Birmingham New Street the worst UK station?

[zwk500]

What about for services with a short dwell time? The lifts are painfully slow and the escalators often out of order - struggling with luggage until the train is at the platform means you're at risk of missing your train - or on services with more coaches, end up a considerable distance from your booked seat.

You go down a few minutes before the train is due, there's no expectation people will be held on the upper level until the platform has cleared like at termini.

I think those are fire exits. There can only be one admittance desk to the lounge so having two entrances to a lounge will always be problematic.

Why can there only be one admittance desk? Putting a 2nd desk in would increase the staffing requirement but would hardly seem to completely break the operatability of the lounge.

 

[AlterEgo]

Why can there only be one admittance desk? Putting a 2nd desk in would increase the staffing requirement but would hardly seem to completely break the operatability of the lounge.

It would make the lounge more than twice as expensive to staff which would probably make it unviable.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It would make the lounge more than twice as expensive to staff which would probably make it unviable.

An option would be a doorbell with a camera, and a scanning device for e-tickets alongside it. It used to be like that at Euston, may still be.

 

[Merle Haggard]

First class lounge use there will always b

There aren't any "lounge rules", you can go where you want. It isn't Euston.

The system is designed for the best passenger experience if you don't wait on the platform, that's all.

I was using the term on the basis of strong opinions expressed on this thread. Sort of ironically.

e a minority pursuit anyway. The service to London is frequent so most people just won't bother with it.

Avanti trains go to the North as well. And the lounge can supply mocha.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Avanti trains go to the North as well.

They do, but the vast majority of custom is to/from London.

And the lounge can supply mocha.

Yeah, I suppose you might as well have a free coffee as pay for one, but if you're travelling first class (rather than Standard Premium) you probably have enough money that four quid for a coffee is moot and you'll probably take the most convenient option rather than the cheapest.

 

[SLC001]

As the original poster, I have had a nice apologetic email from Network Rail recognising the problems we had. I understand signage will be improved and he confirmed, although I would not have known it that the barrier staff would have let us back in - and out again I hope! The lack of litter bins is due to security concerns. What a society we live in. It still feels wrong to leave my rubbish on LNWR trains for someone else to clear up.
We don't often travel by train but recently travelled to London and experienced the delights of Euston, Marylebone and Victoria. Everything there was logical, informative and allowed us to relax, go to the toilet and travel as necessary. It is that phrase "don't often" that is important in the context here - many posters have experience of New Street and other stations and their particular ways of doing things. The first time traveller doesn't have that advantage.
The other thing I have find at New Street is that I cannot easily find the way to catch the buses. Indeed Northampton could do it better but at least there is a bus that says bus number xx is due to arrive at wherever in 10 minutes time. But where is "wherever"? Back to the app - unless you have 2 minutes to make it. Anyhow, I don't wish to have a go at Northampton, it is alright - if it doesn't flood......
My son commutes to Euston regularly. Least said about his experiences the better but probably mirrors many others on this forum.

Finally, we found that in certain areas of London - e.g. Euston Road and on Victoria Station - we had breathing difficulties which we don't normally have. It felt like Chlorine or something like that. Maybe electrical or ozone? It started me coughing uncontrollably and I do not suffer from asthma. The weather was dry and sunny, early spring and the air quality map in these area showed that the quality was average as it was in other areas where we had no problems. Anyone experienced this? Curious. Bizarre even.

Well done Network Rail - now please follow it through.

 

[Bletchleyite]

It still feels wrong to leave my rubbish on LNWR trains for someone else to clear up.

There are bins on board all WMT and Avanti trains. Put it in the bin while still on board, do not leave it lying around.

The only trains I recall never having bins are Merseyrail and London Underground ones but I seem to recall the new Merseyrail ones do.

Also, under no circumstances, even if there is no bin, do you leave your rubbish for someone else to clear up unless explicitly instructed to do so. You take it with you until you find a bin, or you take it home if necessary. And if that's an imposition you don't consume things that produce it.

 

[zwk500]

There are bins on board all WMT and Avanti trains. Put it in the bin while still on board, do not leave it lying around.

The only trains I recall never having bins are Merseyrail ones but I seem to recall the new ones do.

Also, under no circumstances, even if there is no bin, do you leave your rubbish for someone else to clear up unless explicitly instructed to do so. You take it with you until you find a bin, or you take it home if necessary. And if that's an imposition you don't consume things that produce it.

Not disputing any of this, but New Street should absolutely have bins on the concourses.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Not disputing any of this, but New Street should absolutely have bins on the concourses.

It should yes, and most stations now do have the "clear bag in a ring" type bins in which hiding bad stuff isn't really possible. It's probably also a big enough station to have a couple of roving cleaners to give stuff to.

But in the end (I know you personally are agreeing ) if there's no bin you carry your litter until there is - I have a very strong view on littering, bin or no - it's just laziness and has a massive effect on the quality of an area.

 

[zwk500]

It should yes, and most stations now do have the "clear bag in a ring" type bins in which hiding bad stuff isn't really possible. It's probably also a big enough station to have a couple of roving cleaners to give stuff to.

I have before put rubbish in the roving cleaners' carts when opportunity arises, although there's never one around when you need it and loads about when you don't...
I've also asked a member of staff about bins before and he kindly took my rubbish off me to put in the staff room bin.

But in the end (I know you personally are agreeing ) if there's no bin you carry your litter until there is - I have a very strong view on littering, bin or no - it's just laziness and has a massive effect on the quality of an area.

Yes, completely agree with this.

 

[Dr Hoo]

As the original poster, I have had a nice apologetic email from Network Rail recognising the problems we had. I understand signage will be improved and he confirmed, although I would not have known it that the barrier staff would have let us back in - and out again I hope! The lack of litter bins is due to security concerns. What a society we live in. It still feels wrong to leave my rubbish on LNWR trains for someone else to clear up.
We don't often travel by train but recently travelled to London and experienced the delights of Euston, Marylebone and Victoria. Everything there was logical, informative and allowed us to relax, go to the toilet and travel as necessary. It is that phrase "don't often" that is important in the context here - many posters have experience of New Street and other stations and their particular ways of doing things. The first time traveller doesn't have that advantage.
The other thing I have find at New Street is that I cannot easily find the way to catch the buses. Indeed Northampton could do it better but at least there is a bus that says bus number xx is due to arrive at wherever in 10 minutes time. But where is "wherever"? Back to the app - unless you have 2 minutes to make it. Anyhow, I don't wish to have a go at Northampton, it is alright - if it doesn't flood.....<SNIP>

It is really good to hear from the Original Poster again and to learn that you have have some positive engagement with Network Rail. I hope that you will be able to enjoy less stressful visits to Birmingham in future.

On the subject of bus termini, Birmingham has always been a bit of a disaster, going back to tram and trolleybus days. They were never able to properly penetrate the centre. The famous 1930s One Way System (with about five separate ‘loops’) did nothing to help. Subsequently the 1960s Inner Ring Road, progressive pedestrianisation since the 1970s and most recently the ‘return’ of trams to some streets that they had never previously used has led to a diaspora.
There is a list and map of bus routes on the station and on line but some of the nearest stops for any given route are 10 minutes or more away, especially for a stranger to the city or person with mobility problems and/or luggage. Plus bus is, however, available.

 

[Wolfie]

It is really good to hear from the Original Poster again and to learn that you have have some positive engagement with Network Rail. I hope that you will be able to enjoy less stressful visits to Birmingham in future.

On the subject of bus termini, Birmingham has always been a bit of a disaster, going back to tram and trolleybus days. They were never able to properly penetrate the centre. The famous 1930s One Way System (with about five separate ‘loops’) did nothing to help. Subsequently the 1960s Inner Ring Road, progressive pedestrianisation since the 1970s and most recently the ‘return’ of trams to some streets that they had never previously used has led to a diaspora.
There is a list and map of bus routes on the station and on line but some of the nearest stops for any given route are 10 minutes or more away, especially for a stranger to the city or person with mobility problems and/or luggage. Plus bus is, however, available.

Plusbus is a bit of a mixed blessing in the West Midlands. Seriously impressive scope, including the trams, but the cost was massively increased recently.

 

[blimmo]

There are bins on board all WMT and Avanti trains.

Whenever I have had rubbish to dispose of on LNWR or Avanti trains I have found either the bins are too small or full.

 

[mmh]

It's unusual not to see cleaning staff with a big bin bag on Avanti trains, particularly if you're nearing the terminus of a journey.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Whenever I have had rubbish to dispose of on LNWR or Avanti trains I have found either the bins are too small or full.

Then take it with you.

It's unusual not to see cleaning staff with a big bin bag on Avanti trains, particularly if you're nearing the terminus of a journey.

Yes, if you see someone doing that then it's fair enough to ask them what you should do with it. They may give you permission to leave it if they're about to clean that part of the train or take it from you there and then. But don't leave it without ensuring it will be collected.

 

[tfw756rider]

The fans are a big issue, but they would barely ever be used if we got rid of stinking Voyagers. Classes 170, 172 and 196/197 don't kick out anywhere near as much filth being shorter and in the latter case much newer and compliant to better emissions standards.

It's almost like a very significant part of the problem with New St and the wider rail network is Voyagers, and that scrapping them in favour of longer bi-mode units would solve a LOT of problems.

172s (not that they're any more than substitute units at New Street) are actually lower-emitting than 170s.

172s are Euro Stage IIIA-compliant, and them having switched to the MTU 1800 Series engine (but without any emissions equipment) achieve it just by the engine itself running cleaner.

Then the 196s are Euro Stage IIIB achieved with AdBlue, and then the 197s are Euro Stage V (5) achieved with AdBlue and particulate filtration.

It's not just the length of Voyagers, they're actually higher-emitting than 170s anyway because they prioritised having engines capable of powering the train to 125mph over emissions, before rail emissions standards for diesel multiple units started to come in and then tighten to a point where they were effective.

 

[blimmo]

Then take it with you.

I do. I'm just saying that "there are bins on the trains" has never been able to reduce my desire for bins at the station.

 

[Robin1966]

Speaking as a regular user of Bristol Temple Meads, I don't mind it at all, apart from the fact that it's a bit of a wind tunnel at times. There's always delicious smells coming from the pasty shop in the subway, which is richly decorated with various murals showing aspects of the station's history. There's also a small newsagent down there and the platforms are well signposted, so it is relatively easy to tell which trains are leaving from which platform relatively quickly. There's a good snack room on one of the island platforms serving good coffee and confectionery and such, a great pub on the main platform, as well as a good newsagent (formerly Smiths) and the smaller exit from the station - facing the new office blocks, where the older Brunel station approach used to be - is about five minutes away from a big concourse where there is a Wetherspoons. This side of the station is great for accessing the station if you want to avoid the busy concourse out front (which actually is really handy for picking up a bus quickly to get into Bristol city centre). Admittedly, a bit of local familiarity with the station helps.

 

[Straus]

Speaking as a regular user of Bristol Temple Meads, I don't mind it at all, apart from the fact that it's a bit of a wind tunnel at times. There's always delicious smells coming from the pasty shop in the subway, which is richly decorated with various murals showing aspects of the station's history. There's also a small newsagent down there and the platforms are well signposted, so it is relatively easy to tell which trains are leaving from which platform relatively quickly. There's a good snack room on one of the island platforms serving good coffee and confectionery and such, a great pub on the main platform, as well as a good newsagent (formerly Smiths) and the smaller exit from the station - facing the new office blocks, where the older Brunel station approach used to be - is about five minutes away from a big concourse where there is a Wetherspoons. This side of the station is great for accessing the station if you want to avoid the busy concourse out front (which actually is really handy for picking up a bus quickly to get into Bristol city centre). Admittedly, a bit of local familiarity with the station helps.

It's not very handy for getting to the office in Birmingham though

 

[LPJOHN]

There are bins on board all WMT and Avanti trains. Put it in the bin while still on board, do not leave it lying around.

The only trains I recall never having bins are Merseyrail and London Underground ones but I seem to recall the new Merseyrail ones do.

Also, under no circumstances, even if there is no bin, do you leave your rubbish for someone else to clear up unless explicitly instructed to do so. You take it with you until you find a bin, or you take it home if necessary. And if that's an imposition you don't consume things that produce it.

Merseyrail 507/508 had two litter bins in each carriage, I think they installed after one of their refurbishments.

you can spot one if you scroll down on this page, on my iPad it’s the second photo from the bottom. It’s under one of the seats on the left.

Class 507

507001

units-library.weebly.com

 

[styles]

An option would be a doorbell with a camera, and a scanning device for e-tickets alongside it. It used to be like that at Euston, may still be.

It is like that at Crewe.

 

[Coleridge]

Speaking as a regular user of Bristol Temple Meads, I don't mind it at all, apart from the fact that it's a bit of a wind tunnel at times. There's always delicious smells coming from the pasty shop in the subway, which is richly decorated with various murals showing aspects of the station's history. There's also a small newsagent down there and the platforms are well signposted, so it is relatively easy to tell which trains are leaving from which platform relatively quickly. There's a good snack room on one of the island platforms serving good coffee and confectionery and such, a great pub on the main platform, as well as a good newsagent (formerly Smiths) and the smaller exit from the station - facing the new office blocks, where the older Brunel station approach used to be - is about five minutes away from a big concourse where there is a Wetherspoons. This side of the station is great for accessing the station if you want to avoid the busy concourse out front (which actually is really handy for picking up a bus quickly to get into Bristol city centre). Admittedly, a bit of local familiarity with the station helps.

As an occasional user of Temple Meads (only when I'm heading for the airport, really), I find it windswept and depressingly shabby. It's also not always very obvious, to a casual passenger, where the stairs are. And I don't understand why so many short trains have to stop at the furthest end of the platform from the stairs, beyond the canopy.

 

[xotGD]

The service to London is frequent so most people just won't bother with it.

If you have an Advance, you might have a bit of a fester, and you'll want to be at the station in plenty of time. You might also want to use the lounge for a work Teams call ahead of your train.

if you're travelling first class (rather than Standard Premium) you probably have enough money that four quid for a coffee

If you've paid extra for first class, you'll want to get full value for your money. Including the complementaries.

And if it is your employer funding first class travel, this isn't related to the wealth of the passenger.

 

[Robin1966]

It's not very handy for getting to the office in Birmingham though

Indeed. I was replying to a comment about Bristol TM on this thread, but hit the quite button not the reply button and then couldn't work out why my reply didn't highlight the post I was responding to (I haven't actually posted on here for years I have to say).

 

[Straus]

Indeed. I was replying to a comment about Bristol TM on this thread, but hit the quite button not the reply button and then couldn't work out why my reply didn't highlight the post I was responding to (I haven't actually posted on here for years I have to say).

sorry, couldn't resist!

Have to say I like BTM too, especially like the coloured houses up on the hill

 

[xotGD]

Have to say I like BTM too

BTM is the IATA code for Bert Mooney Airport in Butte, Montana, United States. So you're a fan of the airport then?

 

[Straus]

BTM is the IATA code for Bert Mooney Airport in Butte, Montana, United States. So you're a fan of the airport then?

Touché

 

[zwk500]

BTM is the IATA code for Bert Mooney Airport in Butte, Montana, United States. So you're a fan of the airport then?

And the CRS code for Bristol TM is BRI. Although in this instance BTM doesn't appear to be a CRS code (currently).

 

[Kite159]

If you think Birmingham New Street is bad, Bristol Temple Meads is by far worse. A station unfit for the modern era with stupidly narrow staircases and endless platform changes

 

[yorksrob]

If you think Birmingham New Street is bad, Bristol Temple Meads is by far worse. A station unfit for the modern era with stupidly narrow staircases and endless platform changes

Actually Temple Meads is a wonderful place to catch a train.

Yes, the subway does get a bit crowded, however the platforms are open air, yet have plenty of rain cover. They also have toilets, cafe's and waiting rooms on the platform, making it easier to wait for a train in comfort.

I far prefer using Temple Meads than New Street (although it could do with a burger joint and ale bar).