Which London Underground route has the most stations in daylight?

[Joe SeafordNY]

I am a New Yorker who has little experience on the London Underground, two visits 40 years ago.

In New York City, I have grown to prefer daylight routes, such as our J train with 22 open air stations.

I try looking at videos about the London Underground, but the views of narrow platforms and endless viewless passageways become tedious.

 

[Mcr Warrior]

@Joe SeafordNY. Welcome to the forum. Probably the District Line has the most stations above ground. Maybe the Metropolitan and Central lines close behind. Anyone got the stats to confirm?

 

[Mawkie]

I am a New Yorker who has little experience on the London Underground, two visits 40 years ago. In New York City, I have grown to prefer daylight routes, such as our J train with 22 open air stations. I try looking at videos about the London Underground, but the views of narrow platforms and endless viewless passageways become tedious.

TfL produce an official map which indicate the sections in and out of tunnels.

https://tfl.gov.uk/cdn/static/cms/documents/tube-map-with-tunnels.pdf

 

[urbophile]

Ive not got the statistics to hand but I believe well over 50% of the 'underground' is above ground.

The so-called subsurface lines (the earliest to be built, basically the Metropolitan and the District and their spinoffs) have several sections and stations even in central London which are open to daylight, and extend many miles into the outer suburbs where they are just like other railways.

But most of the deep-level lines (strictly, the only ones that are really 'tube' lines) extend well beyond the tunnelled sections too. I think the only two lines that don't are the Victoria and the Waterloo and City.

 

[edwin_m]

This map shows the tunnel portals and many other details besides: https://cartometro.com/metro-tram-london/

 

[Joe SeafordNY]

Thanks for your very helpful replies. Cartometro is amazing, and the tube map with tunnels is most helpful. With appreciation, Joe

 

[NoddyMaccy]

I’d say District and Metropolitan lines have the most stations out in the open air.

Least - Waterloo & City

 

[SECR 65]

Least - Waterloo & City

Am I right the Victoria line is also completely underground (except the depot) - so would these two draw?

 

[pokemonsuper9]

There are lots of open air parts of the underground that are at/below grade, but I think some of the best parts based on your post would be the elevated parts, such as the Hammersmith - Paddington part of the Circle/H&C.

 

[edwin_m]

Am I right the Victoria line is also completely underground (except the depot) - so would these two draw?

Correct.

Carto Metro that I posted above also shows some closed stations which may be briefly visible on the underground sections if you know when to look. The London Transport Museum has lots of information about the Underground and has done some YouTube channels about the hidden stations, as well as actual tours of some.

Hidden London Hangouts

Our expert Hidden London team uncover the secrets of the Underground and take you behind the scenes at sites across the network usually unseen by the public.

www.youtube.com

 

[NoddyMaccy]

Am I right the Victoria line is also completely underground (except the depot) - so would these two draw?

You’re absolutely right. Forgive my tired brain for forgetting the Victoria line

 

[Pegpilot]

On a slight tangent, I remember being told of a study by a Picc Line Duty Train Manager 30 years ago ago that explored correlations between driver sickness absence and the proportion of time spent driving underground. He discovered that that there was significantly greater absence associated with shifts that shuttled between Arnos and Acton than shifts that stretched their legs to Uxbridge, Heathrow and Cockfosters. Unsurprising, methinks.

 

[notverydeep]

@Joe SeafordNY , one thing you might want to bear in mind if you are coming to London as a visitor, is that most of the routes that are very useful for overseas visitors - the ones that link the key hotels, museums, restaurants, shopping areas and other attractions - are in Central London and therefore are much more likely to be tunnel (or Subsurface covered-way) rather than in daylight. There are many above ground sections that would form interesting trips for Rail Fans wanting to explore the network, but if you are just intending to use the tube to 'get about' between more 'normal' traveller leisure activities, you are less likely to encounter these without a deliberate trip...

 

[Port Road]

Slightly off topic -or reverse topic- what's the longest section of tunnel between stations? Is it Kings Cross to Highbury & Islington, that always seems longer than the rest and at full speed as well.....?

 

[Dstock7080]

what's the longest section of tunnel between stations? Is it Kings Cross to Highbury & Islington, that always seems longer than the rest and at full speed as well.....?

Heathrow T4>Heathrow T2,3: 4.31km
Finsbury Park>Seven Sisters: 3.15km
Heathrow T5>Heathrow T2,3: 2.48km
King’s Cross>Highbury & Islington: 2.45km
Canada Water>Canary Wharf: 2.41km

 

[Port Road]

Heathrow T4>Heathrow T2,3: 4.31km
Finsbury Park>Seven Sisters: 3.15km
Heathrow T5>Heathrow T2,3: 2.48km
King’s Cross>Highbury & Islington: 2.45km
Canada Water>Canary Wharf: 2.41km

Interesting. Thanks for that.

 

[whoosh]

@Joe SeafordNY

You might like these 'depth maps' of each underground line / each route on each underground line.
[Although do note, that some stations that appear 'below ground' in these, are in fact in a cutting, and therefore in the open air.]

Down Underground – Daniel Silva

www.dansilva.co.uk

 

[pitdiver]

Heathrow T4>Heathrow T2,3: 4.31km
Finsbury Park>Seven Sisters: 3.15km
Heathrow T5>Heathrow T2,3: 2.48km
King’s Cross>Highbury & Islington: 2.45km
Canada Water>Canary Wharf: 2.41km

I always thought Turnpike Lane to Manor House was quite a distance.

 

[Dstock7080]

I always thought Turnpike Lane to Manor House was quite a distance.

2.32km

 

[Ted633]

Heathrow T4>Heathrow T2,3: 4.31km
Finsbury Park>Seven Sisters: 3.15km
Heathrow T5>Heathrow T2,3: 2.48km
King’s Cross>Highbury & Islington: 2.45km
Canada Water>Canary Wharf: 2.41km

Heathrow T4 > Heathrow T2/3 surely can’t be that far. Where does it go?

 

[Mcr Warrior]

Heathrow T4 > Heathrow T2/3 surely can’t be that far. Where does it go?

TRACKMaps suggests it's ballpark 4.36km travelling between the two stops, in a broadly clockwise direction, via PiccEX junction.

 

[orestad]

Metropolitan makes sense for being one of the highest, they do have some nice views beyond Finchley Road, more so Harrow on the Hill - Amersham.

 

[Tester]

Heathrow T4 > Heathrow T2/3 surely can’t be that far. Where does it go?

I would have thought the same, but I had cause to do it recently as a free transfer, and it was interminable!

 

[bramling]

On a slight tangent, I remember being told of a study by a Picc Line Duty Train Manager 30 years ago ago that explored correlations between driver sickness absence and the proportion of time spent driving underground. He discovered that that there was significantly greater absence associated with shifts that shuttled between Arnos and Acton than shifts that stretched their legs to Uxbridge, Heathrow and Cockfosters. Unsurprising, methinks.

It’s also probably not a coincidence that generally the lines with the most tedious work (C&H / Piccadilly) are at the more militant end of the spectrum.

Though, interestingly, I’d have thought the opposite - being on the same train for something like Arnos Grove-Cockfosters-Heathrow Loop-Cockfosters-Arnos Grove must be pretty tedious. The opening of T5 will have improved things a lot, as there’s generally more layover at the Heathrow end than before.

 

[Mawkie]

TRACKMaps suggests it's ballpark 4.36km travelling between the two stops, in a broadly clockwise direction, via PiccEX junction.

LU WTT says 4.31km

I would have thought the same, but I had cause to do it recently as a free transfer, and it was interminable!

I've never timed it, but would guess it takes a little over 4 minutes. If you're too fast, you have to wait at T2&3 anyway for a green light.

Though, interestingly, I’d have thought the opposite - being on the same train for something like Arnos Grove-Cockfosters-Heathrow Loop-Cockfosters-Arnos Grove must be pretty tedious.

Can't speak for all drivers, but I would say most prefer T4s over T5s or Rayners/Uxbridges. Main reason, is a) there's no detraining involved, and b) you're in the same cab, so no need to set up display, seat, temperature, etc.

 

[Dstock7080]

I've never timed it, but would guess it takes a little over 4 minutes. If you're too fast, you have to wait at T2&3 anyway for a green light.

Timed for 5¼min in the WTT

 

[Snex]

I understand that you specifically asked for Underground routes but I'm going to assume that you might not know there's more to London's transport and there's also the DLR (Light Rail), Trams and also Thameslink and the Overground (Rail) which all mostly all overground and are urban in the city too.

The DLR has some of the best views of London if you're looking for views, especially the section through the centre of Canary Wharf. Similar with Thameslink through the centre crossing the Thames.

If you're interested in the views rather than the stats, it's definitely something which can't be ignored. Just thought it would be a worthwhile to add.

 

[Taunton]

The DLR has some of the best views of London if you're looking for views, especially the section through the centre of Canary Wharf.

But do come in the next year or so, as the 'brilliant' designer of the new trains has replaced all the useful transverse seats, long touted to visitors for the DLR's interesting views of Docklands, with inward-facing sideways seats where all you get to see is your fellow passengers opposite. This is all in aid of ... well nobody seems at all sure what it is in aid of.

 

[DelW]

Heathrow T4 > Heathrow T2/3 surely can’t be that far. Where does it go?

If you look at Heathrow on the CartoMetro map (linked from post 5), the Piccadilly route from T4 to T2/3 does a big loop to the west, length about 3 times the as-the-crow-flies* route. It's also rather longer than the Liz Line between the same terminals, which is about 2 times the direct distance.

(*Hopefully crows don't fly that way, as they'd cross the southern runway.)

 

[CyrusWuff]

But do come in the next year or so, as the 'brilliant' designer of the new trains has replaced all the useful transverse seats, long touted to visitors for the DLR's interesting views of Docklands, with inward-facing sideways seats where all you get to see is your fellow passengers opposite. This is all in aid of ... well nobody seems at all sure what it is in aid of.

The logic is presumably the same as the Elizabeth Line, London Overground and most current London Underground stock. Namely to provide additional space for standing passengers on busy trains.