Heat Related Disruption - 13 Aug 2026

[CaptainHaddock]

We didn't have temperatures of nearly 40 degrees in the 1990s and 2000s. Even a day just over 30 was unusual.

"80 degrees" - 27 Celsius - was something to write home about.

We don't get temperatures of nearly 40 degrees now, not in the North West where EMR and Northern have given up the ghost again.
Even at its hottest the temperature in the North hasn't risen above the low to mid 30s all summer so there's no need for you to exaggerate.

 

[Bletchleyite]

We don't get temperatures of nearly 40 degrees now, not in the North West where EMR and Northern have given up the ghost again.
Even at its hottest the temperature in the North hasn't risen above the low to mid 30s all summer so there's no need for you to exaggerate.

Mid 30s is high for the UK even so. Go back 10-20 years and 28 was super hot, the 30s was almost unknown.

Yes, the north isn't as hot, but the north wasn't as hot before either, and 158s have been a problem in this regard for years. You can tell summer has arrived when you see 158s with the windows open...

Typical "hot" British summer of the 90s and 2000s was about 25 at most.

The point is that climate change is real (one can debate about the causes and whether humans are involved or not, but not about its reality), and with it comes a need to change our approach to things. Which in time will mean units with higher specced aircon (the 165s with their newish installations for instance are doing superbly, as was the 80x I took on the 40 degree day a couple of years back), but you can hardly replace it all in a weekend. In the meantime the big issue is the ability of drivers to concentrate in the heat if the aircon isn't really doing its thing very well.

 

[The exile]

Typical "hot" British summer of the 90s and 2000s was about 25 at most.m

And the 90s summers in general seemed hot and sunny compared with the previous 10-14 years (carefully omitting 1975 & 76!)

 

[Dave61]

We don't get temperatures of nearly 40 degrees now, not in the North West where EMR and Northern have given up the ghost again.
Even at its hottest the temperature in the North hasn't risen above the low to mid 30s all summer so there's no need for you to exaggerate.

Can you send some of that cooler weather down to the East Midlands then please ? It's going to be 35c here today and it is through that heat that those services have to run, although I do get the irony that the only part that is still running is the East Midlands bit.

Maybe the train companies are just applying too much caution or as others have mentioned some units do struggle in these temperatures and they have less trains to spread around. If it is the latter then it is high time to replace them with something that can cope because these hot summers are here to stay (barring the odd normal one when it rains all the time but that is weather v climate and best to keep that debate out of the thread).

We just can't carry on like this.

 

[Snow1964]

Mid 30s is high for the UK even so. Go back 10-20 years and 28 was super hot, the 30s was almost unknown.

Yes, the north isn't as hot, but the north wasn't as hot before either, and 158s have been a problem in this regard for years. You can tell summer has arrived when you see 158s with the windows open...

It's a sort of circular argument. For a few years (at least 10 years, and some would say 20+ years) it has been known summers are warmer. Yet for the 158s no serious attempt has been made to upgrade the cooling since their mid 1980s design spec.

It's a yes we know it's warmer, but not going to upgrade, so as to deal with it approach, and now reached point where many 158s are expected to carry on into early 2030s and still have no intention of upgrading them to cope.

 

[CaptainHaddock]

Can you send some of that cooler weather down to the East Midlands then please ? It's going to be 35c here today and it is through that heat that those services have to run, although I do get the irony that the only part that is still running is the East Midlands bit.

Maybe the train companies are just applying too much caution or as others have mentioned some units do struggle in these temperatures and they have less trains to spread around. If it is the latter then it is high time to replace them with something that can cope because these hot summers are here to stay (barring the odd normal one when it rains all the time but that is weather v climate and best to keep that debate out of the thread).

We just can't carry on like this.

Would this be a suitable point in the thread to post the usual "how do they manage to run trains in much hotter countries than ours?" question ?

 

[Jamesrob637]

We don't get temperatures of nearly 40 degrees now, not in the North West where EMR and Northern have given up the ghost again.
Even at its hottest the temperature in the North hasn't risen above the low to mid 30s all summer so there's no need for you to exaggerate.

38 on a couple of days in 2022, but could become more commonplace going forward. The North is broad. Southern parts (up to Manchester/Leeds/the M62 corridor) get very hot, more northern parts less so.

 

[D6130]

Would this be a suitable point in the thread to post the usual "how do they manage to run trains in much hotter countries than ours?" question ?

Probably not.... given that this Summer's - and last Summer's - exceptional temperatures have caused - and continue to cause - serious train service disruption in France, Spain, Germany and Italy, amongst other countries.

 

[AndrewE]

Would this be a suitable point in the thread to post the usual "how do they manage to run trains in much hotter countries than ours?" question ?

see post #58...

 

[Cell2025]

Northern have announced some changes for tomorrow, generally cutting 2tph to 1tph on several lines.

Hot weather travel advice

Northern | Buy Cheap Train Tickets and Check Train Times

www.northernrailway.co.uk

Fortunately for me, the Atherton line isn't one of them! Probably thanks to the works east of Manchester Victoria meaning there's no other section to prioritise.

The 'Yorkshire Flyer' now seems to be grounded on the runway at the slightest hint of trouble. A shame because it's genuinely my most valued service to travel between Leeds and Sheffield, given that the Lincoln and Nottingham services are overcrowded and I'd rather eat McDonalds for the rest of my life than try to squeeze on any Cross Country Service.

 

[LowLevel]

It's a sort of circular argument. For a few years (at least 10 years, and some would say 20+ years) it has been known summers are warmer. Yet for the 158s no serious attempt has been made to upgrade the cooling since their mid 1980s design spec.

It's a yes we know it's warmer, but not going to upgrade, so as to deal with it approach, and now reached point where many 158s are expected to carry on into early 2030s and still have no intention of upgrading them to cope.

Serious money was spent on upgrading every 158 and 159 in the country except the TfW units and 158763 (for some reason, and it was withdrawn after the Salisbury crash so is no longer an oddity) about 15-20 years ago with the more robust Liebherr air con system. What didn't change was the inherent shortcomings of the units - the gutless alternator etc, the crap access to various components making them hard to service etc, the aluminium body with long pipe runs and so on.

EMR have believe it or not been paying some serious attention to their 158 units trying to better understand the issues and any feasible ways of improving performance.

 

[AndrewE]

EMR have believe it or not been paying some serious attention to their 158 units trying to better understand the issues and any feasible ways of improving performance.

That's good to hear, let's hope that there is an industry-wide user group, with attendance by any contracted-out maintainers too.

 

[Requeststop]

GWR have announced changes to their timetable because of the weather.

The train services between Truro and Falmouth are set to run hourly, instead of half-hourly, and the Okehampton branch line will be replaced by bus services.

Trains between Exeter St David's and Barnstaple would continue to run as normal.

 

[800002]

It's about restressing rails, is it not?

As an aside I had a ride on Chiltern yesterday from Bicester to Brum and back which for various reasons ended up involving 3 168s and a 165*. The 168s appeared to be struggling to keep cool with some failed aircon units and the ones that were working just not managing to properly cool the units, though the odd vehicle was OK. The 165 with its newer installation was absolutely lovely, like walking into a fridge.

I wonder if they'll prioritise using 165s today as a result?

* Was aiming for the 2120 connection back south as the 2115 was a bit early, but when I got to Moor St the 2115 was still there so I very quickly boarded, but it was noisy and full of people playing phones out loud so I dropped back to the 2120 at Solihull, changing at Leamington, which was a far quieter journey despite both being 2-cars.

Amongst reducing the Birmingham services, more Mk5a runs are operating.

The 168s are suffering tremendously with the heat.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Amongst reducing the Birmingham services, more Mk5a runs are operating.

The 168s are suffering tremendously with the heat.

Didn't they pull the Mk5as last time suggesting the aircon wasn't up to it? Have changes been made to make it more robust?

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

I could imagine rolling stock procurement from now forwards requesting stock must cope with extremely high temperatures. But how do we change all the infrastructure? Presumably we cannot replace every point across the UK?

In previous years we would have had blanket heat speed restriction above 35 degC on Sussex but NR haven't called for that today so I'd say the infrastructure is holding up better. The main issue seems to be older train types with air conditioning/cooling which werent designed for ambient temps above 30 deg C. Not much you can do about that and given they are sealed boxes you will get significant internal temp rise if train got detained/stranded for very long. Theres no real solution to it as the trains have neither the space for bigger a/c units nor the power to drive them in the case of 145's.

 

[800002]

Didn't they pull the Mk5as last time suggesting the aircon wasn't up to it? Have changes been made to make it more robust?

Yes. Greater c9nfidence in mk5a.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

So, if it's getting warmer and the expectation is that trains have decent air-con, how do we prevent warping/bucking of the trackwork in exposed areas? We have point heaters in the winter along with limited conductor rail heating in some areas. How does one propose keeping the permanent way cool?

 

[Bletchleyite]

So, if it's getting warmer and the expectation is that trains have decent air-con, how do we prevent warping/bucking of the trackwork in exposed areas? We have point heaters in the winter along with limited conductor rail heating in some areas. How does one propose keeping the permanent way cool?

Painting rails white is a common approach in places like Italy, but we might also need to consider restressing rails for a higher upper temperature, potentially doing it twice a year. I think countries where you get hot summers and cold winters (e.g. Italy) do that.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Painting rails white is a common approach in places like Italy, but we might also need to consider restressing rails for a higher upper temperature, potentially doing it twice a year. I think countries where you get hot summers and cold winters (e.g. Italy) do that.

Your not going to restress twice a year access and resources to cover would be far too great. It would seem sensible to set the standard by geographical areas to give a bit more margin in Southern areas. That said we have 38 forecast today but NR hasnt imposed blanket speed restrictions across the Southern routes which suggest that the current stress free temperature of 27 deg C is adequate.

 

[AndrewE]

Your not going to restress twice a year access and resources to cover would be far too great. It would seem sensible to set the standard by geographical areas to give a bit more margin in Southern areas.

Not everywhere, obviously, but a planned application of this investment could make the railway a lot more resilient and a more attractive option year-round.

That said we have 38 forecast today but NR hasnt imposed blanket speed restrictions across the Southern routes which suggest that the current stress free temperature of 27 deg C is adequate.

It's not just about ambient (air) temperatures, some places will be worse for solar gain than others. This could help minimise the amount of re-stressing needed, or highlight the smaller areas where extra precautions like speed restrictions might be needed.

Prioritising the re-stressing budget would be an interesting job...

 

[Bletchleyite]

Your not going to restress twice a year access and resources to cover would be far too great. It would seem sensible to set the standard by geographical areas to give a bit more margin in Southern areas. That said we have 38 forecast today but NR hasnt imposed blanket speed restrictions across the Southern routes which suggest that the current stress free temperature of 27 deg C is adequate.

I think it hasn't turned out as bad as expected. 38 was forecast here yesterday, today it's noticeably not quite that hot and the forecast now has it topping out at 35. Still hot of course!

 

[Trainfan2019]

I can only agree with you.

This whole "it's summer, it's hot, so we aren't going to run trains" way of carrying on just can't be allowed to continue, it's eventually going to kill confidence in the industry.

Like it or not, rising summer temperatures are probably here to stay; are we going to go through this whole scenario of giving up on our absolutely core reason for existing, running train services, every year? This is unsustainable, once customer confidence has been lost it will be an uphill task to get it back.

I agree with the above for sure.

I accept that train drivers and onboard staff shouldn't have to work in extreme temperatures.

If certain classes of train are problematic in extreme temperatures then how about a basic bus replacement service instead? Just for the routes with almost no service. At least a rail replacement bus is better than nothing at all.

 

[trainophile]

I agree with the above for sure.

I accept that train drivers and onboard staff shouldn't have to work in extreme temperatures.

If certain classes of train are problematic in extreme temperatures then how about a basic bus replacement service instead? Just for the routes with almost no service. At least a rail replacement bus is better than nothing at all.

Or automatic ticket acceptance on any and every service that does manage to run.

 

[Bletchleyite]

If certain classes of train are problematic in extreme temperatures then how about a basic bus replacement service instead? Just for the routes with almost no service. At least a rail replacement bus is better than nothing at all.

That's generally what seems to be being done, though it's harder to arrange than it was due to accessibility regulations regarding the coaches - you can't just hire any coach, it has to have wheelchair accessibility and (this is a new one which will make it even worse) passenger information displays.

 

[Cell2025]

I agree with the above for sure.

I accept that train drivers and onboard staff shouldn't have to work in extreme temperatures.

If certain classes of train are problematic in extreme temperatures then how about a basic bus replacement service instead? Just for the routes with almost no service. At least a rail replacement bus is better than nothing at all.

Buses can be even worse sweat boxes than trains.

 

[Snow1964]

It's not just about ambient (air) temperatures, some places will be worse for solar gain than others.

We are now 7 weeks after mid summers day, and closer in time to the autumn equinox when sun passes back south over the equator.

So there is much less solar gain in mid August than end June or early July

 

[Bletchleyite]

Buses can be even worse sweat boxes than trains.

Though replacement buses are often coaches which tend to be air conditioned, as it's easier to hire these. And there's also that the employee relations situation is rather different - in short a bus driver is less likely to refuse to drive because of heat than a train driver, though I comment not on the rights and wrongs of that.

 

[The exile]

In previous years we would have had blanket heat speed restriction above 35 degC on Sussex but NR haven't called for that today so I'd say the infrastructure is holding up better. The main issue seems to be older train types with air conditioning/cooling which werent designed for ambient temps above 30 deg C. Not much you can do about that and given they are sealed boxes you will get significant internal temp rise if train got detained/stranded for very long. Theres no real solution to it

How about hopper vents (normally locked) on all windows?

 

[168lover]

Amongst reducing the Birmingham services, more Mk5a runs are operating.

The 168s are suffering tremendously with the heat.

Got a 168/0 last Sunday in 30 degrees heat and fairly sure one of the coaches had the heating on full blast, needless to say it was empty with everyone piling into the other 3 coaches which were slightly cooler