Report of collision Bedford (Elstow) - 19/06/26

[74A]

Having looked at RTT and the maps on OpenTrainTimes, I think the 810 was running about 18 minutes late, and the 360, having stopped at Bedford, crossed from the Up Slow to the Up Fast at Bedford South Jn and collided with the rear of the 810.

So train departs on restricted aspects and the proceeds across a high speed junction. Similar scenario to the incidents at Peterborough and Grantham maybe ?

 

[saismee]

So train departs on restricted aspects and the proceeds across a high speed junction. Similar scenario to the incidents at Peterborough and Grantham.

Not at all similar. Those other incidents were overspeeds and there is no evidence of overspeed here.

 

[Harpo]

If 1B67 derailed, could that foul the track circuit? Causing the signalling system to think there's no train there and giving 1H46 a proceed aspect?

In a word no. A ‘wrong sider’ with a track circuit showing clear when occupied (SCWO) is incredibly rare these days* although it appears it might be part of the recent Oxley loop wagon derailment.


* It was not unheard of in leaf fall before track circuit actuators were fitted.

 

[SomeTrainboy]

Maybe the 360 departed Bedford on a single yellow (Not sure if the crossovers are always signalled with single yellow) and the driver assumed the next signal was not red, and given the AWS fault, they wouldn't have realised that the next signal was at danger.

 

[ainsworth74]

I would request that we do not speculate too much about what the driver of the 360 may or may not have done in response to signal aspects that may or may not have been given to them. Similarly with regards to the signaller. It's far too early to know with any certainty what might have happened and we wouldn't want any wild rumours to have started as the results of someone reading something here putting two and two together and making eleven.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

Seeing multiple pictures of the 360 and it hasn't half crumpled at the gangway ends of the carriages.

Modern rolling stock is good.

 

[thedbdiboy]

The photos and videos I have seen do not look like a minor collision - the 360 was doing some speed.

A number of recent accident reports have highlighted how quickly modern trains accelerate which means even a collision where one train has just started moving (as would appear to be the case here) can still result in a significant impact

 

[Harpo]

Probably best not to speculate at this point.

Nor rely on public domain maps which are never to be relied on for anything safety critical.

 

[fairysdad]

Live page on BBC News now (although not much there at time of writing):

Nine people in critical condition among 100 injured in fatal collision

A driver was killed in the collision between the 16:40 train from Corby and 15:50 service from Nottingham on Friday.

www.bbc.co.uk

Although currently unhelpfully implying that it's Thameslink that have had the incident not EMR.

 

[D1511]

Person involved in the incident is on BBC News 24 at the moment, and says they didn't detect the train slowing before the impact.
I also fear from what he's saying that there may be some very serious casualties. I hope this isn't the case.

 

[Harpo]

A number of recent accident reports have highlighted how quickly modern trains accelerate which means even a collision where one train has just started moving (as would appear to be the case here) can still result in a significant impact

Albeit ‘light’ electric locos in the case of Bletchley and Stafford.

 

[aaronspence]

The sky news helicopter is on the way so may be some further visuals shortly

 

[reduke]

I am not going to join in on the speculation of the cause and would urge everyone else to not do the same.

Right now I am:
Hoping above all else for no fatalities or life changing injuries.
Sad that a brand new train has been damaged.
Pessimistic about incoming reductions to the Connect service.
Going to a pub until I can get home.

If I was the driver I would have hastily beat a retreat after hitting the emergency brake...


My thoughts go out to everyone caught up in this, not least to those with no air con and no water in a tin can in this heat.

 

[bramling]

So, if 1st train stopped to report AWS fault, and then another hits from the rear, at a fair speed, to me, that points towards a signalling fault ?

Not necessarily. Signal overlaps are not long enough to provide a safety margin if a train passes a signal at danger at high speed. They are designed to cater for small misjudgments.

It would be common for up EMR services to experience a single yellow with junction indicator at Bedford South Junction after being turned out following a fast service on the up fast, much less common for the following signal to then remain at danger due to an out-of-course stop from the train in front.

 

[Bantamzen]

Oh my goodness, my thoughts are with all those involved and I hope that everyone makes a speedy recovery.

 

[800001]

Video just been shown on BBC News 24 showing the class 810 has at least one derailed. In similar fashion to the Azuma incident at Nevill Hill.

 

[edwin_m]

Looking at the damage to at least three vehicles of the 360, I would say that is a write off. It may well be the rear 810 car is easiest replaced by building a new one...

This may be the first accident where the "crumple zones" fitted to each end of each vehicle since the 1990s have actually behaved as intended, TPWS having greatly reduced the end-on collisions they were designed for. Whether this has reduced the casualties will have to wait for the report. And we may never find out whether the damage, if unrepairable now, might have been repairable had a more traditional rigid structure been used.

 

[Trainguy34]

Sky news now look like they're about to turn over onto the crash.

 

[Kilopylae]

Modern rolling stock is good.

That's what I thought when I saw GEC465's photos - in some way, when the crumple zones were so utilised, it's comforting to see that the body of each carriage was so intact, with the doors still operating and the windows not shattered, allowing people to de-train safely.

Like everyone, I really hope there aren't any fatalities.

 

[ainsworth74]

This thread is incredibly busy so it would be most useful if members kept chatter about things not related to this horrible incident to a minimum. The Forum is chugging a bit but it's still hanging in there so you are more than welcome to start a new thread to discuss any unrelated matters (such as the number of people viewing a thread).

 

[DAH]

Although currently unhelpfully implying that it's Thameslink that have had the incident not EMR.

They've implied no such thing. They have just used a quote from a Thameslink spokesperson.

 

[GRALISTAIR]

This may be the first accident where the "crumple zones" fitted to each end of each vehicle since the 1990s have actually behaved as intended

Absolutely. Crumple zones absorb the energy.

 

[jack31439]

Tough one for the railway. Thoughts with all those involved and hopeful for positive outcomes for all the injured. We've got one of the best safety records in the world for a reason.

 

[Thumper1127]

Person involved in the incident is on BBC News 24 at the moment, and says they didn't detect the train slowing before the impact.
I also fear from what he's saying that there may be some very serious casualties. I hope this isn't the case.

Ages since I’ve posted here. Here’s hoping injury, and possible fatality is as low as possible. Let’s reflect on the advances of train build; imagine this was in the MK1 days.

 

[jon0844]

Absolutely. Crumple zones absorb the energy.

Indeed. The worse it looks, the better it should (hopefully) be for the occupants - going by car design where you don't want a car to look unscathed if the force is transferred to the occupants instead.

 

[milooo]

The BBC reported that it felt like 'a bomb had gone off'

 

[Omnidekkalover]

Incredibly sad and horrible to hear. Thoughts and prayers are with all those involved. Hoping that everyone is able to recover from this.

 

[Thirteen]

The 810 from the pictures looks like it sustained less damage than the 360, I assume they'll be able to replace or repair it.

 

[reduke]

They've implied no such thing. They have just used a quote from a Thameslink spokesperson.

Agreed but in the instant news era perception is everything.

EMR had the disruption on their site way before TL, but still woefully belated for anyone needing to travel.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

Not necessarily. Signal overlaps are not long enough to provide a safety margin if a train passes a signal at danger at high speed. They are designed to cater for small misjudgments.

It would be common for up EMR services to experience a single yellow with junction indicator at Bedford South Junction after being turned out following a fast service on the up fast, much less common for the following signal to then remain at danger due to an out-of-course stop from the train in front.

The Up Slow is 90mph in advance of crossovers which are 50mph so would require approach control at WH356