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Fave TOC that no longer exists

FinsburyPark

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Why not?

For me...

1st place - First Capital Connect

2nd place - First GW

3rd place - South West Trains (Still somewhat exists under South Western Railway)
 
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sprinterguy

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GNER, as I liked their aesthetic and brand, and they were the big, exciting Intercity trains at my nearest major station in my more youthful years, so I associated them with distant destinations and pleasant day trips away.

If we're including open access operators, then Wrexham and Shropshire's level of comfort and attentive service in First class in particular was lovely, though I can see why they lost money from it, sadly.
 
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birchesgreen

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British Rail?

But in all seriousness, i used to like London Midland, though WMT is largely the same but with different colours.
 

Bletchleyite

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But in all seriousness, i used to like London Midland, though WMT is largely the same but with different colours.

I think WMT is that little bit better to be honest. The LM branding package was excellent, but they persisted for their entire reign in running 4 cars sets around full and standing to save money. WMT have near enough ceased 4 car working on the south WCML* and it couldn't have come soon enough.

* Just one 4 car train calling at Bletchley today for instance.

Virgin Trains I suppose. Not perfect by any stretch but Avanti just feels lackadaisical and can't be bothered, much as I like the new seats.

Perhaps First North Western, not because it was good but because I increasingly think Northern is too big to be manageable.

I don't share the enthusiasm for GNER. They did very little of consequence bar paint trains blue with metal crests, do a refurbishment with terribly designed single piece seat cushions (which VTEC later replaced) and bleat a lot about their own importance.
 

bramling

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Why not?

For me...

1st place - First Capital Connect

2nd place - First GW

3rd place - South West Trains (Still somewhat exists under South Western Railway)

I’ll throw in a wild card - WAGN under National Express after the West Anglia side had been hived off. A tiny, rump, TOC, that seemed to manage to sort out a lot of issues, to the point that by the time they handed over to FCC the operation was in a very good shape.
 

birchesgreen

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I think WMT is that little bit better to be honest. The LM branding package was excellent, but they persisted for their entire reign in running 4 cars sets around full and standing to save money. WMT have near enough ceased 4 car working on the south WCML* and it couldn't have come soon enough.
Oh yes they are better nowadays, i used to commute to and from Worcester every day, returning home on a crowded 2 car Sprinter that stank of damp as it staggered up the Lickey Incline is not that found a memory :lol:
 

LowLevel

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Got to be Virgin. They captured the imagination of the public which is hard to do with a train company.

Also Midland Mainline, by the time they finished they had turned what had been almost a secondary route under BR into a real success with a reputation for high service standards. You'd have never foreseen a mixed fleet of 222s and HSTs providing a 4 train per hour all day service in 1997.
 

Bristol LHS

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1. GNER - partly it’s a reflection on what came afterwards, but classy livery, great first class / restaurant service, a little buccaneering (White Rose Eurostars). Felt like a proper railway

2. Midland Mainline - stepped up service both in terms of frequency/seats, but also on board (remember free tea/coffee?)

3. Anglia - a mix of the above, they had clapped out rolling stock, but a nice livery, very solid (if old-fashioned) on board service, and they tried to innovate with the Basingstoke service, and of course Hull Trains.
 

High Dyke

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Arguably BR. Fair enough, it wasn't always rosy, but you had proper loco hauled trains, longer trains, and if needed additional stock or relief trains that could be utilised. A far cry from the problems we seem to see more and more these days, judging by the numerous threads on these forums, and as a regular rail user.
 

xotGD

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Whatever incarnation of the Midland Mainline gave out free coffee in Standard Class.
 
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Anglia. I always found their mix of local and Intercity services fascinating. And the 86s, 150s, 153s and 170s that operated them. An eclectic mix, but all (or at least most) in a distinctive and classy livery.

 

43096

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Difficult one...

I will say South West Trains. Aftre an initial aberration with staff cuts, they were a consistently reliable operator who understood the need for reliability out of Waterloo and ran their train fleet with reliability in mind. Also understood that their regular passengers - season ticket holders - were to be valued. Unlike their successors FirstGroup who did virtually the opposite of all the good from day one.
 

A S Leib

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I shouldn't really count it as it isn't one I'm old enough to remember, but, from reputation, pre-Arriva Chiltern.
 

NB5025

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GNER, as I liked their aesthetic and brand, and they were the big, exciting Intercity trains at my nearest major station in my more youthful years, so I associated them with distant destinations and pleasant day trips away.

If we're including open access operators, then Wrexham and Shropshire's level of comfort and attentive service in First class in particular was lovely, though I can see why they lost money from it, sadly.
Yes! I remember when the first HSTs appeared in GNER livery with the refurbished interiors. Lovely journeys on the Highland mainline, visiting the restaurant car. Classy uniforms on the staff too. I remember non rail enthusiasts at work commenting on how nice it was.

In BR days, Intercity was pretty good as I recall.

Way before any of our times, but I'd like to have experienced the LMS, Highland and LNER.
 

Sorcerer

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Virgin Trains, and it's not even close. For the longest time they held the image of the premier operator with pizazz and excitement that worked well for the WCML modernisation and Pendolino fleet introduction. Their customer service on board was great; one woman recognised me and a friend even after so many years, and thankfully Avanti have managed to hold on to her. Even if they won West Coast Partnership I wonder if it would've still been the same.
 

ash39

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The majority of the post-privatisation brands nailed the style aspect, it was a colourful time! We've got far too many white based trains on the network these days.

Northern Spirit (and the TPE sub-brand)
Virgin Trains
GNER
Midland Mainline
Anglia
Central Trains

The only brands that have arguably improved on what went before are ScotRail and GwR. My argument would be the original GW Merlin livery and the ScotRail 'swoosh' liveries didn't quite hit the mark, and both then went into First Group which never seemed to settle on a livery or identity for a period of time.

I'm picking 1996-onwards TPE as my final answer purely for nostalgia as I was a 10-year old living in Leeds at the time, and I still think this is the best livery ever carried by a 158


Northern Spirit 158 776 by buses7675!, on Flickr
Flickr image of a TPE Class 158, not mine
 

Ashley Hill

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A lot of people are championing Virgin based on the WCML, but from my experience down south Voyagers were nothing to shout about. They are too short, they smell and Operation Princess fell apart amongst other things.
 

43096

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Virgin Trains, all day every day.
You obviously don't remember the utter fiasco that Virgin was to start with before Chris Green came in and evicted the management "bus bandits". And I bet you don't remember the fiasco of "Operation Princess/Pumpkin" on Cross-Country. For the "legacy" of the abominal Voyager and Pendolino interiors alone, Virgin shouldn't be anywhere near this thread.
 

Sun Chariot

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Arguably BR. Fair enough, it wasn't always rosy, but you had proper loco hauled trains, longer trains, and if needed additional stock or relief trains that could be utilised.
+1 for British Rail but for slightly different reasoning:

1) Far simpler ticketing fare structures.

2) The wonderful Weekend First £10 pay-on-the-train upgrade (in August 1990, I enjoyed The Golden Hind First Class saloon environment Paddington to Plymouth, for a mere Tenner more than my Standard Class SuperSaver).

3) Joined-up, Passenger-centric, thinking (early 1980s family Merrymaker trip from Bedfordshire up to Blaenau Ffestiniog, twelve (including us four) missed departure from Blaenau. BR staff arranged a private bus to Chester, then held a Womens Institute excursion so we could use it Chester to Crewe; and "validated" our Merrymaker tickets for an evening InterCity service Crewe to Milton Keynes).

4) Failed loco, saved service (Feb 1984 (my school group) our Carlisle to Leeds train halted near Dent Head whem the 31/4 failed. Skipton sent a 25, the Rat thrashed its heart out and got us to Leeds, 2+ hours behind schedule; then BR provided new tickets for our Leeds to London leg).
 
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TT-ONR-NRN

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You obviously don't remember the utter fiasco that Virgin was to start with before Chris Green came in and evicted the management "bus bandits". And I bet you don't remember the fiasco of "Operation Princess/Pumpkin" on Cross-Country. For the "legacy" of the abominal Voyager and Pendolino interiors alone, Virgin shouldn't be anywhere near this thread.
I was born in 2003.
And since I remember their exclusively Pendolino and Super Voyager operations with great fondness, and the thread is to discuss people's favourite TOCs that no longer exist, since Virgin Trains is indeed mine, I disagree.
 

zwk500

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1st place - First Capital Connect
As somebody who grew up in Sussex in the 2000's, may I ask what you liked about FCC?

They had one decent livery (the bars one) but that was about it, even allowing for the fact they were dumped with handling the majority of the Thameslink Upgrade disruption.
2nd place - First GW
First still run the Great Western franchise, of course (for now), they've just switched brands to GWR because too many people just heard 'First' and immediately went 'oh god no'.
3rd place - South West Trains (Still somewhat exists under South Western Railway)
I had very little experience of SWT, literally only using them to get to/from the rugby, but I did like the fact that they used their corporate colours well to create differential liveries and the crowd job at Clapham and Twickenham always seemed to be well run.
 

LowLevel

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You obviously don't remember the utter fiasco that Virgin was to start with before Chris Green came in and evicted the management "bus bandits". And I bet you don't remember the fiasco of "Operation Princess/Pumpkin" on Cross-Country. For the "legacy" of the abominal Voyager and Pendolino interiors alone, Virgin shouldn't be anywhere near this thread.
And yet, on the point of serviceability alone you've always championed Stagecoach East Midlands Trains, who removed almost all of the luggage space from the class 158s serving major university cities.
 

43096

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And yet, on the point of serviceability alone you've always championed Stagecoach East Midlands Trains, who removed almost all of the luggage space from the class 158s serving major university cities.
You might want to check the overhead rack size on the Pendolinos and Voyagers then... and whilst we're on the subject of luggage space and seating, Virgin gave the luggage stacks a prime window seat and left the passengers with blank walls. Design idiocy at its finest.
 

devon_belle

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SWT when it had catering on the 159s was great too. I don't know exactly why, but SWR has always felt lacklustre compared to SWT. Maybe SWR was stifled by COVID and DfT, but maintenance and staff relations seem to be worse.

I'd be interested to hear people's thoughts on Thames Trains Vs FGWLink Vs FGW, as that's an operator I hardly ever see mentioned. I only used once or twice, so can't characterise them myself.
 

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