WMR Class 172 poor state - are they on their way out?

[duffield]

Is there a general problem with the mains/USB sockets on the WMR class 172s or was I just unlucky? None of the sockets I tried on two different units today (on the Kidderminster to Stratford-upon-Avon route) were working. Just seemed a bit of a coincidence. Also, all four units involved had an intrinsic problem with the windows being "dirty" on the *inside* of the double glazing so impossible to clean, it was brilliant sunshine outside and like being in a fog inside!

Are these units being neglected because they are reach the end of their lives - are the due to be replaced imminently?

 

[Chris172]

172 are only 15/16 years old, they aren't being replaced (if they were, what with?). WMR are struggling with their diesels ATM with shortforms and an addition 172 diagram on the Herefords so a 196 can run the camp hills.

If the unit has an engine out then the charging will not work in that unit as the other engine(s) are supplying the electrical supply to the defective carriage.

Wouldn't say they are being neglected as the depot looks after the 170s for XC so more trains to maintain. Then there is probably a supply issue for spare parts so more units are awaiting parts

 

[duffield]

172 are only 15/16 years old, they aren't being replaced (if they were, what with?). WMR are struggling with their diesels ATM with shortforms and an addition 172 diagram on the Herefords so a 196 can run the camp hills.

If the unit has an engine out then the charging will not work in that unit as the other engine(s) are supplying the electrical supply to the defective carriage.

Wouldn't say they are being neglected as the depot looks after the 170s for XC so more trains to maintain. Then there is probably a supply issue for spare parts so more units are awaiting parts

Fair enough, just seemed strange that the sockets were out on two different units. And I wonder what's happened to the windows? All of them were like this on four different units (both the services I travelled on were different 3+2 sets) and I had time to have a pretty good look. Maybe some sort of coating that's gone bad? It was like a combined streaky/foggy effect, inside the glass "sandwich".

 

[JamesT]

Fair enough, just seemed strange that the sockets were out on two different units. And I wonder what's happened to the windows? All of them were like this on four different units (both the services I travelled on were different 3+2 sets) and I had time to have a pretty good look. Maybe some sort of coating that's gone bad? It was like a combined streaky/foggy effect, inside the glass "sandwich".

With the windows, that usually indicates the double-glazing has 'blown' and it's lost the seal of the vacuum between the two sheets of glass so moisture gets in.

 

[duffield]

With the windows, that usually indicates the double-glazing has 'blown' and it's lost the seal of the vacuum between the two sheets of glass so moisture gets in.

I've got a couple of those at home, it didn't look like that, and it would be very odd if every single one of them had gone on four units. It looked like dry fairly uniform streaks - maybe me mentioning "fogging" was misleading since that could imply moisture and there was no evidence of that. Streaking with some opacity between the streaks would be a better description. I should have taken a picture.

Edit: Should have searched more, there's some info available about this maybe being due to UV degradation of a coating, and/or the windows being some composite material which is damaged by UV or the the carriage wash. It seems to be an intrinsic problem which could only be solved by an complete expensive glazing replacement for the whole fleet.

 

[satisnek]

Welcome to the Snow Hill Lines. Fun, isn't it?

 

[amahy]

172 are only 15/16 years old, they aren't being replaced (if they were, what with?). WMR are struggling with their diesels ATM with shortforms and an addition 172 diagram on the Herefords so a 196 can run the camp hills.

If the unit has an engine out then the charging will not work in that unit as the other engine(s) are supplying the electrical supply to the defective carriage.

Wouldn't say they are being neglected as the depot looks after the 170s for XC so more trains to maintain. Then there is probably a supply issue for spare parts so more units are awaiting parts

Makes you wonder why a few more 196s weren't ordered in the first place then, as this would've most likely eliminated this problem.

 

[Topological]

Does anyone on the Snow Hill lines see the state of the 172s and dream of having the 150s back?

That said, we should always be aiming to improve the situation not be just better than the worst case.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

172 are only 15/16 years old, they aren't being replaced (if they were, what with?). WMR are struggling with their diesels ATM with shortforms and an addition 172 diagram on the Herefords so a 196 can run the camp hills.

Makes absolutely no sense to run the 196 on this short shuttle and have a 172 with fewer facilities, no tables, etc. work the 90 minute plus express to Hereford.

 

[rjames87]

Is one still going around with ex Chiltern blue interior too? Is there a plan for that to be refurbished to the same standard as the others?

 

[Johnhayworth21]

Does anyone on the Snow Hill lines see the state of the 172s and dream of having the 150s back?

That said, we should always be aiming to improve the situation not be just better than the worst case.

I can assure you nobody dreams of such thing.

 

[birchesgreen]

Does anyone on the Snow Hill lines see the state of the 172s and dream of having the 150s back?

That said, we should always be aiming to improve the situation not be just better than the worst case.

Come on now, nothing can be that bad!

USB charging sockets on WMR trains are rather poor no matter the stock.

 

[DS25]

Would it be possible for WMR to order BEMUs or MMUs to operate 196 services then the 196s can be cascaded to the snow hill lines? And then the 172s can go to Northern or someone who could use them?

 

[duffield]

Would it be possible for WMR to order BEMUs or MMUs to operate 196 services then the 196s can be cascaded to the snow hill lines? And then the 172s can go to Northern or someone who could use them?

Given the state of the windows, the 172s should be sent to a line with absolutely no good scenery at all.

 

[Topological]

Given the state of the windows, the 172s should be sent to a line with absolutely no good scenery at all.

So back to the Snow Hill Lines?

I actually like travelling through Birmingham on the train, but I guess the Snow Hill Lines do not count on many people's lists of scenic lines.

 

[duffield]

So back to the Snow Hill Lines?

I actually like travelling through Birmingham on the train, but I guess the Snow Hill Lines do not count on many people's lists of scenic lines.

Once you get out of the Birmingham suburbs, the line to Stratford-upon-Avon seems like it would be quite pretty if the windows were not obscured!

 

[Sparks807Evo]

I have noticed the dirt issue getting worse externally - given the 196s seem spotless externally and the XC 170s seem fine also, the poster suggesting a coating issue would seem to be right on the money. Given the 378s are going through a repaint programme, I would have thought the 172 are due soon? The vinyl has had to be patched in places now and starting to show its age (albeit quite alot were done in 2018 so that's understandable).

Whilst the 150s were "characteristic", I for one would rather a 172, albeit the lino flooring of the 150 held up significantly better than the carpet does! I never get the preference towards carpet on Metro services given the intensive use and inevitable mess from passengers.

It would make sense to order BMMUs at some point for the Hereford / Shrewsbury lines given the running under the wires, but preference would be a proper focus towards electrifying the Snow Hill lines given the intensive pathing and ability to free up DMUs for elsewhere.

 

[Johnhayworth21]

The four ex-Chiltern 172/1s are in dire need of a refurb. Seat bases are practically threadbare.

Ex-Overground and LM variants aren't holding up well either but they're nowhere near as bad. I really hope a refurb/repaint is on the cards for the near future.

 

[Recessio]

Is there a general problem with the mains/USB sockets on the WMR class 172s or was I just unlucky? None of the sockets I tried on two different units today (on the Kidderminster to Stratford-upon-Avon route) were working. Just seemed a bit of a coincidence. Also, all four units involved had an intrinsic problem with the windows being "dirty" on the *inside* of the double glazing so impossible to clean, it was brilliant sunshine outside and like being in a fog inside!

Are these units being neglected because they are reach the end of their lives - are the due to be replaced imminently?

Do you know if all of the USB sockets were out in the entire carriage? I dont know about the USB, but over on GWR Networker Turbos I've had it where all the three-pin plug AC sockets were dead because a fuse had tripped. Friendly guard managed to reset it.

 

[satisnek]

Do you know if all of the USB sockets were out in the entire carriage? I dont know about the USB, but over on GWR Networker Turbos I've had it where all the three-pin plug AC sockets were dead because a fuse had tripped. Friendly guard managed to reset it.

172s have AC sockets with a USB charging port built-in. I've never used the AC sockets myself (I normally carry just a USB cable on my person) but if some of the carriage lights are out and - tellingly - there's no noise/vibration from the engine, then the whole lot will be dead. Those USB sockets which are not broken/bunged up with chewing gum are very often badly worn with intermittent connection. This is not a fault of the trains but the people who use them, together with the fact that the USB connector is just a low-cost consumer design.

Whilst the 150s were "characteristic", I for one would rather a 172, albeit the lino flooring of the 150 held up significantly better than the carpet does! I never get the preference towards carpet on Metro services given the intensive use and inevitable mess from passengers.

The 150s did their job well, particularly with regard to being 75mph units on a 75mph line (south of Stourbridge). But the 172s have their strength in that if you fancy a trip down to Worcester on a hot summer's day, the air con is glorious! The carpets are in better condition than that in the Wetherspoon pub I went in the other day...

 

[duffield]

Off to Worcester (Foregate Street) yesterday I managed to get a class 196 service on the way there, so I could actually see out of the windows!

Coming back from Shrub Hill the class 172 was "foggy" on all windows as expected. Some of the countryside around there is really quite pretty, it's such a damn shame not to be able to appreciate it. On the way back I had to peer very hard at the rails etc. to tell if it was raining or not! It must give a bad impression to tourists.

Edit: And all the sockets in my coach on the 172 were non-functional again (I tried three and I saw someone else try about five so I think that's a reasonable conclusion). This is one reason why I always carry a battery bank!

 

[Russel]

Internally these aren't too bad.

Externally however, they are a mess, they need delivering into the standard WMR purple and orange, the gold and orange they are in was an odd choice and hasn't held up very well.