Class 810 for East Midlands Railway Construction/Introduction Updates

[Trainman40083]

Everything 810 going swimmingly today until ... 1D61 1705 Down Notts booked for 810011 cancelled 'problem with the brakes'. Return cancelled as well.

I have already made a mental note to swerve a train worked by 810011.

 

[LowLevel]

810006 then joining the party failing at East Mids Parkway on the 1805 ex London - though the problem actually arose on 1C68 with the cancellation at Parkway being a planned one to get the set back to Derby with the AWS isolated in the rear cab without having to reverse at Nottingham or cancel the 1805 throughout - quite smart thinking!

 

[810013]

810006 went via Barrow hill on 1f40 instead of Dronfield which put it delayed on starting 1c68.
Also resulted in the set being pointed the other way to planned (First class at the rear instead of front)

 

[Merle Haggard]

810006 went via Barrow hill on 1f40 instead of Dronfield which put it delayed on starting 1c68.
Also resulted in the set being pointed the other way to planned (First class at the rear instead of front)

Are the 810s now planned to always have the First at the London end? Perhaps it's a condition of the Hitachi contract, which I think may be the case on East Coast.
In my experience there has never been any consistency in the orientation of 222s.

 

[LowLevel]

Are the 810s now planned to always have the First at the London end? Perhaps it's a condition of the Hitachi contract, which I think may be the case on East Coast.
In my experience there has never been any consistency in the orientation of 222s.

Not as far as I know. The number of movements between Derby and Nottingham/Leicester with the Trent Triangle as well as the Barrow Hill loop and reversing running via Castle Donington mean that having first class consistently at one end has always been notoriously difficult.

 

[tram21]

810006 failed yesterday also

 

[a_c_skinner]

Is there a pattern to these failures? Are they a limited set of problems - like doors? I know they are very different but the 80X sets seem to have entered service much more seamlessly so it isn't that Hitachi simply makes low quality stuff.

 

[dosxuk]

Are the 810s now planned to always have the First at the London end? Perhaps it's a condition of the Hitachi contract, which I think may be the case on East Coast.
In my experience there has never been any consistency in the orientation of 222s.

Nothing to do with Hitachi. Having first class at the London end has been a thing on the East Coast longer than I've been around, and likewise with many of the former Intercity routes. GNER used to regularly leave Newcastle the wrong way to turn a set to make sure first was at the London end if it had been turned elsewhere on it's route.

But it's never been a thing where the service pattern results in regular stock reversals - like the MML - as it would just complicate and delay journeys for little benefit.

 

[D9006]

Thanks apinnard, what is the fastest possible time with a clear run to Leicester?

Looking ar RTT for yesterday the 0832 left St Pancras with 018 7 late and arrived Leicester 1/4min earlier, saying a rime of 59 and 3/4 was achieved. As stated by someone would need a late departure to get a clear run and it most certainly did. Looks like when they run well they certainly can perform. The problem being when and if they will perform

 

[Merle Haggard]

Nothing to do with Hitachi. Having first class at the London end has been a thing on the East Coast longer than I've been around, and likewise with many of the former Intercity routes. GNER used to regularly leave Newcastle the wrong way to turn a set to make sure first was at the London end if it had been turned elsewhere on it's route.

But it's never been a thing where the service pattern results in regular stock reversals - like the MML - as it would just complicate and delay journeys for little benefit.

The post to which I replied implied that orientation of 810s was considered important.
There was certainly a thread that included reference to an imported IET that arrived on GW the wrong way round, and due to availability/restriction of routing there were problems in turning it. This was reported as resulting in penalty charges for Hitachi, the implication being that they had some responsibility for ensuring correct orientation. I wondered whether it extended beyond GW to being a network IET requirement.

Not as far as I know. The number of movements between Derby and Nottingham/Leicester with the Trent Triangle as well as the Barrow Hill loop and reversing running via Castle Donington mean that having first class consistently at one end has always been notoriously difficult.

Indeed; the destinations and routing of start-of-the-day ECS moves from Etches Park alone - even without short notice diversions via Melton or Barrow Hill - would make it a nightmare to organise. That's why I was surprised that, when it happened to an 810 as a result of a diversion, it was raised as not conforming to the plan for the 810s.

 

[rog21]

I read an article many years ago that first class coaches were always positioned at the London end of the train. This was so that the "wealthy" passengers always had the shortest distance to walk on arrival in the city

 

[Thunderer]

I read an article many years ago that first class coaches were always positioned at the London end of the train. This was so that the "wealthy" passengers always had the shortest distance to walk on arrival in the city

Exactly that. The GW HST’s nearly always had 1st class at the Paddington end. These days with IET’s 1st class can literally be anywhere, front, rear, middle, front or rear if 2 five cars are joined together…there is no consistency or standards anymore and quite frankly I would not pay a 1st class premium anymore for the sub-standard 1st class offering that most operators provide.

 

[duffield]

I read an article many years ago that first class coaches were always positioned at the London end of the train. This was so that the "wealthy" passengers always had the shortest distance to walk on arrival in the city

I always prefer 1st to be at the "country end" when leaving London, because that means I don't have to put up with all the hoi polloi traipsing through when it gets near to departure time. And they're less tempted to "try it on" in 1st if it's at the far end.

 

[Denis103]

Not as far as I know. The number of movements between Derby and Nottingham/Leicester with the Trent Triangle as well as the Barrow Hill loop and reversing running via Castle Donington mean that having first class consistently at one end has always been notoriously difficult.

I understand that very few EMR drivers know sheet stores to stenson and preferred route for ecs Derby to Nottingham when line blocked through Spondon is via Chesterfield.

 

[Merle Haggard]

Does anyone know where 810s on the Melton diversions change between diesel & electric?

 

[Paul472426]

Does anyone know where 810s on the Melton diversions change between diesel & electric?

Change over at Corby on Up trains, and near Geddington on Down trains

 

[Merle Haggard]

Change over at Corby on Up trains, and near Geddington on Down trains

Thanks you.

 

[Ian Umpleby]

Looking ar RTT for yesterday the 0832 left St Pancras with 018 7 late and arrived Leicester 1/4min earlier, saying a rime of 59 and 3/4 was achieved. As stated by someone would need a late departure to get a clear run and it most certainly did. Looks like when they run well they certainly can perform. The problem being when and if they will perform

Great run! The Railway Performance Society's Archive has a fastest 222 run in 59 m 50s, only beaten by an APT run in 58m 30s.

 

[BorderCollie]

The marketing power of Leicester - London in under an hour is phenomenal. When (not if) the wires get there it'll be an MML Sparks Effect...

 

[QSK19]

The marketing power of Leicester - London in under an hour is phenomenal. When (not if) the wires get there it'll be an MML Sparks Effect...

I’m hopeful it’ll be when, not if, too… but I won’t believe it until we see actual construction and then proper progress beyond the point where it can be practically cancelled.

 

[Merle Haggard]

810018 met with problems earlier today on an Up Sheffield - losing time after Derby before expiring at Bedford 57 late.
Its subsequent diagram seems to be uncovered.

 

[222001]

810018 met with problems earlier today on an Up Sheffield - losing time after Derby before expiring at Bedford 57 late.
Its subsequent diagram seems to be uncovered.

810006 has also failed at Leicester on 1350 Nottingham - London. 10 units available, 6 making it into service, and then 2 failing is pretty poor. Has there actually been a day in recent weeks where at least one hasn't failed?

 

[jthjth]

I’m hopeful it’ll be when, not if, too… but I won’t believe it until we see actual construction and then proper progress beyond the point where it can be practically cancelled.

Something would have to be done about the high level of fares. Leicester folk I know all dismiss train travel as far too expensive.

 

[baz962]

Looking ar RTT for yesterday the 0832 left St Pancras with 018 7 late and arrived Leicester 1/4min earlier, saying a rime of 59 and 3/4 was achieved. As stated by someone would need a late departure to get a clear run and it most certainly did. Looks like when they run well they certainly can perform. The problem being when and if they will perform

I have done that time in a meridian before. No great shakes.

 

[dk1]

Something would have to be done about the high level of fares. Leicester folk I know all dismiss train travel as far too expensive.

It seems to do well with over 5.5m entries/exits recorded last year.

 

[Trainman40083]

Something would have to be done about the high level of fares. Leicester folk I know all dismiss train travel as far too expensive.

I know many people who were stunned how cheap their train fare was. I guess they commited to advance fares.

 

[Mugby]

I was at Sheffield this evening (Sat) expecting to catch the 1900 London service. I arrived off the train from Liverpool on Pl.8 and spotted an 810 on Pl.2 loaded up, engines running and ready to go but it wasn't the 1900, it was the 1800 'Delayed' It was 810011 and eventually left at 1930, not stopping at Derby or Long Eaton (diverted down the Erewash due to a points failure at Ambergate) It was chaos at Sheffield, nobody seemed to know what was happening and even when the signal turned to green it was five minutes before the train got away.
810011 seemed to running ok but I saw two very large guys, dressed in black with Hitachi lanyards and insignia walking through the train and back again, I imagine this is quite a common occurrence at the present time?

 

[800001]

I was at Sheffield this evening (Sat) expecting to catch the 1900 London service. I arrived off the train from Liverpool on Pl.8 and spotted an 810 on Pl.2 loaded up, engines running and ready to go but it wasn't the 1900, it was the 1800 'Delayed' It was 810011 and eventually left at 1930, not stopping at Derby or Long Eaton (diverted down the Erewash due to a points failure at Ambergate) It was chaos at Sheffield, nobody seemed to know what was happening and even when the signal turned to green it was five minutes before the train got away.
810011 seemed to running ok but I saw two very large guys, dressed in black with Hitachi lanyards and insignia walking through the train and back again, I imagine this is quite a common occurrence at the present time?

So the service was late because of infrastructure failure? And nothing to do with the train?

 

[1D54]

Another mess involving the 810s today. 14:35 St Pancras - Sheffield (010) was having problems on the run south departing Kettering 30 late. Left London about 15 down but something happened and was switched at Derby for 011 which probably explains the delay.

I was on 010 this morning and departed Leicester on time at 05:11 but came to a halt at Frisby but apparently that was due to track circuit problems. As nice as these units are i dont trust them to the extent that i boarded an earlier service from London today on an advance purchase which was also an 810 (013)but arrived in Leicester on time.

 

[Peterthegreat]

I was at Sheffield this evening (Sat) expecting to catch the 1900 London service. I arrived off the train from Liverpool on Pl.8 and spotted an 810 on Pl.2 loaded up, engines running and ready to go but it wasn't the 1900, it was the 1800 'Delayed' It was 810011 and eventually left at 1930, not stopping at Derby or Long Eaton (diverted down the Erewash due to a points failure at Ambergate) It was chaos at Sheffield, nobody seemed to know what was happening and even when the signal turned to green it was five minutes before the train got away.
810011 seemed to running ok but I saw two very large guys, dressed in black with Hitachi lanyards and insignia walking through the train and back again, I imagine this is quite a common occurrence at the present time?

I caught 810010 from Kettering this afternoon. It was already 30 late due to technical issues. Apparently only running on 2 (from 4) engines. This meant no USB power and bizarrely the coffee machine wouldn't work either.
When it got to Corby the doors wouldn't open. Another 5 or so minutes delay. It then avoided Leicester in an attempt to recover time. However when it got to Long Eaton the doors wouldn't open again. Another 2 minute delay.
When we got to Derby a set swap had been arranged so we all alighted and marched down the platform to a replacement set (011) which was standing further forward on the same platform.
That then set off and nothing out of the ordinary occurred until we got to Sheffield when the doors of this set wouldn't open either. After a few minutes release came. It was meant to form the 18.00 back to St Pancras but still suffered a technical fault. There then followed a points failure at Ambergate so it wasn't clear what was still causing the delay when my northern train left at 19.05.