York and north Yorkshire franchising

[Dwarfer1979]

For ENCTS, the question is generally around whether the service includes additional extra features. So a tour bus that offers a full audio guide to the sights doesn't have to accept free passes, but a regular service that just happens to use open-top buses but doesn't do anything different to other buses does have to accept them. I would expect a similar model to be used for inclusion in franchising. (Of course, it isn't going to be quite as simple as that, because P&R services are not statutorily included in ENCTS if the bus fare is deemed to include a contribution to the car parking arrangements, but they would undoubtedly be included in any franchise arrangements).

The actual wording is along the lines of whether the vehicle operating the service is part of the attraction itself so any open topper operated service could be covered which is why most are excluded from ENCTS schemes. The important bit to remember is that the operator doesn't get to determine if a route is in the ENCTS scheme if it is registered as a local bus service (which you would do to claim things like BSOG), it is entirely within the decision of the council to decide whether it should be included. There is also an option to exclude services where the fare is higher than the average bus fare which would also catch a number of these.

There is nothing to stop a Local Authority from including open top or tourist services within a franchise scheme but the council would have to justify expending money, resources and attention towards a service targeted at tourists over services for taxpayers when there are private operators willing to operate (though they could argue that if they are highly profitable that they bring in revenue to support wider services though highly seasonal services probably aren't as profitable as they appear once all the costs carried are properly factored in).

 

[Metroman62]

Would the open top bus on Scarborough front really be subject to franchising?

Shore

Would the open top bus on Scarborough front really be subject to franchising?

As well as running one of the open top services, Shoreline also run the 555 service from Scarborough to Filey. It’s not all year round, so I don’t know how that would fit in under franchising. It competes with East Yorkshire’s service 12 and 13. Interestingly, the 555 has been using an open top bus this past week which must have been fun in the rain!

 

[YorkRailFan]

As well as running one of the open top services, Shoreline also run the 555 service from Scarborough to Filey. It’s not all year round, so I don’t know how that would fit in under franchising. It competes with East Yorkshire’s service 12 and 13. Interestingly, the 555 has been using an open top bus this past week which must have been fun in the rain!

The 555 runs during the term time only. It is supplemented by the CoastCruiser (CC) which is an open top service during the school holidays. The CC does accept ENCTS for free travel though. East Yorkshire's 13 is also a seasonal service though does accept ENCTS for free travel and isn't run with open-top buses.

 

[SCH117X]

An obvious improvement IMO would be to run the Ripon-Northallerton service direct to Thirsk via the A61 and have a separate Ripon-Thirsk service via the existing route. NYCC, now NYC, have sat on monies to provide a peak am service to Ripon for years which splitting off the Ripon-Thirsk section could practically enable.

 

[YorkRailFan]

An obvious improvement IMO would be to run the Ripon-Northallerton service direct to Thirsk via the A61 and have a separate Ripon-Thirsk service via the existing route. NYCC, now NYC, have sat on monies to provide a peak am service to Ripon for years which splitting off the Ripon-Thirsk section could practically enable.

Ripon's Sunday service isn't great either. Apart from the 36, its just the Summer DalesBus network. Of course the 36 is a great service. I think having the 84 running on a Sunday to York could potentially work. The 84 runs every 2 hours or so between York & Ripon only serving Green Hammerton, Boroughbridge & Skelton-On-Ure. I think just having the 84 on a Sunday is sufficient (don't really need the 82/83 winding through the various hamlets on a Sunday) whilst benefiting Ripon and particularly Boroughbridge. Boroughbridge-Ripon is a flow that has improved significantly recently with it being hourly since November 2024 and always seems popular when I use it. You could run the 84 on a Sunday with only 1 bus, although it might not be exactly every 2 hours with just one bus.

 

[Bristol LHS]

An obvious improvement IMO would be to run the Ripon-Northallerton service direct to Thirsk via the A61 and have a separate Ripon-Thirsk service via the existing route. NYCC, now NYC, have sat on monies to provide a peak am service to Ripon for years which splitting off the Ripon-Thirsk section could practically enable.

isn’t this what happens with the 0810 X70? it runs direct from Busby Stoop to Ripon via the A61

I think there’s scope for some kind of rationalisation of the 70 and the 153, you’ve got two Northallerton-Thirsk services, both of which have twists and turns, there’s an opportunity to create something more attractive between them.