Next priority project - re-doubling of SW mainline.

[Zomboid]

To keep a decent line speed through the gauntlet track section, wouldn't you have to have switched frogs due to the acute angle needed? If so is it any easier than just installing normal pointwork?

Depends, does a 70mph switch have a movable frog? The even allowing for the tighter radius to avoid the second rail, it oughtn't be a hugely restricted speed through such a thing.

Though this is all obviously fantasy.

 

[The Planner]

Maybe so, but that's life! (Isn't that their job?) If they can cope with sets of "points" then surely one fixed crossing each end of a gauntletted section should be welcomed by them? Tell them to be grateful that there are no switches to be looked after too...

They would probably prefer the switches!

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 12 Jul 2026 ==

but lots of savings on fitting and maintaining moving parts of points, power supplies to point motors etc., power cables to be nicked. With gauntletted track "just" the signalling stuff...

Most of which apply to signalling too.

 

[devon_belle]

Depends, does a 70mph switch have a movable frog? The even allowing for the tighter radius to avoid the second rail, it oughtn't be a hugely restricted speed through such a thing.

Though this is all obviously fantasy.

I suppose the more important thing would be designing the layout to prioritise acceleration of trains starting out at Pinhoe, to clear the bottleneck quickly.

Fantasy indeed! When I'm king......

 

[Zomboid]

I suppose the more important thing would be designing the layout to prioritise acceleration of trains starting out at Pinhoe, to clear the bottleneck quickly.

Fantasy indeed! When I'm king......

With a gauntlet arrangement maybe both lines could deviate slightly like a model style Y point. I'm no track designer though so that might be a terrible idea.

Realistically, a dynamic loop between Feniton and Whimple, extension of the Honiton loop so it can pass diverted GWML trains and a westward extension of the Tisbury loop would probably be sufficient to run a far more frequent service than will realistically be needed any time soon.

 

[devon_belle]

With a gauntlet arrangement maybe both lines could deviate slightly like a model style Y point. I'm no track designer though so that might be a terrible idea.

After writing the last message I remembered NR love using standard components so it would most likely be a pair of normal points facing each other, either side of the M5 bridge.

Realistically, a dynamic loop between Feniton and Whimple, extension of the Honiton loop so it can pass diverted GWML trains and a westward extension of the Tisbury loop would probably be sufficient to run a far more frequent service than will realistically be needed any time soon.

Agree. Long term I'd like to see trains from Okehampton, Barnstaple, and Taunton go to Axminster, but that needs more than just double tracking WEML. Principally more paths through Exeter Bank, which is no mean feat. And if you're doing that, why not just improve the Exmouth branch and save the headaches of WEML. Cases can probably be made for both.

At least the outlook for the Exeter area is positive as Devon County Council have been very pro rail. Dorset Council less so, from what I can tell.

 

[AndrewE]

After writing the last message I remembered NR love using standard components so it would most likely be a pair of normal points facing each other, either side of the M5 bridge.

couldn't you just use 2 standard crossings, i.e. without the switches? Apart from special bent rails and extra long sleepers it is all standard stuff then

 

[CdBrux]

In the discussion around boosting passenger numbers at Honiton & Axminster (as railheads for surrounding towns and villages) via improved service would car parking provision at those stations, or at the least integrated busses, need some consideration?

 

[zwk500]

couldn't you just use 2 standard crossings, i.e. without the switches?

You could, but with gauntlet track you are only really saving the costs of detecting, proving and maintaining the point ends. You will still need the signals interlocked to prevent conflicting movements, and will still have 2 frogs/crossings to maintain.

Apart from special bent rails and extra long sleepers it is all standard stuff then

Which are specialist pieces that are likely going to cost a comparable amount to the cost of including 2 extra point ends, as that's the only additional requirement for a brief section of single track compared to guantlet track. Gauntlet track will also require a slightly larger structure gauge than single track, if it isn't already provided for.

Also if you have the turnouts, you can include the ability to turn back using them (potentially saving 2 turnouts elsewhere). The opportunity to use the single track bottleneck as part of bi-di setup is also possible - bi-di has been included on other parts of the WoE line so it may be justifiable expense here.

 

[Zomboid]

Also if you have the turnouts, you can include the ability to turn back using them (potentially saving 2 turnouts elsewhere). The opportunity to use the single track bottleneck as part of bi-di setup is also possible - bi-di has been included on other parts of the WoE line so it may be justifiable expense here

Certainly you'd expect any new loops to be bi directional on both tracks. Must be a pretty marginal cost when starting from a plain single line.

Gauntlet track is just a bit of fun to chat about, the line through there isn't going to be doubled and if it were then it'd be a conventional back to back switches arrangement.

 

[brad465]

This might be just outside scope, but is served by SWR services - I'd consider Castle Cary-Yeovil to be part of any redoubling. This would help allow hourly Weymouth services all day on top of the Yeovil SWR services, improve resilience and assist in GWR diversions when part or all of Castle Cary-Exeter is shut. Apart from maybe a pinch point at the Castle Cary end, you could redouble the whole section without any station upgrades, as both ends have multi-platform stations anyway and no intermediate stations exist here.

 

[devon_belle]

This might be just outside scope, but is served by SWR services - I'd consider Castle Cary-Yeovil to be part of any redoubling. This would help allow hourly Weymouth services all day on top of the Yeovil SWR services, improve resilience and assist in GWR diversions when part or all of Castle Cary-Exeter is shut. Apart from maybe a pinch point at the Castle Cary end, you could redouble the whole section without any station upgrades, as both ends have multi-platform stations anyway and no intermediate stations exist here.

Heart of Wessex improvements would probably be a good subject for a separate thread, although it has definitely been discussed before at length. To provide 1 tph to Weymouth would require extension of double track at Castle Cary and signalling/track improvements at Maiden Newton. However, Westbury and Weymouth would probably need infrastructure enhancements to avoid extra trains causing congestion.

Back on topic, there is seemingly a vague desire to stop Heart of Wessex trains at Yeovil Junction via a new south chord and reopening of platform 3 there. It remains to be seen how that would interact with the WEML (especially as it would need to cross over before/after reversing), but if 2 tph can be achieved Salisbury to Yeovil Junction (via Tisbury loop expansion) it would provide some very attractive regional links. Couple that with 2 tph Exeter to Yeovil (less likely as the priority is Devon Metro) and you have even better options. Longer term, if capacity is released west of Yeovil Junction and via Maiden Newton I could see an Exeter to Weymouth service being well used. The A35 is pretty terrible and congested.

I will holster my crayons.


Above are the 'potential' intervention packages outlined by the West of England route study (2020) explaining which infrastructure measures lead to which benefits on WEML.

 

[brad465]

Heart of Wessex improvements would probably be a good subject for a separate thread, although it has definitely been discussed before at length. To provide 1 tph to Weymouth would require extension of double track at Castle Cary and signalling/track improvements at Maiden Newton. However, Westbury and Weymouth would probably need infrastructure enhancements to avoid extra trains causing congestion.

Back on topic, there is seemingly a vague desire to stop Heart of Wessex trains at Yeovil Junction via a new south chord and reopening of platform 3 there. It remains to be seen how that would interact with the WEML (especially as it would need to cross over before/after reversing), but if 2 tph can be achieved Salisbury to Yeovil Junction (via Tisbury loop expansion) it would provide some very attractive regional links. Couple that with 2 tph Exeter to Yeovil (less likely as the priority is Devon Metro) and you have. Longer term, if capacity is released west of Yeovil Junction and via Maiden Newton I could see an Exeter to Weymouth service being well used. The A35 is pretty terrible and congested.

I will holster my crayons.

View attachment 207600
Above are the 'potential' intervention packages outlined by the West of England route study (2020) explaining which infrastructure measures lead to which benefits on WEML.

Yeovil Jct needs some serious improvements to connect it to the town centre. If a proper road/cycle/bus option can't be provided, then more services between Pen Mill and Jct would certainly help, especially if they connect well with trains in both directions along the WEML. Pen Mill though is only beneficial for the east of Yeovil.

 

[martin butler]

Whatever enhancements are possible, the line speed will still need to be raised, so that more modern forms of traction, can better use their acceleration to clear single line sections, and to enable more frequent services, Lets say, for example the lines PW was uprated so that services could run at 90mph, what impact would that have on services,

 

[swt_passenger]

Whatever enhancements are possible, the line speed will still need to be raised, so that more modern forms of traction, can better use their acceleration to clear single line sections, and to enable more frequent services, Lets say, for example the lines PW was uprated so that services could run at 90mph, what impact would that have on services,

Not much at all as the current line speed seems to be 85 mph almost throughout the Devon single track area. There’s a slight reduction through Honiton, and over the diverging junctions either side of Axminster, both are stations where all trains would normally stop.
(Ignoring any TSRs).

 

[brad465]

Whatever enhancements are possible, the line speed will still need to be raised, so that more modern forms of traction, can better use their acceleration to clear single line sections, and to enable more frequent services, Lets say, for example the lines PW was uprated so that services could run at 90mph, what impact would that have on services,

Negligible because the top speed west of Salisbury is 85mph. You'd need to go for 100mph to have more realistic reductions and have the next fleet with this as a top speed. There may also be value in raising the linespeed from Worting Jct-Salisbury to 100mph from 90mph to allow trains to get to Salisbury sooner (on top of being able to do 100mph between Farnborough and Basingstoke). If enough reduction can be made, then Tisbury station may not need redoubling, instead significantly extend the Gillingham loop east and have trains pass here instead.

 

[Snow1964]

In the discussion around boosting passenger numbers at Honiton & Axminster (as railheads for surrounding towns and villages) via improved service would car parking provision at those stations, or at the least integrated busses, need some consideration?

There isn't that much around Honiton, there is Sidmouth and Ottery St Mary to the South West (which used to have own line, and for some journeys Exmouth line is nearer). Everything else within about 10 miles of Honiton is more like a hamlet than even village sized.

Axminster could be seen as rail head for Seaton, Coryton and Lyme Regis, but again there are only really small villages and Hamlets within about a 10 mile radius. Going north of Axminster, only really got Chard and Illminster (and they are almost half way to Taunton where there are much more frequent services)

If serving populated areas is important would probably be looking at reopening the line from near Tipton St John's (and Exmouth branch was doubled to here for decades), building a short connection then rebuilding the line via Ottery St Mary though to near Seaton Junction where a London facing spur could be built. In some ways if going to do a second track, having one run via the population areas is better than rebuilding second track miles from where most live, west of Axminster.

 

[Ploughman]

What is the arrangement for the single line over Ribblehead Viaduct on the S and C?
How would that compare?

 

[stevieinselby]

What is the arrangement for the single line over Ribblehead Viaduct on the S and C?
How would that compare?

The line through Honiton sees about twice as many train movements a day as Ribblehead – and Ribblehead is a solitary single-track section of less than 1 mile, the entirety of the rest of the route between Carlisle and Leeds is double track, so in terms of pathing trains along a busier route with numerous long single-track sections, the South West Mainline is much more complex than the Settle & Carlisle.

 

[sharpener]

What is the arrangement for the single line over Ribblehead Viaduct on the S and C?
How would that compare?

Sorry can't help you with that despite a quick search. But staying in the SW the Royal Albert Bridge over the Tamar has conventional points at its W end and again at St Budeaux Ferry Road according to Traksy and my Quail plans.

 

[Bald Rick]

This proposal is primarily to alleviate the ongoing problem of embankment shrinkage.

The answer to that, of course, is to repair the embankments.

 

[yorksrob]

The answer to that, of course, is to repair the embankments.

Well, there is that. I'm not sure how much of it there needs to be repaired though. If it's long enough it might be an opportunity to install more double track at the same time.

Let's face it, single track is never going to be optimal for a route like this.

 

[The Planner]

Well, there is that. I'm not sure how much of it there needs to be repaired though. If it's long enough it might be an opportunity to install more double track at the same time.

Let's face it, single track is never going to be optimal for a route like this.

Renewal vs enhancement, the forner 95% of the time wins out. The other option is do nothing.

 

[Zomboid]

Renewal vs enhancement, the forner 95% of the time wins out. The other option is do nothing.

In terms of enhancements, what kind of service spec would be needed for doubling throughout? 4 tph? Some setup with a mix of fast and slow trains?

 

[martin butler]

In terms of enhancements, what kind of service spec would be needed for doubling throughout? 4 tph? Some setup with a mix of fast and slow trains?

One per hour fast limited stop , Clapham junction Woking basingstoke Andover Salisbury Yeovil Junction, Exeter central Exeter St Davids, ONE at 30 mins past calling same as far as Basingstike, then all stations to Yeovil thense on to Weymouth,
an all stations to Exeter central , and 1 ph, fast to Yeovil then all stations to Okehampton

 

[Zomboid]

One per hour fast limited stop , Clapham junction Woking basingstoke Andover Salisbury Yeovil Junction, Exeter central Exeter St Davids, ONE at 30 mins past calling same as far as Basingstike, then all stations to Yeovil thense on to Weymouth,
an all stations to Exeter central , and 1 ph, fast to Yeovil then all stations to Okehampton

If there's a limited stop train in this crayon sandwich, don't passenger numbers (from up the thread) suggest that Axminster and Honiton need a call? Apparently busier than Yeovil, though Pen Mill might be muddying the waters a bit on that.

 

[The exile]

There isn't that much around Honiton, there is Sidmouth and Ottery St Mary to the South West (which used to have own line, and for some journeys Exmouth line is nearer). Everything else within about 10 miles of Honiton is more like a hamlet than even village sized.

Honiton as a railhead for Sidmouth etc only makes any real sense if you’re heading east (or possibly if the Honiton bus stops outside your front door).

 

[devon_belle]

In terms of enhancements, what kind of service spec would be needed for doubling throughout? 4 tph? Some setup with a mix of fast and slow trains?

Devon Metro could probably sweep up 4 tph west of Axminster, contingent on more trains getting through Exeter, likely requiring enhancements at Exeter Central at least. I could see 2 tph from Waterloo being supported (probably one semifast and one stopper east of Axminster; there's no point trying to compete with GWR expresses in my opinion).

Any limited call should certainly call at Gillingham, Yeovil Junction, Axminster, Honiton, and Cranbrook in my opinion. I wouldn't say Cranbrook but a brand new town losing its London service would be politically poor.

 

[Danoota]

Predictably SWR have announced that there will be "temporary timetable changes" on the West of England Line with effect from next Monday, 10th August. This will include trains between Yeovil Junction and Exeter being reduced to one every two hours

Reading the associated press release I note that "SWR and NR Wessex are also working with the University of Southampton to develop longer-term measures to improve the resilience of the West of England line to the effects of climate change and extreme weather". I look forward to reading more on this and can't help feeling that a big part of the problem is the massive increase in vegetation on the line which has occurred during the past 30 years or so. The embankments - which are still the same size as they were in the 'glory days' of the Atlantic Coast Express - were never designed to support all those trees absorbing moisture. As things stand the train service is, once again, back to the low point we experienced after the singling of the line in 1967. Who knows how long the "temporary timetable" will be in place for?

 

[yorksrob]

Predictably SWR have announced that there will be "temporary timetable changes" on the West of England Line with effect from next Monday, 10th August. This will include trains between Yeovil Junction and Exeter being reduced to one every two hours

Reading the associated press release I note that "SWR and NR Wessex are also working with the University of Southampton to develop longer-term measures to improve the resilience of the West of England line to the effects of climate change and extreme weather". I look forward to reading more on this and can't help feeling that a big part of the problem is the massive increase in vegetation on the line which has occurred during the past 30 years or so. The embankments - which are still the same size as they were in the 'glory days' of the Atlantic Coast Express - were never designed to support all those trees absorbing moisture. As things stand the train service is, once again, back to the low point we experienced after the singling of the line in 1967. Who knows how long the "temporary timetable" will be in place for?

I hope they come up with something that works. We can't go on having this level of disruption every year.

 

[AndrewE]

I hope they come up with something that works. We can't go on having this level of disruption every year.

Agreed. Definitely deal with the trees, then put something like piles at the bottom plus a couple of layers of gabions, then procede as the GWSR did on their Gotherington slip repairs: https://bridgestobroadway.blogspot.com/2026/05/gotherington-slip-repairs-week-4.html