The 'Rip Off Britain' thread

[Broucek]

Or that a service is almost compulsory to buy and therefore there is an element of price gouging.

Or where there are other barriers to shopping around

 

[Trackman]

Anyone heard of Rory Sutherland the advertising exec?
His videos are a real eye-opener.
He did a video on advance train fares, I cant remember the full gist, but he turned up at a station and had to wait 30 minutes as he couldnt board the train in the platform and said he would be happy to pay a tenner to board the earlier service - there's more to it than that, I'll see if I can dig it out.

Michelin star restaurants or any restaurant is one his niggles, wine, food etc..

And the time when KFCs turnover was down, and they had to drop the prices, he suggested putting the prices up, which they did.

 

[styles]

Anyone heard of Rory Sutherland the advertising exec?
His videos are a real eye-opener.

I have but I also take them with a pinch of salt. The sheer number of times I've seen him tell a story about how Red Bull is so successful becuase it tastes bad is almost comical. No, it's successful because it was one of the first caffeine energy drinks. Don't read too much into it Rory.

He did a video on advance train fares, I cant remember the full gist, but he turned up at a station and had to wait 30 minutes as he couldnt board the train in the platform and said he would be happy to pay a tenner to board the earlier service - there's more to it than that, I'll see if I can dig it out.

There may well be something to this, but his solution already exists - you can upgrade your Advance fare to a flexible fare. He hasn't come up with a revolutionary change to rail fares, merely highlighted his own ignorance of the existing fares system.

Michelin star restaurants or any restaurant is one his niggles, wine, food etc..

Yeah, a couple of dozen videos on why wine glasses are on the table when you sit down.

And the time when KFCs turnover was down, and they had to drop the prices, he suggested putting the prices up, which they did.

Yeah he also made a false accusation about KFC running out of chicken during COVID due to changing suppliers, except they hadn't changed suppliers, but their long-term suppliers was having demand problems. He just makes stuff up, because it's catchy and gets views on YouTube.

 

[Bald Rick]

heard of Rory Sutherland the advertising exec?
His videos are a real eye-opener.
He did a video on advance train fares, I cant remember the full gist, but he turned up at a station and had to wait 30 minutes as he couldnt board the train in the platform and said he would be happy to pay a tenner to board the earlier service - there's more to it than that, I'll see if I can dig it out.

Yes, smart guy (I’ve met him); he does some great stuff, but yes take with a pinch of salt. The advance fare thing he did - that waht the LNER Flex fare is for. Expect more of it.

 

[SuspectUsual]

Yeah he also made a false accusation about KFC running out of chicken during COVID due to changing suppliers, except they hadn't changed suppliers, but their long-term suppliers was having demand problems. He just makes stuff up, because it's catchy and gets views on YouTube.

I thought their supply meltdown was a couple of years before Covid when they changed their logistics contractor and the cutover was an absolute disaster? Or have they fallen over twice?

 

[jon81uk]

Really? I give you a tin of Lynx as an example. £3 a tin last year, which magically became £6 with new fragrances but, ooo what a bargain, £3 with a loyalty card.

Smoke and mirrors.

As I said it was the same before the offers were locked to loyalty card members as well. The prices would be inflated to make the special offers seem special.

An example I have always noticed was Ginsters pasty, would be around £1.80 then down to £1 on special offer. Prices have gone up so its around £2.50 now then down to £1.50 on offer to loyalty card holders. But the offer cycle existed ten years ago of £1.80 and down to a £1 and still exists of £2.50 down to £1.50. All that changed is the special offers are only for card holders.

 

[JamesT]

I thought their supply meltdown was a couple of years before Covid when they changed their logistics contractor and the cutover was an absolute disaster? Or have they fallen over twice?

There are various news stories dated 2021 and 2022 regarding KFC having supply issues for some products. But these were Covid/Brexit related and also appear to have affected other fast food franchises.
e.g. https://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/58314821

McDonald's says it has run out of milkshakes at its UK restaurants.

The fast food chain said it was experiencing problems getting hold of some products due to delivery issues, which had affected the availability of menu items.
...
Last week, Nando's was forced to close about 50 of its restaurants after running out of chicken.
...
Rival KFC also warned recently that supply chain issues meant it was unable to stock some menu items.

But yes, the big KFC problem when they changed logistics partner was 2018.

 

[Ediswan]

I thought their supply meltdown was a couple of years before Covid when they changed their logistics contractor and the cutover was an absolute disaster? Or have they fallen over twice?

I recall that one. I was working near one of the original contractor's depots. HGV traffic visiting that depot stopped. The new contractor had ignored warnings from their own staff that they were not fully ready for the new work.

 

[m0ffy]

I have but I also take them with a pinch of salt. The sheer number of times I've seen him tell a story about how Red Bull is so successful becuase it tastes bad is almost comical. No, it's successful because it was one of the first caffeine energy drinks. Don't read too much into it Rory.

Quite. He’s clearly intelligent and an expert in his field, but whenever I’ve heard him speak on a subject I have some knowledge on, he’s appeared unaware of basic facts on the subject.

 

[Yew]

It's their business, they can run it how they like, and as customers you can either opt in and get the lower prices... or not... or go somewhere else. The choice remains yours.

That feels like an argument that could be made about many anti-consumer practices, including some that we eventually decided to make illegal.

 

[Bald Rick]

Re Gail’s.

On the strength of this threas I have just made my debut.

Customer service - superb.

A little cheaper than Costa / Starbucks / Nero etc.

Much nicer environment - like a British version of Ole & Steen

Much nicer pastries than the coffee chains, and streets ahead of Greggs.

Coffee - better than Costa / Starbies, but not quite up to Nero standard.


Overall, better value than most competitors. The very opposite of “Rip Off“. Will return.

 

[Broucek]

Re Gail’s.

On the strength of this thread I have just made my debut.

Also, Gail's often has a loo which is reasonably clean and does't need a code

 

[styles]

Much nicer pastries than the coffee chains, and streets ahead of Greggs.

I've never seen the great attraction with Greggs. Pretty much every other bakery I've been into has done better pies, pastries, sandwiches, and when Greggs used to sell bread, bread as well. After the pasty tax, they don't even keep their pies hot.

 

[speedy1]

I've never seen the great attraction with Greggs. Pretty much every other bakery I've been into has done better pies, pastries, sandwiches, and when Greggs used to sell bread, bread as well. After the pasty tax, they don't even keep their pies hot.

It used to be cheap, quick and as Rory Sutherland says, being a chain, it set a predictable floor on quality which is highly desirable to a lot of people. Independent bakeries especially for hot breakfast sandwiches and coffee are higly variable often with a much worse floor on quality.

These days it's expensive and understaffed so far less appealing a proposition but they've built a massive brand following just like Premier Inn

Independents definitely do better pies and pastries

For anything else I much prefer a meal deal these days to Gregg's.

 

[Rab Smith]

As for Bakery chains up here in Scotland, Bayne's, Aulds and Harry Gow's are absolutely miles ahead of Greggs.

 

[AlterEgo]

I've never seen the great attraction with Greggs. Pretty much every other bakery I've been into has done better pies, pastries, sandwiches, and when Greggs used to sell bread, bread as well. After the pasty tax, they don't even keep their pies hot.

They are usually very convenient and consistent, that is pretty much their USP. But as you say the quality is not stellar.

 

[jon81uk]

I've never seen the great attraction with Greggs. Pretty much every other bakery I've been into has done better pies, pastries, sandwiches, and when Greggs used to sell bread, bread as well. After the pasty tax, they don't even keep their pies hot.

Greggs never hot held the savouries, the tax thing was a clarification, they were always working to the understanding that they weren't serving hot food, as they were not in a hot cabinet, just removed from the oven and left to cool but HMRC needed to make it clear. Even before all that discussion Gregg's didn't have hot cabinets to keep the pasties hot.

 

[styles]

Greggs never hot held the savouries, the tax thing was a clarification, they were always working to the understanding that they weren't serving hot food, as they were not in a hot cabinet, just removed from the oven and left to cool but HMRC needed to make it clear. Even before all that discussion Gregg's didn't have hot cabinets to keep the pasties hot.

No but I did have a Greggs near me who would microwave their pastries on request, and after the pasty tax clarification, they stopped. Whether their company policy supported the microwaving before or not I don't know but it certainly had an impact near me!

 

[eyebrook1961]

No but I did have a Greggs near me who would microwave their pastries on request, and after the pasty tax clarification, they stopped. Whether their company policy supported the microwaving before or not I don't know but it certainly had an impact near me!

This - also was the case here in Loughborough. Since they stopped doing "hot" (or reheated) my visits to Greggs are almost zero, unless I come across one where items have just come out the oven (the last time being the beginning of June whilst in York!)

 

[Egg Centric]

I'm not sure if it's within the spirit of the thread, but I wonder how much responsibility all these various discount schemes have for increasing headline prices and who is really benefiting.

Let's suppose I want to spend some money at Tesco.

1. Firstly, I'd be nuts not to have a clubcard. There are some - admittedly not many - who aren't able to get one (such as under 18s without parental permission, or those without a UK address).
2. One of my credit cards is offering 5% back at Tesco at the moment so long as I spend over £80. It's possible others are offering a better deal.
3. I say it's possible because I have 8(ish) credit cards because of the amount of bleeding offers and cashback combos etc and for this thread it's not worth checking them all. And of course some offer cashback as well. Sometimes this cashback is in the form of points, in one case points that can be converted into other types of points which can themselves be converted into statuses or discounts or... not... depending on the scheme
4. I don't have a Chase account but if I did I could use a debit card instead for 2% cashback
5. Alternatively, I have an option of buying Clubcard Plus for £7.99 a month and getting 10% off up to £250. A better deal if I use Tesco a lot for sizeable shops
6. Alternatively, if I'm spending less than the £80, I can through work buy an e-gift card for 4% off face value and use it immediately.
7. I can stack some of the above on each other, but not in a consistent way. For example I can stack hsbc reward points on the e-gift card and stack it on the Clubcard plus (if I had it which I don't), and then convert them to avios. I cannot however get avios directly through my avios card because this is an amex and can't be used to buy the e-gift cards. I could though use the amex to buy Clubcard plus if I wanted it. And then use the Virgin credit card (the one offering 5% at Tesco) for the actual purchase itself.
8. And why Tesco when there are other supermarkets nearby and most products sold are very similar? Well I picked them for an example. But if I really want to do a weekly shop I need to be comparing between supermarkets too. Morrisons are currently doing 10% off with a couple of my cards, but the gift cards are only at 3.5% discount. The Morrisons reward scheme is (I find) slightly more generous but of course you double the clubcard points if you spend them externally. But maybe that will change, it used to be triple. Which is a risk with all points schemes as you build up substantial balances, completely screwing up your maths!

And all of this just to buy some cumberland sausages and Pimms (your shopping basket may vary)!?!?!? Hotel and airline schemes make the above seem simple! And if you're not 100% on top of things you can get caught out by very basic stuff.

This is absolutely nuts. For a significant purchase I will put the effort in to compare all the schemes (although sometimes it's a hail mary because once you exit cash things stop being properly comparable). But I can't possibly do this for every transaction.

I've no idea who the real winners of these schemes are but I think only the credit card and gift card companies. I'm not convinced that it's the retailers or consumers. I'm sure someone with an MBA can point to very convincing looking powerpoint charts that show me I'm wrong though...

 

[Broucek]

One plus for Greggs is it is less rapacious with its pricing at service stations. And its coffee is less disgusting and tax-dodging than Starbuck

 

[styles]

I'm not sure if it's within the spirit of the thread, but I wonder how much responsibility all these various discount schemes have for increasing headline prices and who is really benefiting.

Let's suppose I want to spend some money at Tesco.

1. Firstly, I'd be nuts not to have a clubcard. There are some - admittedly not many - who aren't able to get one (such as under 18s without parental permission, or those without a UK address).
2. One of my credit cards is offering 5% back at Tesco at the moment so long as I spend over £80. It's possible others are offering a better deal.
3. I say it's possible because I have 8(ish) credit cards because of the amount of bleeding offers and cashback combos etc and for this thread it's not worth checking them all. And of course some offer cashback as well. Sometimes this cashback is in the form of points, in one case points that can be converted into other types of points which can themselves be converted into statuses or discounts or... not... depending on the scheme
4. I don't have a Chase account but if I did I could use a debit card instead for 2% cashback
5. Alternatively, I have an option of buying Clubcard Plus for £7.99 a month and getting 10% off up to £250. A better deal if I use Tesco a lot for sizeable shops
6. Alternatively, if I'm spending less than the £80, I can through work buy an e-gift card for 4% off face value and use it immediately.
7. I can stack some of the above on each other, but not in a consistent way. For example I can stack hsbc reward points on the e-gift card and stack it on the Clubcard plus (if I had it which I don't), and then convert them to avios. I cannot however get avios directly through my avios card because this is an amex and can't be used to buy the e-gift cards. I could though use the amex to buy Clubcard plus if I wanted it. And then use the Virgin credit card (the one offering 5% at Tesco) for the actual purchase itself.
8. And why Tesco when there are other supermarkets nearby and most products sold are very similar? Well I picked them for an example. But if I really want to do a weekly shop I need to be comparing between supermarkets too. Morrisons are currently doing 10% off with a couple of my cards, but the gift cards are only at 3.5% discount. The Morrisons reward scheme is (I find) slightly more generous but of course you double the clubcard points if you spend them externally. But maybe that will change, it used to be triple. Which is a risk with all points schemes as you build up substantial balances, completely screwing up your maths!

And all of this just to buy some cumberland sausages and Pimms (your shopping basket may vary)!?!?!? Hotel and airline schemes make the above seem simple! And if you're not 100% on top of things you can get caught out by very basic stuff.

This is absolutely nuts. For a significant purchase I will put the effort in to compare all the schemes (although sometimes it's a hail mary because once you exit cash things stop being properly comparable). But I can't possibly do this for every transaction.

I've no idea who the real winners of these schemes are but I think only the credit card and gift card companies. I'm not convinced that it's the retailers or consumers. I'm sure someone with an MBA can point to very convincing looking powerpoint charts that show me I'm wrong though...

And this is even more prevalent in the UK rail network.

When I travel between Wales and Scotland, split tickets can save over 50%.

26-30 Railcards have a minimum fare of £12 before 10am on weekdays, but TVMs instead of selling an £8 undiscounted ticket will offer a £12 'discounted' ticket.

16-25 Railcards also have a minimum fare of £12 before 10am on weekdays... except in July and August. So a 25 year old gets a cheaper ticket on their morning commute in the summer, while a 26 year old doesn't.

Actually age-based railcards are valid for a fixed period at the time of purchase, so a 26-30 Railcard is actually valid until the day before your 32nd birthday.

The legislation makes it an offence to travel on a 16-25 ticket when you hold a 26-30 Railcard even though the price is the same. This is stupid, to the point that the regulator had to intervene to stop people being taken to court for criminal offences when the railway wasn't even losing money.

That's before we even get into split tickets, rovers, GroupSave, TOC-specific group discounts, rangers, regional Railcards, SuperFares, ScotRail Kids For A Quid, Club Avanti, LNER cashback, the fact that mature students can get a 16-25 railcard, Scotland NEC, Unizones, GTR money back guarantee, XC feeless Advance ticket changes, PlusBus, Northern Duo, gold cards, RailMaster, Rail & Sail, flexipasses, GA pregnant passenger first class upgrades, SeatFrog, carnets, season tickets, flexi passes, etc etc.

It shouldn't require a PhD in rail fares to get a reasonably priced train ticket.

Being a consumer is crap in 2026, because the properly priced stuff is all hidden in complexity. The average person gets mugged off, either because they're a single parent without the time on their hands to study Martin Lewis' website, or they're not eligible for the best cashback credit cards, or or they don't even know Gold Cards exist.

 

[Egg Centric]

Actually age-based railcards are valid for a fixed period at the time of purchase, so a 26-30 Railcard is actually valid until the day before your 32nd birthday.

Unless of course it's a 16-17 railcard. Just nuts

 

[Broucek]

Being a consumer is crap in 2026, because the properly priced stuff is all hidden in complexity. The average person gets mugged off, either because they're a single parent without the time on their hands to study Martin Lewis' website, or they're not eligible for the best cashback credit cards, or or they don't even know Gold Cards exist.

In theory, technology should help (I'm aware not everyone can handle it) but in practice it rarely does.

I have two maths A levels and I can't handle rail fares...

 

[Sonic1234]

The Nectar/Clubcard prices are not the "proper" price, they are the special offer prices

There are some products which are always on special offer somewhere, someone with access to several of the supermarket brands would never pay full price. Pizza Express pizzas and Innocent drinks come to mind.

 

[styles]

In theory, technology should help (I'm aware not everyone can handle it) but in practice it rarely does.

I have two maths A levels and I can't handle rail fares...

Yeah, exactly, and it winds me up, because I personally benefit from these quirks. I know how split tickets work and I have a credit card which gives me cashback and I know that if I occasionally buy a Matlock to Matlock Bath ticket through the Complete Savings website I'll get a further 10% off my train tickets for the rest of the month without paying their monthly membership fee. But the average passenger doesn't know all of these quirks or "hacks" and they're losing out so that I can benefit from being more "in the know".

For state-owned operators like Transport for Wales to participate in such schemes, or LNER to call it "simpler fares" when it's neither simpler nor cheaper, I just think shows contempt for the travelling public.

Then we go to supermarkets and Tesco are marking down products fro £5 to £3 when the other supermarkets are just selling them for about £3 without a discount card. A lot of people in the UK just go to their nearest supermarket, and now if that supermarket is Sainsbury's (awaiting criticism from a forum member who was previously quite senior in Sainsbury's) you need a Nectar card to get the best deal, which means giving up your data, and then Tesco and Sainsbury's will gaslight people and tell them oh that's the price it's always been.

 

[Bald Rick]

And its coffee is less disgusting and tax-dodging than Starbuck

tax dodging aside, strong disagree!

 

[Stathern Jc]

Here's one I hadn't expected to add to this thread.

A nephew is doing a 10k swim in September to raise funds for the neonatal department where his daughter spent some time earlier in the year.

I've just been onto the well known website on which the donations are being processed.
Just before the payment page is a "voluntary contribution" towards the sites operating costs with a slider bar (which runs from 12.5% to 25%) preset at 19% of the value of your donation, there is also a less obvious button which enables a specific amount to be selected.

Now, it is perfectly reasonable to draw attention to need to cover the operating costs, which I am happy to contribute towards, and individual contributions of the default 19% on donations of £5 or £10 are quite modest.
However, for donations of say £50 or £100 and more, this 19% becomes more significant (£9.50 and £19.00 etc). It does seem that the pre-selected amount of "commission" is then on the high side and could easily be paid inadvertently by anyone unfamiliar with the website or not paying full attention. In this situation most donors would prefer to see more of their total payment reaching the cause which they are supporting.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

People will pay whatever they think is good value/good quality etc, even if the price seems like a rip-off. I'd rather a coffee from Gail's or my local independent coffee shop than from Greggs. I even tend to avoid Costa now - I don't like their customer service and the fact that their philosophy is based around speed rather than actually taking the time to listen to what I want (so they get my coffee wrong)

 

[Sonic1234]

I even tend to avoid Costa now

Costa have got themselves stuck in the middle, and have closed quite a few branches. They still do well in small towns where they are the only option, or at least the only chain option. The coffee is priced comparable to Gail's, yet their cafes and baked goods don't have the quality and has more of a fast food vibe. Customers who value quality go to Gail's and independents, the value conscious go to Greggs.