Wheelchair passengers should be able to travel for free

[aron2smith]

Moderator note: Split from

Travelling with a disabled persons.

It is getting increasingly frustrating to travel with a disabled person at the moment. Some of the stations I am going to highlight below are fairly new so the problem is purely financial as at design stage it was chosen to only have a single. Lift. Journey Welwyn Garden City - London Bridge...

www.railforums.co.uk

Trains really should be free for anyone travelling in a wheelchair or with limited mobility, the service is basically unusable for them!

 

[speedy1]

Trains really should be free for anyone travelling in a wheelchair or with limited mobility, the service is basically unusable for them!

1/3 off for the traveler and a companion and the disabled person often being in receipt of or entitled to PIP (£80/week just for mobility) is pretty close to free

 

[AlterEgo]

1/3 off for the traveler and a companion and the disabled person is often in receipt of or entitled to PIP (£80/week just for mobility) is pretty close to free

How is one third off "close to free"?

 

[speedy1]

How is one third off "close to free"?

Read the whole post

 

[AlterEgo]

Read the whole post

Obviously you're not trying to say someone claiming benefits is travelling for free, that would be ignoring the reality that disabled people's benefits go on lots of other expenses. That's what PIP is for.

How is it "nearly free"?

 

[styles]

1/3 off for the traveler and a companion and the disabled person often being in receipt of or entitled to PIP (£80/week just for mobility) is pretty close to free

50% off with no need for a Railcard, if a passenger needs to remain in their wheelchair for the journey: https://www.nationalrail.co.uk/tick...romotions/wheelchair-user-without-a-railcard/

 

[GoneSouth]

1/3 off for the traveler and a companion and the disabled person often being in receipt of or entitled to PIP (£80/week just for mobility) is pretty close to free

Hmmm well, that may sound very generous, but when we analyse the cost of getting around without a car, it’s astonishing how quickly that £80 might disappear. A round trip to the supermarket by taxi is going to cost £25-30 alone, you shouldn’t expect that to be a disabled persons only trip outside the house for the week, and each time you use that taxi it’s burning the PIP. If you then factor in a rail journey with a companion for help, that’s blown the budget, probably by quite a way.

If we then compare the cost of rail to private car, it’s a no brainer. If there’s more than one person travelling more than a couple of miles car wins. That option isn’t available to many so they have to shell out the outrageously expensive rail far (yes, looking at you XC).

I’m not saying travel should be free, I’m just saying that a disabled individual would more than likely have higher costs for travel as a direct result of their disability when comparing the same journeys and available options for a non disabled driver. So, it’s not free and PIP doesn’t always cover the extra costs incurred

 

[Haywain]

round trip to the supermarket by taxi is going to cost £25-30 alone,

That depends on where one lives - I could get to a supermarket and back by taxi for a tenner. However, supermarkets deliver to the door, so it's not a journey that can be regarded as an absolute necessity these days.

I’m just saying that a disabled individual would more than likely have higher costs for travel as a direct result of their disability when comparing the same journeys and available options for a non disabled driver. So, it’s not free and PIP doesn’t always cover the extra costs incurred

Isn't that why the disabled railcard exists?

 

[Jim Jehosofat]

Moderator note: Split from

Travelling with a disabled persons.

It is getting increasingly frustrating to travel with a disabled person at the moment. Some of the stations I am going to highlight below are fairly new so the problem is purely financial as at design stage it was chosen to only have a single. Lift. Journey Welwyn Garden City - London Bridge...

www.railforums.co.uk

Trains really should be free for anyone travelling in a wheelchair or with limited mobility, the service is basically unusable for them!

And how long would it take the tiktok brigade to show off their new hack: sit in a wheelchair and you can travel by train for free!

 

[Llanigraham]

And what about those in wheelchairs who have well paid jobs?
They aren't all poor or unwaged.
Do you propose means testing everyone?

 

[Falcon1200]

Trains really should be free for anyone travelling in a wheelchair or with limited mobility, the service is basically unusable for them!

How would making their travel free make the service any more usable for wheelchair or limited mobility passengers?

 

[[.n]]

Moderator note: Split from

Travelling with a disabled persons.

It is getting increasingly frustrating to travel with a disabled person at the moment. Some of the stations I am going to highlight below are fairly new so the problem is purely financial as at design stage it was chosen to only have a single. Lift. Journey Welwyn Garden City - London Bridge...

www.railforums.co.uk

Trains really should be free for anyone travelling in a wheelchair or with limited mobility, the service is basically unusable for them!

Couple of points to consider (and I say this who has extensively travelled with wheelchair users, so I have experience - does it rely on a bit organsation and pre-planning - yes, but I would argue no more than various other scenarios not involved a wheelchair user). I think the between 34%-50% discount is line with other discounts, so its fair in that sense

1) Define limited mobility
2) And then why just wheelchair users - there are plenty of other groups for which we could say the service is unusable

 

[GoneSouth]

That depends on where one lives - I could get to a supermarket and back by taxi for a tenner. However, supermarkets deliver to the door, so it's not a journey that can be regarded as an absolute necessity these days.

I don’t know where you live but a fiver each way in a taxi around here wouldn’t get past the end of my drive. It certainly wouldn’t get me anywhere meaningful as I think the minimum charge is a fiver.

Isn't that why the disabled railcard exists?

Quite right, which is why I said it shouldn’t be free to travel. What I also know to be true is that 33% discount (wasn’t it rounded down to 33% recently) in many cases doesn’t cover the extra cost of needing to use the train over private car.

Generally, it’s a fair discount, but not adequate every time.

 

[Nym]

Trains really should be free for anyone travelling in a wheelchair or with limited mobility, the service is basically unusable for them!

How are you classifying "Limited Mobility"?

Basic PIP Mobility Component Entitlement? or Claimant?
Enhanced PIP Mobility Component Entitlement? or Claimant?
Blue Badge Eligable?
Disabled Railcard Eligable?
"Registered Disabled"? (This doesn't exist any more).
Disabled Entitlement Gold Card Holder?

Now bear in mind, how much the "You're not disabled!" police already cause problems for a lot of people with mobility problems on and around the railway, car parks, buses, toilets, or anywhere else in general life, how do you propose to have something where there is essentially a financial gain / lack of financial loss, with the "you're not disabled" police having to pay, manage the inevitable conflict in this scenario?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 2 Aug 2026 ==

However, supermarkets deliver to the door, so it's not a journey that can be regarded as an absolute necessity these days.

So people with mobility problems are required to stay indoors and not travel unless it's essential and cannot be fulfilled by delivery services etc?

 

[Haywain]

So people with mobility problems are required to stay indoors and not travel unless it's essential and cannot be fulfilled by delivery services etc?

No, no more than they are required to go out to a supermarket. But thanks for twisting my words.

 

[Gareth1990]

What about making the disabled Railcard itself free?

 

[MikeFromLFE]

My wife is disabled and in receipt of PIP including the mobility component. I am also entitled to a Disabled Railcard due to having hearing aids.
We are both extremely sceptical about this idea that disabled people should get 'Free Stuff' - like everything that is supposedly 'free' it isn't because someone, somewhere has to pay for the service provided.
A good example of this is 'free hospital parking' - who pays for the security, surfacing, lighting, marking of bays etc etc? Does it come out of the clinical budget?
In the same vein, free rail travel for one group or another means that someone else is covering the lost revenue, the provision of wheelchair spaces (when not full of oversize luggage) and the generally excellent passenger assistance staff. How much more are you prepared to pay so that wheelchair users (+/- other disabled users) can travel free?

 

[mrcheek]

sounds like a great idea.

But then of course, it would eventually be extended to those with reduced mobility but not in wheelchairs. Then to those with other disabilities. Then to those with mental health issues.

Suddenly, youve got thousands of people travelling for free because they have anxiety, or eating disorders (I have both, and do not believe I should get free rail travel!)
Just like the Motability scam

 

[Nym]

sounds like a great idea.

But then of course, it would eventually be extended to those with reduced mobility but not in wheelchairs. Then to those with other disabilities. Then to those with mental health issues.

Suddenly, youve got thousands of people travelling for free because they have anxiety, or eating disorders (I have both, and do not believe I should get free rail travel!)
Just like the Motability scam

So… mental health issues are not a disability and those on Motability are scamming…?

 

[mrcheek]

So… mental health issues are not a disability and those on Motability are scamming…?

no I didnt say that because they clearly are, and secondly, clearly yes in many cases
Basically proving my point though. Someone calls for free travel for those in wheelchairs, and already you want the same for those with mental health issues. Why not just make rail travel free for everyone?

 

[AlterEgo]

no I didnt say that because they clearly are, and secondly, clearly yes in many cases
Basically proving my point though. Someone calls for free travel for those in wheelchairs, and already you want the same for those with mental health issues. Why not just make rail travel free for everyone?

@Nym did not say any of that.

 

[mrcheek]

@Nym did not say any of that.

But it is the logical conclusion of what he said.

Odd that you didnt mention that I never said any of the things he suggested I did either......
Or call him out on the other occasions where he wilfully misquoted people

 

[Iskra]

A lot of trains struggle for capacity for wheelchairs as it is. I don’t think the network could cope if travel were free for persons who use them.

 

[Failed Unit]

A lot of trains struggle for capacity for wheelchairs as it is. I don’t think the network could cope if travel were free for persons who use them.

TfL is free, I don’t notice it overwhelmed with wheelchairs (pushchairs maybe - but they could be putting off the wheelchair users)

 

[AlterEgo]

But it is the logical conclusion of what he said.

It isn't. Of course they may well want to clarify or repeat anything they've said but it it is not the case that the logical conclusion of maintaining or expanding disability provision that soon "everyone can travel for free".
And, if you even read what they have written in this thread, do you think they support the proposal to make all disabled travel free or not?

Odd that you didnt mention that I never said any of the things he suggested I did either......

In the case of you being accused of saying mental health issues are not a disability, that is actually what you wrote:

But then of course, it would eventually be extended to those with reduced mobility but not in wheelchairs. Then to those with other disabilities. Then to those with mental health issues.

The only way to read this is that the writer does not consider that mental health issues can be considered a disability. This is basic English comprehension question you'd get in the 11+ exam.

The other thing you said was that Motability was a scam, a view which you clarified to mean "yes, in many cases disabled people claiming Motability vehicles were scamming".

Or call him out on the other occasions where he wilfully misquoted people

That poster has only quoted people's posts verbatim.

 

[Iskra]

TfL is free, I don’t notice it overwhelmed with wheelchairs (pushchairs maybe - but they could be putting off the wheelchair users)

Do they operate two carriage trains?

 

[Nym]

Do they operate two carriage trains?

Fortunately not any more.

It does seem to (in the case of short trains) come down to the DfT or whoever dictating that trains need a certain capacity for Passengers of Limited Mobility including Wheelchairs, and including retrospectively applying this to existing fleets, but then stops short of providing funding to make these spaces, or reliably have these spaces available for said passengers.
Be it by not funding modifications, or sufficiently long trains.

 

[Starmill]

Moderator note: Split from

Travelling with a disabled persons.

It is getting increasingly frustrating to travel with a disabled person at the moment. Some of the stations I am going to highlight below are fairly new so the problem is purely financial as at design stage it was chosen to only have a single. Lift. Journey Welwyn Garden City - London Bridge...

www.railforums.co.uk

Trains really should be free for anyone travelling in a wheelchair or with limited mobility, the service is basically unusable for them!

One thing I've always been keen to understand is whether £1 or £2 companion ticket would be beneficial.

Obviously it's a little bit different when it's travel vs a cinema or theatre or something, but many of the latter types do allow a companion ticket to be purchased for next to nothing. Sometimes the second ticket costs nothing at all, although this may be more difficult to arrange for railways. The experience of free travel for children in Wales was a complete mess for example.

Of course the Disabled Railcard already offers a discount to the companion as well as the holder. The same goes for the Wheelchair User without a railcard discount but I would expand this to allow a 50% discount on everything that a Disabled Railcard would be valid for to make it simpler.

The companion being charged a flat fare of £1 or £2 or something would be in line with the accompanied child rates common in many areas.

Another possibility would be an allocation of say 5 free day tickets per year which go for up to two people. How these would be issued and how the codes handed out to people resident in England and using a wheelchair I don't have the first idea. Perhaps a good old fashioned date box card with the holder's photo on it. Or perhaps this would be an optional upgrade to the Disabled Railcard for people who must remain in their wheelchair.

 

[al78]

Moderator note: Split from

Travelling with a disabled persons.

It is getting increasingly frustrating to travel with a disabled person at the moment. Some of the stations I am going to highlight below are fairly new so the problem is purely financial as at design stage it was chosen to only have a single. Lift. Journey Welwyn Garden City - London Bridge...

www.railforums.co.uk

Trains really should be free for anyone travelling in a wheelchair or with limited mobility, the service is basically unusable for them!

What benefit is a free service that is unusable?

First thing to do is address that element of UK crapness and make the service usable, then consider providing it free.

 

[Russel]

I can't see what problem this idea is trying to solve, but I can see a few it will create!