Highbury & Islington - not a National Rail station?

[NCT]

Saw a poster the other day about National Rail tickets not being available from Highbury and Islington. This is despite serving three National Rail lines, one of which not run by TfL.

I've not consciously noticed until this point that there is no National Rail ticketing available at this station. Is this actually technically allowed? Are there any other stations with National Rail services in TfL land without National Rail ticketing?

 

[MrJeeves]

Are there any other stations with National Rail services in TfL land without National Rail ticketing?

Kentish Town?

 

[Watershed]

National Rail tickets (including Railcard discounts) are still available from the ticket machines to a (limited) selection of stations around London & the southeast. The main limitations are that you can't buy Advance tickets, collect tickets bought online or get rangers/rovers.

 

[NCT]

National Rail tickets (including Railcard discounts) are still available from the ticket machines to a (limited) selection of stations around London & the southeast. The main limitations are that you can't buy Advance tickets, collect tickets bought online or get rangers/rovers.

H&I have no National Rail ticket machines whatsoever. Is it common to not have any ticket machines whatsoever at (proper) National Rail suburban stations now?

 

[Sonic1234]

Is it common to not have any ticket machines whatsoever at (proper) National Rail suburban stations now?

No. The majority of suburban National Rail stations do. Those managed by Underground have the LU machines, which only have limited ticketing options and no ticket collection. Those managed by other operators, including Overground, have proper machines.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 Aug 2026 ==

Are there any other stations with National Rail services in TfL land without National Rail ticketing?

Canada Water (good luck getting TfL to admit Overground is National Rail though)

 

[Watershed]

H&I have no National Rail ticket machines whatsoever. Is it common to not have any ticket machines whatsoever at (proper) National Rail suburban stations now?

The Underground machines allow sales to (some) National Rail destinations, as mentioned.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 5 Aug 2026 ==

Canada Water (good luck getting TfL to admit Overground is National Rail though)

Plus, presumably, most of the other National Rail-served stations managed by LU, i.e.:

• Amersham to Rickmansworth plus Harrow-on-the-Hill
• West Ruislip and South Ruislip (though I believe there may be a Chiltern TVM at one/both of these from memory?)
• Greenford
• Harrow & Wealdstone to Queens Park, except Willesden Junction which is LO managed
• Gunnersbury and Kew Gardens
• Blackhorse Road
• Kentish Town as mentioned above
• Old Street and Moorgate

 

[Sonic1234]

Harrow & Wealdstone and Kew Gardens have the Overground-style TVMs. Kentish Town and Old Street have the LU machines. Not sure about the other LU managed stations.

The LU machines still use 34% rather than 33.4% as the discount for railcards and when there is a fare increase it takes several months to update because apparently a CD of the new fares has to be sent to the station and loaded into the machines, so you can buy at the old price for a while.

 

[walkingsophie]

Kentish Town?

Canada Water too. I have had to waste a few pounds due to that in the past before. It is really incompetent and a shame upon TFL and NR that there is no way to buy most tickets or collect tickets at stations where paper tickets are necessary.

 

[mickey]

• Gunnersbury and Kew Gardens

Gunnersbury always used to have proper TVMs with full NR ticketing… have they been removed? If so that’s a hugely negative development.

 

[Watershed]

Gunnersbury always used to have proper TVMs with full NR ticketing… have they been removed? If so that’s a hugely negative development.

I'm just listing the ones that are LU-managed but NR-served. If they have proper TVMs then I'm happy to be corrected

 

[NCT]

Canada Water too. I have had to waste a few pounds due to that in the past before. It is really incompetent and a shame upon TFL and NR that there is no way to buy most tickets or collect tickets at stations where paper tickets are necessary.

I do find it quite naughty on the part of TfL, and such situations indefensible.

 

[Ralph Ayres]

Harrow & Wealdstone and Kew Gardens have the Overground-style TVMs. Kentish Town and Old Street have the LU machines. Not sure about the other LU managed stations.

The LU machines still use 34% rather than 33.4% as the discount for railcards and when there is a fare increase it takes several months to update because apparently a CD of the new fares has to be sent to the station and loaded into the machines, so you can buy at the old price for a while.

It's downloaded remotely, not physically on site by CD! The %-age discrepancy came about because RDG initially omitted to warn TfL in advance about the change and then formally instruct them to use the new value. I'd assumed that had eventually happened but possibly not. It can be hard to tell as many fares end up the same thanks to rounding, and LU additionally round down any odd 5p prices as their machines don't handle 5p pieces.

 

[teaspoon]

Gunnersbury always used to have proper TVMs with full NR ticketing… have they been removed? If so that’s a hugely negative development.

I'm pretty sure it did when I was there a few weeks ago.
It turns out that full NR ticket machines were installed in former Silverlink stations which were transferred to LUL control. This 2017 post from diamond geezer has some of the backstory:

TfL would have liked to have closed the ticket offices at these 11 stations in 2015 but they weren't allowed. Before the Overground began they'd been operated under different terms and conditions, which included the requirement to be able to sell tickets to National Rail stations nationwide. Closing these ticket offices therefore required a separate public consultation, undertaken in conjunction with London TravelWatch, and this (and a change of Mayor) delayed the process considerably.

 

[Gaelan]

The general principle in National Rail land, as I understand it, is that if a station lacks facilities to buy the ticket you want, you're entitled to board a train and buy at the next opportunity.

I would guess that this applies here in principle, but not in practice, because you'd never get past a gateline with that argument?

 

[walkingsophie]

The general principle in National Rail land, as I understand it, is that if a station lacks facilities to buy the ticket you want, you're entitled to board a train and buy at the next opportunity.

I would guess that this applies here in principle, but not in practice, because you'd never get past a gateline with that argument?

I know most gateline people let you through if you have a collection reference, but I think that would count as having bought the ticket and being unable to display it.

 

[Snow1964]

The general principle in National Rail land, as I understand it, is that if a station lacks facilities to buy the ticket you want, you're entitled to board a train and buy at the next opportunity.

I would guess that this applies here in principle, but not in practice, because you'd never get past a gateline with that argument?

So how does that fit in with usage and accessibility rules.

Station open, but won't sell you a ticket (unless destination is limited selection, not all 2500 stations), can't get through barrier without a ticket, so effectively station is closed to anyone wanting to buy a ticket.

How many stations can you get a ticket to, 5%, 10% or what.

 

[Edvid]

• West Ruislip and South Ruislip (though I believe there may be a Chiltern TVM at one/both of these from memory?)

West Ruislip certainly had a Chiltern TVM when I used the station a few months back.

I know most gateline people let you through if you have a collection reference, but I think that would count as having bought the ticket and being unable to display it.

Is that a recent change following the NRCoT refund rule revisions?

It turns out that full NR ticket machines were installed in former Silverlink stations which were transferred to LUL control. This 2017 post from diamond geezer has some of the backstory:

To reflect their particular status those 11 stations (Gunnersbury, Kew Gardens, Queen's Park - Harrow & Wealdstone (exc. Willesden Junction)) are collectively termed Regulated Stations (on) London Underground. As such their machines can process Ticket on Departure collections even though identical Cubic TVMs at other LU stations cannot.

 

[Sonic1234]

It's downloaded remotely, not physically on site by CD!

Thanks for that information, I'm sure I read in the ticketing and revenue updates once it required a CD. Must have misread it although could believe it given the age of some of the LU machines, some should be in the London Transport Museum.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Aug 2026 ==

How many stations can you get a ticket to

It's those in the former Network SouthEast area. As for getting through the gates if you wanted to go elsewhere, a good point. In reality you'd probably get "National Rail mate, nothing to do with us. Just tap in". Followed by a complaint to TfL which gets misunderstood by the first line of customer services.

 

[Djgr]

because apparently a CD of the new fares has to be sent to the station and loaded into the machines, so you can buy at the old price for a while.

Ah bless

 

[Kilopylae]

I wouldn't want to attempt to change trains at, say, Birmingham and have to explain to the gateline staff that I had boarded without a ticket in suburban London because 'the machine' wouldn't sell me one.

 

[81A]

Thanks for that information, I'm sure I read in the ticketing and revenue updates once it required a CD. Must have misread it although could believe it given the age of some of the LU machines, some should be in the London Transport Museum.

I though so too... Regarding age of machines, I think some date back to 1987-1990? Obviously with many modifications (touchscreens, card payments, oyster) but definitely retaining some old features (not 100% sure about CD updates, but some still have dot matrix ticket printers!)...

 

[bicbasher]

The Hanover Square Bond Street EL machines don't sell NR tickets. There's even a sign saying it.

 

[TrenHotel]

The Hanover Square Bond Street EL machines don't sell NR tickets. There's even a sign saying it.

Same at the Dean Street end of Tottenham Court Road.

 

[NCT]

Despite Crossrail being NR.