Go Cornwall Bus

[Cheers Drive]

You said you have no dog in the race but In every post over the last few years you are super biased to Go Ahead and love to slate First.
I worked for both of these companies I even helped build TFC in 2020 quite a few of my ideas and plans were used but the company itself has a really bad attitude and professionally wise you can literally see the difference between management and drivers of both entities.
I was one of not many who abandoned GC and went the other way to First. I will day after having worked for First bus all over the UK predominantly Bristol I could see that they weren’t up to Bristol or big depot standards they weren’t training people on routes like they are meant to and it felt like I skipped one cowboy for another. But I was wrong you could see the difference in procedures and maintenance and pride of the service. Managers ar Go Ahead would often be in fights scuffles or like I said previously there were many reports there of sxl harassment from managers and drivers we even got told by senior managers to try and catch some drivers out on petty things so they could fire them. There was an atmosphere of bullying and people who had no right being in their respective positions. I could have started this company as a manager when they were hiring they hired drivers with no experience and put them in management positions. The managers they had for some depots were slated by the staff and other depot managers for being inept and all types of other defamatory remarks. This would have never happened at First as they have a different level of professional standards they really are the more responsible and more organised business across the board. As a driver I felt safer at First both bus wise and staff wise. As for the buses now It looks so bad the state of the buses GC take zero pride in anything they do they’re just in this for the money and Richard Steven’s vendetta of kicking out First he told me this himself I wish I’d recorded all the phone calls and emails we had together as he is a nasty piece of work a real bully.
Passenger wise now all I see are people moaning about the huge delays buses are always leaving late drivers regularly get lost or Don’t turn up on time for services and the drivers have even left people stranded in remote areas myself included with no explanation they just shout last stop and then offer no help on what we can do as they don’t know and don’t care they don’t have pride in their job especially looking at the difference in driving standards. First train their drivers very well whereas Go Ahead and Stagecoach too are awful training they don’t even train drivers how to use the ramp or help wheelchair passengers. As most first drivers would lower the suspension for elderly most of the GC drivers don’t I’ve caught them speeding too in most areas and they don’t even wait for passengers to get up the stairs before pulling off the journeys now are so much more uncomfortable and most days im on a 2006 ex London trident. This is no improvement over Kernow they fell out with the council over refusing to spray their fleet red for TFC contract and other things and decided to give Go Ahead the full prize of tenders this is very hostile action to a company that is based in Cornwall staffed by Cornish and then they handed it all to Devon. Kernow put in money and infrastructure and GC have been extremely lucky to not have to pay for much they had it all handed to them there is something disgusting about this from the council. Anyway yes your always bias I would suggest you either have a personal issue with First Bus or you work for Go Ahead.
All I can state is facts on what I see and most of the passengers are now receiving a much lower standard of public service and what for why?

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

You said you have no dog in the race but In every post over the last few years you are super biased to Go Ahead and love to slate First.
I worked for both of these companies I even helped build TFC in 2020 quite a few of my ideas and plans were used but the company itself has a really bad attitude and professionally wise you can literally see the difference between management and drivers of both entities.
I was one of not many who abandoned GC and went the other way to First. I will day after having worked for First bus all over the UK predominantly Bristol I could see that they weren’t up to Bristol or big depot standards they weren’t training people on routes like they are meant to and it felt like I skipped one cowboy for another. But I was wrong you could see the difference in procedures and maintenance and pride of the service. Managers ar Go Ahead would often be in fights scuffles or like I said previously there were many reports there of sxl harassment from managers and drivers we even got told by senior managers to try and catch some drivers out on petty things so they could fire them. There was an atmosphere of bullying and people who had no right being in their respective positions. I could have started this company as a manager when they were hiring they hired drivers with no experience and put them in management positions. The managers they had for some depots were slated by the staff and other depot managers for being inept and all types of other defamatory remarks. This would have never happened at First as they have a different level of professional standards they really are the more responsible and more organised business across the board. As a driver I felt safer at First both bus wise and staff wise. As for the buses now It looks so bad the state of the buses GC take zero pride in anything they do they’re just in this for the money and Richard Steven’s vendetta of kicking out First he told me this himself I wish I’d recorded all the phone calls and emails we had together as he is a nasty piece of work a real bully.
Passenger wise now all I see are people moaning about the huge delays buses are always leaving late drivers regularly get lost or Don’t turn up on time for services and the drivers have even left people stranded in remote areas myself included with no explanation they just shout last stop and then offer no help on what we can do as they don’t know and don’t care they don’t have pride in their job especially looking at the difference in driving standards. First train their drivers very well whereas Go Ahead and Stagecoach too are awful training they don’t even train drivers how to use the ramp or help wheelchair passengers. As most first drivers would lower the suspension for elderly most of the GC drivers don’t I’ve caught them speeding too in most areas and they don’t even wait for passengers to get up the stairs before pulling off the journeys now are so much more uncomfortable and most days im on a 2006 ex London trident. This is no improvement over Kernow they fell out with the council over refusing to spray their fleet red for TFC contract and other things and decided to give Go Ahead the full prize of tenders this is very hostile action to a company that is based in Cornwall staffed by Cornish and then they handed it all to Devon. Kernow put in money and infrastructure and GC have been extremely lucky to not have to pay for much they had it all handed to them there is something disgusting about this from the council. Anyway yes your always bias I would suggest you either have a personal issue with First Bus or you work for Go Ahead.
All I can state is facts on what I see and most of the passengers are now receiving a much lower standard of public service and what for why?

Let me respond. I am not super biased to anyone, nor slating anyone. I have no dog in the fight - no bias, no influence. I've not worked for either. I always try to be as impartial and objective as is possible when talking about any operator. I've criticised Go Ahead with the East Anglian business, as I thought it was appropriate, and praised First for their West of England operations - I say it as I see it, and I'm painfully aware that it is a personal view.

So if you would care to read some more of my many posts you will see some very clear themes, not least the respect and praise that I gave to the Alex Carter/Marc Morgan-Huws team in how they dealt with the basket case that was First South West when they inherited it. They took a business that had been systematically uncared for, managed and then removed the Plymouth operation whilst saving many jobs and protecting First's backside at the same time in terms of exit liabilities. Then also set about removing the two biggest threats to the remaining ops (i.e. Western Greyhound and Webberbus) and they achieved that by employing many of the same tactics that Go Ahead used to oust First - large scale competitive registrations. They also moved to develop strong identities in Somerset and Cornwall - BoS never did meet its potential but then again, Somerset CC is skint and the operating territory is simply not as strong.

However, in Kernow, they transformed the business. The fleet received almost unprecedented investment; it had more new double deckers in 2017 than it had in the previous 35 years and the end of the new bus grant. New Solos arrived (though I said at the time that their use on the A17 was surprising) and e200mmc. Not just that but they rejuvenated the coaching arm. So when you think I have some anti-First bias... well, lord save me. However, it also absolutely true that the loss of the council contracts and then Covid changed the whole picture for First Kernow. We will never know how they might have dealt with that loss but clearly Covid had a major impact on the financial viability of the business - that's not opinion - that's fact as listed in the published accounts. In the last days of the AC/MMH era, the cracks were appearing and things tolerated that were never accepted in the past in terms of appearance. The withdrawal of the Atlantic Coaster and the reduction of the Lands End Coaster before the open toppers were then pulled, were all indicative of the rowing back of the entrepreneurial initiatives under Simon Goff's charge.

As for your Cornwall vs. Devon comments... that's frankly not true. The council can't award to a Cornish company "on principal" - that's part of UK Government procurement rules which guard the process. Also, I think you're referring to the provision of the Cormac yards - again, that was something available to all bidders; it was a way for the procurement people to "level the playing field" as otherwise, First would've had an advantage. This is something you see on a bigger scale in Greater Manchester - there they levelled the playing field by providing the depots (and the fleet in great measure) so it makes the tender process more competitive and forces the price down. That's what happens - it's governed by procurement regulations and if First felt that the process was inherently unfair, they (or Stagecoach) could've raised an objection; remember when First won West Coast from Virgin who did exactly that and were able to demonstrate the flawed approach.

Now as I said, I have no experience of Richard Stevens, the culture or what goes on behind the scenes. I certainly can't comment on things such as bullying or harassment. I speak only from what I've seen and experienced solely as a passenger. My experience of Go Cornwall Bus as a passenger over the last few years has been of an achingly dull if competent operation. I've not experienced poor customer service from drivers, not felt endangered. Every vehicle has turned up virtually to time. Again, I've been consistent in my views which are borne of personal experience - the vehicle specs are generally rather basic; the 17/69 plate deckers are better but otherwise you have dealer spec or some spartan ex London stuff. Vehicle presentation is often underwhelming and discordant and in fact, I said this after a trip to Plymouth in March...

A 15 min wait at Derriford allows me to look at the Plymouth Citybus fleet, and it really is a curate's egg of an operation. The brand new stuff is really smart - the rest is a mix of slightly dull red and an unkempt look until a six year old e200 arrives... it looks like it's spent those years in the South Atlantic. Dull paintwork, scuffs, bodged repairs with pot riveting - it looks terrible.

...which is hardly a biased pro GA view?

I do understand where @Goldfish62 comes from when you compare Go South West with the operations further along the south coast. Operations like Brighton and Hove, More and Southern Vectis are miles ahead of GSW and it seems inexplicable how standards can vary. That said, it's what happens - you just have to compare Stagecoach West and Stagecoach Wales to see quite different approaches. Part of that is local management culture/approach, partly a reflection of the local authority and the local bus market. I've also worked with lots of government bodies, worked on big transition projects (incl. TUPE transfers, opening new sites, etc) so I also appreciate that a lot goes on in the background. So have Go Ahead made mistakes - undoubtedly. Could they do better - undoubtedly. Am I surprised or disappointed with how things are after four/five months - no, not really as I had limited expectations given their previous record/nature of the operating territory/time elapsed.

And that really is it. No bias - no personal grievances - no dog in the fight.

Of course, but if they lose a lot of their supported work then rotating buses through Milehouse looks more viable for the remaining operations than opening a full maintenance base in Cambourne. If Go Ahead wins big in 2028, they may well open a full maintenance base in Cornwall, If they don't, then I'd expect buses to continue to cycle through Milehouse.

Perhaps we should think... why did Go Ahead take on Camborne, Truro and Summercourt depots? They could've avoided some or all of those costs - think Summercourt is rented, and they'll all have business rates plus utilities and property maintenance costs. Instead, they could simply have a yard somewhere rather than those additional costs.

I suspect that the plan is realign the operating locations in due course. As has been alluded to, don't know if Truro still has its MOT status (so are they having to cycle via Milehouse) and when First moved out, did the deal include the plant and machinery at those sites? I don't know but perhaps the full suite of maintenance services is something that they'll be building towards.

Neither Bodmin nor Liskeard are particularly large towns. Historically bus services between the two were always very thin. Other than Dobwalls there are no settlements and Trago Mills has always been car centric.

Absolutely right. There's very few chimney pots on that stretch. IIRC, I think Western National c.1995 had a few shopper expresses across that territory, and then they got pulled. It was only under Western Greyhound that I think there was a proper link.

 

[JKP]

Yes, it was only under Western Greyhound that a frequent link was run between Bodmin Road/Parkway and Liskeard which was their way of linking up the 55 Padstow route with their Liskeard to Plymouth route.

 

[YorkRailFan]

Perhaps we should think... why did Go Ahead take on Camborne, Truro and Summercourt depots? They could've avoided some or all of those costs - think Summercourt is rented, and they'll all have business rates plus utilities and property maintenance costs. Instead, they could simply have a yard somewhere rather than those additional costs.

Who knows. Perhaps Go Ahead wanted to centralise from their various outstations and perhaps save some money from leasing sites shared with Cormac by having proper depots centralised in the county. Compared to yards there is the option, should Go Ahead do well In the 2028 tender, to expand the maintenance provision in Camborne (as an example). I think Go Ahead is taking a cautious approach depending how well they do in 2028.

I suspect that the plan is realign the operating locations in due course. As has been alluded to, don't know if Truro still has its MOT status (so are they having to cycle via Milehouse) and when First moved out, did the deal include the plant and machinery at those sites? I don't know but perhaps the full suite of maintenance services is something that they'll be building towards.

I agree about realigning operations, the 2028 tenders will be pivotal in this and I think Go Ahead is cautious to expand maintenance in Cornwall before they know the scale of their operations post-2028. This is a very understandable position to take otherwise they risk ending up like First did after losing the tender in 2020 (not factoring in the global pandemic here).

 

[Goldfish62]

Who knows. Perhaps Go Ahead wanted to centralise from their various outstations and perhaps save some money from leasing sites shared with Cormac by having proper depots centralised in the county. Compared to yards there is the option, should Go Ahead do well In the 2028 tender, to expand the maintenance provision in Camborne (as an example). I think Go Ahead is taking a cautious approach depending how well they do in 2028.

I assume the leases on all the Cormac sites will expire concurrent with the current contracts, allowing them to be offered up again to successful bidders. That is except for Penzance, where the former First part of the site now taken over by GCB was under separate leasing arrangements. Penzance is currently undergoing redevelopment as a future potential multi-operator site so I'd expect sufficient space to enable the supported routes in the area to be operated from will be offered up in the forthcoming tenders.

 

[MotCO]

Do we yet know if the 2028 contract will allow a single contractor, or will it be spread over different lots with different operators, Manchester style? This might explain GCB's current cautious approach.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Who knows. Perhaps Go Ahead wanted to centralise from their various outstations and perhaps save some money from leasing sites shared with Cormac by having proper depots centralised in the county. Compared to yards there is the option, should Go Ahead do well In the 2028 tender, to expand the maintenance provision in Camborne (as an example). I think Go Ahead is taking a cautious approach depending how well they do in 2028.

They would only do that if there was a demonstrable benefit. That's a lot of cost they are taking on when you factor in things like property leases, heat, light, power, business rates, and that's cost that they are taking now. Hence why I expect them to look to consolidate, with one eye on getting efficiencies now and with a view to 2028.

Two other things to consider if they don't retain the tenders in 2028:

• They will have the option of exiting some of sites as they are leased
• If they don't have some of their own bases, they'll have a problem if they can't use Cormac sites

I assume the leases on all the Cormac sites will expire concurrent with the current contracts, allowing them to be offered up again to successful bidders. That is except for Penzance, where the former First part of the site now taken over by GCB was under separate leasing arrangements. Penzance is currently undergoing redevelopment as a future potential multi-operator site so I'd expect sufficient space to enable the supported routes in the area to be operated from will be offered up in the forthcoming tenders.

I would assume that they are co-terminus. Now there is one dominant operator, I think Cornwall Council will have to make them available again to level that playing field but that's just my opinion.

Do we yet know if the 2028 contract will allow a single contractor, or will it be spread over different lots with different operators, Manchester style? This might explain GCB's current cautious approach.

Not seen anything yet but Manchester is a totally different beast. That's franchising - this is not.

 

[Goldfish62]

Do we yet know if the 2028 contract will allow a single contractor, or will it be spread over different lots with different operators, Manchester style? This might explain GCB's current cautious approach.

The 2019 tendering exercise took the form of multiple lots. GA submitted a single non-compliant bid for all of them which happened to be the most economically advantageous tender. As the rules only allowed either individual compliant bids for each lot or non-compliant bids, but not both this was an enormous risk for GA as they could have ended up with nothing and lost all their existing SE Cornwall work.

The council may or may not wish to avoid a similar outcome next time and similarly GA may decide, wisely probably, that it will would be too much to expect the same outcome next time as well.

Similarly, Hopleys and particular OTS must be a bit nervous as they've done well through their sub-contracting arrangements with GA.

 

[YorkRailFan]

They would only do that if there was a demonstrable benefit. That's a lot of cost they are taking on when you factor in things like property leases, heat, light, power, business rates, and that's cost that they are taking now. Hence why I expect them to look to consolidate, with one eye on getting efficiencies now and with a view to 2028.

Two other things to consider if they don't retain the tenders in 2028:

• They will have the option of exiting some of sites as they are leased
• If they don't have some of their own bases, they'll have a problem if they can't use Cormac sites

Agree, Go Ahead is trying to position themselves as a very appealing operator ahead of 2028 in terms of efficiency and at the same time prepare for some losses as it's unlikely that they will win at the same scale as a they did in 2020. The depots allow them to grow maintenance operations should they win big in 2028, but also not be too affected should they lose and not be able to access Cormac sites for the commercial operations.

If tenders go in 2028, Go Ahead's commercial network is centred the same as First's was. There might be some problems at the extremities of the network with only having the former First depots but places like Bude (as an example of the more out of reach places from the depots) fall under the tendered network so I shouldn't expect not being able to lease Cormac sites being too big of an issue for the commercial network and any tendered network should be able to use Cormac sites should Cornwall Council continue the agreement.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Agree, Go Ahead is trying to position themselves as a very appealing operator ahead of 2028 in terms of efficiency and at the same time prepare for some losses as it's unlikely that they will win at the same scale as a they did in 2020. The depots allow them to grow maintenance operations should they win big in 2028, but also not be too affected should they lose and not be able to access Cormac sites for the commercial operations.

If tenders go in 2028, Go Ahead's commercial network is centred the same as First's was. There might be some problems at the extremities of the network with only having the former First depots but places like Bude (as an example of the more out of reach places from the depots) fall under the tendered network so I shouldn't expect not being able to lease Cormac sites being too big of an issue for the commercial network and any tendered network should be able to use Cormac sites should Cornwall Council continue the agreement.

I think the point is that they're likely to be developing the maintenance capability anyway. I don't know (and don't know if anyone is "in the know" that can confirm) but did the depots come with the plant and machinery and tools after First vacated them? Does Truro still have it's MOT testing status? It's things like that may mean vehicles will have to cycle via Milehouse for the foreseeable. It's quite the cost to take now.

I don't think that it's preparation if they win big in 2028 - they're unlikely to have much more than they have already. It gives them the security of sites if they don't retain some/all their council work to continue their commercial work. There's little commercial work that can't be covered by the three ex First depots, the multi-operator Penzance site, and Liskeard depot.

 

[Tetchytyke]

Now being specific about the issues of smaller vehicles and passengers crush loaded onto vehicles... what about the Sprinters on the M6, and the Solos before that? Is a 19 seat Solo better than a 29 seat e200mmc?

I think the issue on the M6 is that you had three Sprinters an hour, so about 60 seats an hour, and they were rammed in summer.

They've replaced that with two short wheelbase E200MMCs but that's still only about 60 seats an hour, just on a worse frequency.

Go-Ahead were originally using double deckers on the 6 so at least the reduced frequency was offset by the significant capacity increase. But now they've reversed the capacity increase and just left the reduced frequency and the reduced route.

 

[Goldfish62]

I think the issue on the M6 is that you had three Sprinters an hour, so about 60 seats an hour, and they were rammed in summer.

They've replaced that with two short wheelbase E200MMCs but that's still only about 60 seats an hour, just on a worse frequency.

Go-Ahead were originally using double deckers on the 6 so at least the reduced frequency was offset by the significant capacity increase. But now they've reversed the capacity increase and just left the reduced frequency and the reduced route.

The only upside is that the E200s have substantially more standing capacity - and standing on the Sprinters wasn't the best experience to say the least. However, passengers on the route are predominantly elderly so the amount of seating is the critical factor.

I can understand why GCB has moved mainly to the shortest E200s due to some quite heavy grounding damage caused to longer buses, but of course that doesn't help with the promised capacity increase. Double decks still do occasionally appear, such as on the morning of Mazey Day, which was very useful, but clearly the initial idea of using them routinely has been shelved. 9.8m E200s would be the happy medium - short enough, but with a clear capacity boost. Shame that the ones bought new for Cornwall have moved to Dartline.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

I think the issue on the M6 is that you had three Sprinters an hour, so about 60 seats an hour, and they were rammed in summer.

They've replaced that with two short wheelbase E200MMCs but that's still only about 60 seats an hour, just on a worse frequency.

Go-Ahead were originally using double deckers on the 6 so at least the reduced frequency was offset by the significant capacity increase. But now they've reversed the capacity increase and just left the reduced frequency and the reduced route.

We moved on since then I was under the misapprehension that the Sprinters were smaller as they are erroneously listed on BusListsontheWeb. It's fair comment - the capacity is now much the same now (when the short mmcs are used) as was but at a lower frequency.

They have one short and one long on there today if bustimes is to be believed. I did wonder if grounding might have been an issue. You referring to the 22** e200mmc @Goldfish62 ?

 

[YorkRailFan]

I don't think that it's preparation if they win big in 2028 - they're unlikely to have much more than they have already. It gives them the security of sites if they don't retain some/all their council work to continue their commercial work. There's little commercial work that can't be covered by the three ex First depots, the multi-operator Penzance site, and Liskeard depot.

My point exactly. I think the provision of Cormac sites is almost irrelevant, if Go Ahead wins tenders then they'll have access to Cormac sites if necessary to operate the tendered services, if they don't win any then they don't need the Cormac sites as the depots cover the commercial network well and they presumably wouldn't have access to the Cormac sites. It gives Go Ahead flexibility prior to the tenders.

 

[Goldfish62]

My point exactly. I think the provision of Cormac sites is almost irrelevant, if Go Ahead wins tenders then they'll have access to Cormac sites if necessary to operate the tendered services, if they don't win any then they don't need the Cormac sites as the depots cover the commercial network well and they presumably wouldn't have access to the Cormac sites. It gives Go Ahead flexibility prior to the tenders.

Basically yes, although they won't automatically have access to the Cormac sites. The sites are offered at full commercial rate so if GCB wanted to operate supported routes from them they'd have to be priced in. Or they could utilise Camborne, Summercourt and Truro that they own, plus any part of Penzance depot they're leasing separately instead, or any combination thereof.

 

[YorkRailFan]

Basically yes, although they won't automatically have access to the Cormac sites. The sites are offered at full commercial rate so if GCB wanted to operate supported routes from them they'd have to be priced in. Or they could utilise Camborne, Summercourt and Truro that they own, plus any part of Penzance depot they're leasing separately instead, or any combination thereof.

Depends where they win tenders at the end of the day. Operating services in the Bude area as an example would likely require access to a Cormac site whereas routes around Truro or Falmouth could be operated from the Truro depot.

 

[Goldfish62]

Depends where they win tenders at the end of the day. Operating services in the Bude area as an example would likely require access to a Cormac site whereas routes around Truro or Falmouth could be operated from the Truro depot.

Yes, but my point was that winning tenders doesn't automatically grant access to Cormac sites, and neither does winning tenders mean that Cormac sites have to be used.

 

[YorkRailFan]

Yes, but my point was that winning tenders doesn't automatically grant access to Cormac sites, and neither does winning tenders mean that Cormac sites have to be used.

Fair enough. Like I said, if tenders are won that work well with the former First depots and/or the multi-operator site in Penzance, then Cormac sites likely won't be needed.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Fair enough. Like I said, if tenders are won that work well with the former First depots and/or the multi-operator site in Penzance, then Cormac sites likely won't be needed.

We don't know what the 2028 tender process will be.

Suffice to say that by taking on the First sites, Go Cornwall Bus has now got the security of its "own" sites from which they can operate the commercial network in any case. In addition, they have more latitude commercially in that they can take a decision when tendering in how much overhead contribution they wish to generate i.e. they could discount it to make their tenders more competitive.

I think @Goldfish62 has been making the point that not all the Cormac sites are needed now. Now, they may be on a fixed lease that it co-terminus with the tenders and there's little saving in amalgamating sites - I don't know. Of the five current Cormac sites, they might be able to lose a couple. The other three are St Mewan, Bude and Penzance and those are places that will all require a local site.

 

[jammy36]

Talking of Bude, there was a planning permission granted recently for a bus compound to accommodate 14 bus parking bays, welfare facility and bus wash bay located in the Bude Stratton Business Park - do we know who this facility is for?

 

[YorkRailFan]

Suffice to say that by taking on the First sites, Go Cornwall Bus has now got the security of its "own" sites from which they can operate the commercial network in any case. In addition, they have more latitude commercially in that they can take a decision when tendering in how much overhead contribution they wish to generate i.e. they could discount it to make their tenders more competitive.

Well yes, it's all part of making their operations more efficient for the future.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Talking of Bude, there was a planning permission granted recently for a bus compound to accommodate 14 bus parking bays, welfare facility and bus wash bay located in the Bude Stratton Business Park - do we know who this facility is for?

Suggests it is GCB as a "related case"

 

[Goldfish62]

They have one short and one long on there today if bustimes is to be believed. I did wonder if grounding might have been an issue. You referring to the 22** e200mmc @Goldfish62 ?

Yes, that's the ones.

 

[Sleepy]

Bet the buses to St Ives are interesting today as no trains due to car on the track at Carbis Bay !

 

[Andyh82]

The route of the new summer 19 is interesting as it does circular routes in both the St Ives area and also in Hayle. It carries on past the caravan park on the way into St Ives rather than doubling back to the main road like the Kernow service uses to

19 - St Ives - Penzance via St Ives Holiday Village, Marazion

Go Cornwall Bus

bustimes.org

 

[Goldfish62]

The route of the new summer 19 is interesting as it does circular routes in both the St Ives area and also in Hayle. It carries on past the caravan park on the way into St Ives rather than doubling back to the main road like the Kernow service uses to

19 - St Ives - Penzance via St Ives Holiday Village, Marazion

Go Cornwall Bus

bustimes.org

I noticed this. The routing can be gleaned from Bustimes, but not from the published GCB timetable on the TfC website due to the rather sparce timing points.

Of note is that Halsetown gets a Sunday service for possibly the first time ever, albeit for just five weeks.

 

[I'm here now]

I noticed this. The routing can be gleaned from Bustimes, but not from the published GCB timetable on the TfC website due to the rather sparce timing points.

Of note is that Halsetown gets a Sunday service for possibly the first time ever, albeit for just five weeks.

Apart from the ‘royal’ buses to Polmanter

 

[cactustwirly]

You said you have no dog in the race but In every post over the last few years you are super biased to Go Ahead and love to slate First.
I worked for both of these companies I even helped build TFC in 2020 quite a few of my ideas and plans were used but the company itself has a really bad attitude and professionally wise you can literally see the difference between management and drivers of both entities.
I was one of not many who abandoned GC and went the other way to First. I will day after having worked for First bus all over the UK predominantly Bristol I could see that they weren’t up to Bristol or big depot standards they weren’t training people on routes like they are meant to and it felt like I skipped one cowboy for another. But I was wrong you could see the difference in procedures and maintenance and pride of the service. Managers ar Go Ahead would often be in fights scuffles or like I said previously there were many reports there of sxl harassment from managers and drivers we even got told by senior managers to try and catch some drivers out on petty things so they could fire them. There was an atmosphere of bullying and people who had no right being in their respective positions. I could have started this company as a manager when they were hiring they hired drivers with no experience and put them in management positions. The managers they had for some depots were slated by the staff and other depot managers for being inept and all types of other defamatory remarks. This would have never happened at First as they have a different level of professional standards they really are the more responsible and more organised business across the board. As a driver I felt safer at First both bus wise and staff wise. As for the buses now It looks so bad the state of the buses GC take zero pride in anything they do they’re just in this for the money and Richard Steven’s vendetta of kicking out First he told me this himself I wish I’d recorded all the phone calls and emails we had together as he is a nasty piece of work a real bully.
Passenger wise now all I see are people moaning about the huge delays buses are always leaving late drivers regularly get lost or Don’t turn up on time for services and the drivers have even left people stranded in remote areas myself included with no explanation they just shout last stop and then offer no help on what we can do as they don’t know and don’t care they don’t have pride in their job especially looking at the difference in driving standards. First train their drivers very well whereas Go Ahead and Stagecoach too are awful training they don’t even train drivers how to use the ramp or help wheelchair passengers. As most first drivers would lower the suspension for elderly most of the GC drivers don’t I’ve caught them speeding too in most areas and they don’t even wait for passengers to get up the stairs before pulling off the journeys now are so much more uncomfortable and most days im on a 2006 ex London trident. This is no improvement over Kernow they fell out with the council over refusing to spray their fleet red for TFC contract and other things and decided to give Go Ahead the full prize of tenders this is very hostile action to a company that is based in Cornwall staffed by Cornish and then they handed it all to Devon. Kernow put in money and infrastructure and GC have been extremely lucky to not have to pay for much they had it all handed to them there is something disgusting about this from the council. Anyway yes your always bias I would suggest you either have a personal issue with First Bus or you work for Go Ahead.
All I can state is facts on what I see and most of the passengers are now receiving a much lower standard of public service and what for why?

This is consistent with other Go-Ahead operating companies.

I don't know anything about the internal politics, but from an external point of view, Carousel are similar from a passenger perspective. Using agency staff who have no idea where they are going and tatty cast offs from the rest of the group.

Morebus and Southern Vectis seem like completely different companies

 

[Andyh82]

Looks like the July 2026 timetable is getting a new look cover, leading on the Go Ahead Group ‘better by bus’ image rather than the TfC Red. I suppose now you have pretty much the whole county, you don’t have to be neutral.

https://www.transportforcornwall.co.uk/maps/194

It also suggests it’s an annual publication running until next April, with summer enhancements being covered by seperate leaflets.

 

[Goldfish62]

Looks like the July 2026 timetable is getting a new look cover, leading on the Go Ahead Group ‘better by bus’ image rather than the TfC Red. I suppose now you have pretty much the whole county, you don’t have to be neutral.

https://www.transportforcornwall.co.uk/maps/194

It also suggests it’s an annual publication running until next April, with summer enhancements being covered by seperate leaflets.

Yes, give that the September changes have been brought forward to this month I can't see any further changes happening before next Spring.

Seems that the Summer enhancements aren't included in the book or even the online map for the same reason as the the winter route 7 didn't appear, they don't operate for long. These services could have at least appeared on the online map, with an update from September. Some of the Summer routes such as the 7/7A and 19 would be very useful additions to the map the latter route in particular due to its complexity.

I'm surprised that a Go Ahead campaign is used on the cover and also internally given that this is supposed to be a TfC publication, irrespective of the fact that it's produced by GoAhead.

On a positive note I see that the map has had several errors corrected:

1/1A now serving Paul
17 serving Crowlas Chy-an-Gweal
4/4A now shown the correct way around.