Hull to halifax service to be split at leeds

[Iskra]

In what way does making passengers have to change trains more often and have a longer journey make it more reliable?

This is just cost cutting by Northern. Plain and simple.

There is nothing wrong with the current Hull to Leeds to Bradford service.

It’s strange how they suddenly find platform space for it now terminate at Leeds when at the start they said platform seven was for the York terminators and 14 for the Shelby’s/TPEs needing to terminate.

Because the trains that run, will run more reliably.

I don’t see how any money is being saved here, when the through journey is being covered by another service being extended.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Everyone benefits from more reliable journeys

Surely that depends on how long the additional connection time is that's now necessary at the intermediate station, compared with the journey time for a through journey. Not so good if everything runs on time but you now have a lengthy wait at Leeds.

 

[MichaelTrains]

Because the trains that run, will run more reliably.

I don’t see how any money is being saved here, when the through journey is being covered by another service being extended.

Changes add time, uncertainty, platform walking, and risk of missed connections—especially for passengers with luggage, mobility needs, children, or the highly documented peak-hour Leeds platform crowding.

Even if overall reliability figures improve by splitting the service (I still have my doubts), the practical journey quality for many users declines.

Journeys between Bradford Interchange and Hull, while not enormous in absolute terms, have increased substantially in recent years (from low thousands to several thousand annually in origin-destination matrices).

This indicates rising demand for the through link rather than a dead service to Leeds which removes the East–West Yorkshire links.

 

[Fisherman80]

Changes add time, uncertainty, platform walking, and risk of missed connections—especially for passengers with luggage, mobility needs, children, or the highly documented peak-hour Leeds platform crowding.

Even if overall reliability figures improve by splitting the service (I still have my doubts), the practical journey quality for many users declines.

Journeys between Bradford Interchange and Hull, while not enormous in absolute terms, have increased substantially in recent years (from low thousands to several thousand annually in origin-destination matrices).

This indicates rising demand for the through link rather than a dead service to Leeds which removes the East–West Yorkshire links.

Completely agree with the above.

 

[Ballyheigue]

I can vouch for the reliability issues as there have been a number of incidents between Halifax and Leeds over the past year which have caused late running, e.g. bridge strikes, trespasser's etc. The service very often ends up terminating at Leeds or starting from Leeds with the Halifax bit cancelled. I think Bradford folk moaning about changing more than once for Bridlington need a reality check, what's more important, your train running on time every time or your once a year jolly to the seaside, besides Leeds folk have just as much right to moan that Bradford get's faster links to Blackpool than Leeds does.

 

[YorkshireBear]

As a service it is woefully unreliable and regularly terminates short. The pathing Leeds to Micklefield is tight as is the Calder valley and combined this leads to lots of issues.

However, I do note having used it that there is a not insignificant number stay on, places like Garforth etc. Will attract a reasonable number travelling across Leeds. Although if I was in Hull I'd sooner take two express TPE services over this, if that does remain the plan.

Not convinced the accusations of cost cutting make sense, it shouldn't actually save anything, so I believe Northern are actually looking at reliability.

 

[KHCT]

The Northern press release issues when the route launched said:

"The route was introduced as part of Northern's new timetables which are designed to give customers a more reliable and stable service across the entire network."

Well.....that worked out well, didn't it?

It also said:

"We are determined to give our customers greater flexibility and better connectivity and this new service provides fantastic journey opportunities across the breadth of Yorkshire" .

...yet we're now being told reduced connectivity is the key to reliability.

Of course this is all just waffle, but the reality is that the rail industry has once again failed to deliver a service and timetable of its own creation.

Northern celebrates new link between East and West Yorkshire | Northern News

Northern is celebrating improved links between West and East Yorkshire following a new service which provides direct trains between Halifax and Hull.

media.northernrailway.co.uk

 

[MrBeanie]

Travelling in and out of Leeds still seems to cause a lot of issues when it comes to delays or having to wait for a platform to become available. It's quite unusual if you don't get delayed at least once if you are spending even half a day travelling around West Yorkshire and are then going to or from Leeds station.

 

[MichaelTrains]

Surely that depends on how long the additional connection time is that's now necessary at the intermediate station, compared with the journey time for a through journey. Not so good if everything runs on time but you now have a lengthy wait at Leeds.

Travelling in and out of Leeds still seems to cause a lot of issues when it comes to delays or having to wait for a platform to become available. It's quite unusual if you don't get delayed at least once if you are spending even half a day travelling around West Yorkshire and are then going to or from Leeds station.

Leeds station needs at least two more West facing bay platforms.

 

[peri]

This service is due to go when TRU is completed to be replaced with 2 per hour TPE between Hull and Manchester Pic. It will revert to a Selby to Leeds stopper.

Is this definite? I don't agree with it for two reasons:
If TPE has no competition fares will rise.
Hull will have no direct link to Leeds with Northern, I long remember ankle freezing connections at Church Fenton when using the Northern rangers.
Is there a chance of two trains an hour Hull to Sheffield? That would help with the horrible connections from Manchester, a few weeks back the Scarborough train was
delayed making it the first time in about ten years I made a minus ten minute connection.

 

[Miles Bown]

While I do understand the reliability reasons for splitting the service at Leeds, this just seems to be another blow for the already sub-par connectivity which East Yorkshire has to deal with. During the Huddersfield blockades (or seemingly any other engineering work west of Leeds) it is always the Hull TPE service which gets lopped at Leeds, and reduced to a single 185 at that.

Now, in these instances, there won't be any cross-Leeds services at all, and Hull is effectively reduced to a backwater branch line. This is shockingly poor, particularly for anyone coming off the Yorkshire coast (who already suffer poor connections into West Yorkshire services). Again the change is logical but at the expense of the passenger, as is all too common with Northern. The 2tph TPE can't come soon enough really, and if done right could be transformational for the area.

 

[Manutd1999]

Leeds station needs at least two more West facing bay platforms.

That seems unlikely given the constraints.

Instead we could(/should) aim for a simpler service pattern which enables shorter turnaround times and better use of the existing platforms.

I.e., as many routes as possible running at least 2ph at clockface intervals.

 

[northernchris]

Travelling in and out of Leeds still seems to cause a lot of issues when it comes to delays or having to wait for a platform to become available. It's quite unusual if you don't get delayed at least once if you are spending even half a day travelling around West Yorkshire and are then going to or from Leeds station.

This is particularly noticeable on Calder Valley services (including the Halifax - Hull.) There's a habit of allowing inbound services from the Wakefield line to clear Copley Hill junction only to then hold them at Holbeck Junction. Holding them at Copley Hill if Holbeck isn't clear would allow outbound departures to still access the Calder Valley line, rather than the current setup of bringing 2 trains to a stand.

 

[Shaw S Hunter]

That seems unlikely given the constraints.

Instead we could(/should) aim for a simpler service pattern which enables shorter turnaround times and better use of the existing platforms.

I.e., as many routes as possible running at least 2ph at clockface intervals.

Electrification of the Harrogate line would be useful too, it would allow some extra flexibility in diagramming the Aire Valley routes.

 

[Old Yard Dog]

It’s sad that the Bradford Rail Users Group is now defunct as it seems there is nobody to fight the many adverse decisions concerning Bradford’s railways. These include moving Interchange station to a new inconvenient out of town site and the collapse of Northern Connect and the promised links to Sheffield, Liverpool and Manchester Piccadilly & Airport.

 

[MichaelTrains]

It’s sad that the Bradford Rail Users Group is now defunct as it seems there is nobody to fight the many adverse decisions concerning Bradford’s railways. These include moving Interchange station to a new inconvenient out of town site and the collapse of Northern Connect and the promised links to Sheffield, Liverpool and Manchester Piccadilly & Airport.

Don’t worry, I’m actively fighting in the background with my MP.

Northern needs to be held accountable for these retrograde decisions.

 

[XC victim]

It’s sad that the Bradford Rail Users Group is now defunct as it seems there is nobody to fight the many adverse decisions concerning Bradford’s railways. These include moving Interchange station to a new inconvenient out of town site and the collapse of Northern Connect and the promised links to Sheffield, Liverpool and Manchester Piccadilly & Airport.

And the cuts to the Skipton and Ilkley services from Bradford Forster Square

 

[43074]

Northern needs to be held accountable for these retrograde decisions.

I suspect the MP will be lectured at length about the performance challenges of the current service and told by Northern that they intend to go ahead with it - if it's proposed for May 2027 then it is submitted to Network Rail by train operators on Friday.