Can people just pay by card instead of using cash?

[DerekC]

That's quite a sweeping assumption. It brings one of those irregular verbs to mind - I like being paid by card, you like being paid by cash, he is a tax dodger

That's fair, but cash payment to avoid tax has always been a thing. One of my neighbours (a former chairman of a local parish council) is quite open about offering tradesmen payment in cash in exchange for a 20% discount (nudge nudge, wink wink) and recommending others to do the same. He just thinks I am stupid because I disapprove.

 

[AM9]

(slightly off topic but relevant to the recent posts here) Many years ago I lived in Cosham, and when selling my house, in a conversation with our eventual buyers, I mentioned that a verbal quote from a local plumbers for some plumbing in the house was stated to be £x - or X minus about 15% if paid in cash. The buyer said oooh, great, - I'm VAT inspector so I'll go along and see how good a deal I can get.
I don't know whether he did so can't say whether there was any karma.

 

[35B]

It is very, very likely in my mind that if cash is coming in and going out without being banked that at least some of it will not be properly taxed. It is very hard to prove it wasn't because the sums are not properly recorded.

It is proper business practice to bank all incoming funds so they are properly accounted for and taxed. Obviously cash can then be withdrawn if that's all a given supplier takes, but that's rare now I'd think.

I'm entirely familiar with good cash handling practice, and also well aware that cash lends itself to tax evasion. I also know that, in small businesses, quite a lot happens without going through formal process.

My problem is the leap of logic from that statement to the assertion of tax evasion. There are plenty of ways that the taxman can corroborate data, and put people under pressure - the audit trail is often surprisingly detailed, and cross referenceable.

An aside. A friend was getting some work done 20-odd years ago. They had a personalised plate, ending in "VAT". The price was agreed (with no hint of dodginess), and the tradesman then saw the car. He apparently went pale as he thought that it signalled that he was dealing with a tax inspector.

 

[muz379]

That's fair, but cash payment to avoid tax has always been a thing. One of my neighbours (a former chairman of a local parish council) is quite open about offering tradesmen payment in cash in exchange for a 20% discount (nudge nudge, wink wink) and recommending others to do the same. He just thinks I am stupid because I disapprove.

It does always surprise me how relaxed and even complicit many people are in VAT evasion when they are so disapproving of other sorts of tax evasion.

 

[Bantamzen]

that REALLY annoys me. I have to do the same for non league football clubs. I am sure it is just about getting data for a mailing list and increasing digital footprint size! The most annoying thing is the ticklet almost always comes as as google wallet file!

It's definitely a thing at non-league clubs, I've been to several with my club for pre-season games and they've almost always asked you to book through a local app, or register via their websites. However for away league and cup games, we can almost always book via our club's site via Ticketmaster and get them via email and load into Google / Apple Wallet.

 

[JamesT]

It's definitely a thing at non-league clubs, I've been to several with my club for pre-season games and they've almost always asked you to book through a local app, or register via their websites. However for away league and cup games, we can almost always book via our club's site via Ticketmaster and get them via email and load into Google / Apple Wallet.

I was slightly surprised booking a game away at Charlton that I've actually been posted a paper ticket.

 

[najaB]

My problem is the leap of logic from that statement to the assertion of tax evasion. There are plenty of ways that the taxman can corroborate data, and put people under pressure - the audit trail is often surprisingly detailed, and cross referenceable.

Indeed. I'm sure that for at least some portion of businesses, any avoidance of VAT is a happy side-effect of doing trade in cash rather than its express purpose.

 

[Merle Haggard]

That's fair, but cash payment to avoid tax has always been a thing. One of my neighbours (a former chairman of a local parish council) is quite open about offering tradesmen payment in cash in exchange for a 20% discount (nudge nudge, wink wink) and recommending others to do the same. He just thinks I am stupid because I disapprove.

He's either trying to drive a hard bargain or not numerate.

Removing the 20% VAT from a charge reduces it by 16 & 2/3 %

 

[Cdd89]

He's either trying to drive a hard bargain or not numerate.

Removing the 20% VAT from a charge reduces it by 16 & 2/3 %

In the hypothetical case the tradesperson is not necessarily just saving VAT. There's income tax and NI they're potentially fiddling too.

That said I don't see the issue with offering cash in exchange for a discount; the recipient's tax affairs are none of the customer's business. I've often been asked to pay by cash with no offer of a discount, if the recipient has a preferred payment method I think it's fair to attach terms. By analogy, if I ask for a 30% discount from a rubbish clearence company, they can't blame me if they then dump my rubbish on the side of a road because the discount ate into their costs of responsible disposal.

 

[Bald Rick]

By analogy, if I ask for a 30% discount from a rubbish clearence company, they can't blame me if they then dump my rubbish on the side of a road because the discount ate into their costs of responsible disposal.

The disposal company can’t blame you… but the law can and you could be prosecuted, with an unlimited fine and criminal record if convicted.

 

[AM9]

The disposal company can’t blame you… but the law can and you could be prosecuted, with an unlimited fine and criminal record if convicted.

I agree, unless you have a receipt from the disposal company showing their licence number you are liable to be prosecuted if any evidence of the waste material itself can be linked to you.
The members of the public that pay these fly-by-night dumpers are primarily responsible for the refuse that litters the country.

 

[Cdd89]

You are both of course correct, not the best example. Fortunately I'm not planning to book any cowboy rubbish collection services soon

 

[sprunt]

Where are these car parks that only accept payment by app? I'm certain I've never been to one, they invariably take contactless payment in my experience.

 

[DarloRich]

Where are these car parks that only accept payment by app? I'm certain I've never been to one, they invariably take contactless payment in my experience.

the one outside my office......................

 

[WesternLancer]

Where are these car parks that only accept payment by app? I'm certain I've never been to one, they invariably take contactless payment in my experience.

I was in Eastbourne town centre in the summer - pretty sure app payment was all that was offered on the council run (I believe) off street car parks I tried to use - ie no coin or card payment option both of which I could have easily used.

Was also at the car park at Bowness on Windermere (near the marina), to get the ferry across as a foot passenger, and think that had app only and the driver I was with - who had the relevant app - couldn't make a payment due to no or limited signal on the phone they had. If it still had a card payment facility that wasn't working on the day.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Where are these car parks that only accept payment by app? I'm certain I've never been to one, they invariably take contactless payment in my experience.

Isn't it the case that that applies to most Northern operated station car parks now, though one can also pay by phone and text (RingGo offers both of these)?

 

[Bikeman78]

I had quick look on RingGo's website and they say that you can pay over the phone as well as by using the app.

Have you heard of the National Parking Platform: https://www.npp.org.uk/ - this seems to be a step in that direction.

The only place I have attempted to pay for parking by phone is Newport station. It took way longer than paying at a machine on site. I can't even remember why I used the phone on that occasion. Some remote car parks have no phone or internet signal.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Oct 2026 ==

NatWest allow me to set a contactless limit as little as £5 (or I can even just 'freeze' them altogether), and yes they do send a notification to my phone literally the second a transaction is made (in that I can be at the cash machine making a withdrawal and the notification will pop up before the cash has even been dispensed!)

I only discovered this a few days ago. It doesn't look like my bank does this yet. I've had a look through the app and can't find an option to switch on alerts.

 

[DIW]

Where are these car parks that only accept payment by app? I'm certain I've never been to one, they invariably take contactless payment in my experience.

The New Forest, in Hampshire. The majority of the Forestry Commission Forestry England car parks are app/phone only, with mention made of the location of the nearest pay machine. Parking for Forestry England members is included in the membership. Here's a picture of the sign at Nomansland:

 

[AlterEgo]

The New Forest, in Hampshire. The majority of the Forestry Commission Forestry England car parks are app/phone only, with mention made of the location of the nearest pay machine. Parking for Forestry England members is included in the membership. Here's a picture of the sign at Nomansland:

View attachment 212903

But this is not an app only car park. You can pay by phone too.

There are a few genuinely app only car parks though. They're quite obnoxious if you don't have signal.

 

[WelshBluebird]

There are a few genuinely app only car parks though. They're quite obnoxious if you don't have signal.

But even then the sign in the post you replied to literally tells you what to do if you don't have signal.

 

[Bletchleyite]

The main issue with phone-only car parks being possible is that one now has to pay for far more car parks than previously, because when a machine was needed it was generally not economic to provide one in smaller car parks so they were free.

 

[Vexed]

The New Forest, in Hampshire. The majority of the Forestry Commission Forestry England car parks are app/phone only, with mention made of the location of the nearest pay machine. Parking for Forestry England members is included in the membership. Here's a picture of the sign at Nomansland:

View attachment 212903

The main issue with phone-only car parks being possible is that one now has to pay for far more car parks than previously, because when a machine was needed it was generally not economic to provide one in smaller car parks so they were free.

Just for some more local context, all the Forestry England New Forest car parks used to be free. Charging is a recent addition and I'm sure Bletchleyite is correct that it's only feasible because of app payments.

Foresty England said it was so they could raise money for maintenance of the car parks - quite a few of them are pretty bad at the moment so hopefully they do pull through on this.

 

[BuhSnarf]

That was part of it, but it also meant less brand confusion. Visa completely retired the Electron sub-brand a couple of years ago.

Visa Electron was rebranded as Visa Debit "Online" in the UK around the 2010s, however, many countries remained users of Visa Electron up until it's eventual demise in 2024.

Visa Debit Online was essentially Electron with less obvious branding for the customer and usually only disclosed in the bank's own systems. It allowed more transactions but still capped a lot such as from memory recurrent payments and offline transactions - hence the name.

In relation to car parking apps. I only have two apps RingGo and Paybyphone. And they pretty much cover nearly every car park I ever park at. I can't remember the last time I had to use another app, I think it might have been ACPOA or something like that when I was in France. Also with the introduction of the NPP many car parks are actually multi-app. The ability to extend my parking time whilst not at the car park is a game changer, I now just pay for the shortest I'll likely be there and top up if I decided to stay out longer whereas previously I'd have maybe paid till the end of the day "just in case" and end up wasting money.