs. it is HMG for a publicly run/owned service but for the rest. Under management contracts post COVID HMG gets all the ticket money so do they cough up for delay repay.

Ultimately it will be HMG. Delay Repay goes on the costs column and with the management contracts then HMG take all the revenue but pay all the costs.