Class 701 'Aventra' trains for South Western Railway: progress updates

[Cach17]

Since it’s all owned by the DfT now, they can just be transferred to another TOC. The use of 458s on another area of third rail was confirmed by Lawrence Bowman in one of his interviews.

A source for the interview in question would be appreciated.

I've said it on this forum before and I'll say it again; SE already have enough fleets and I can't see them wanting to operate yet another.

 

[NSEWonderer]

Since it’s all owned by the DfT now, they can just be transferred to another TOC. The use of 458s on another area of third rail was confirmed by Lawrence Bowman in one of his interviews.

It wasn't confirmed, it was suggested. They currently have no new home yet

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Apr 2026 ==

Article: https://www.modernrailways.com/article/fleet-changes-south-western-railway

No home has been confirmed for the '458/4s', which were refurbished by Alstom in a £25 million scheme completed in December 2024, but there are suggestions they could transfer to other third-rail operators. The final five-car Class 458/5s were withdrawn at the end of March just days after the final two '455s' were removed from traffic.

 

[FRSZMZ56]

The ‘458s’ start to cascade out in a couple of months’ time.” The 28x4-car ‘458/4s’, which were only refurbished in 2023/24, are expected to move elsewhere on the third-rail system.

FEATURE: Bowman takes aim at SWR performance:

Establishing a secure connection ...

 

[Goldfish62]

[deleted]

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Apr 2026 ==

There's a separate thread for 458/4 speculation:

SWR status of class 458/4 [no speculation]

Status of fleet 458401 Out of service 458402 In passenger service 458403 In passenger service 458404 In passenger service 458405 In passenger service 458406 In passenger service 458407 In passenger service 458408 In passenger service 458409 In passenger service 458410 In passenger service...

www.railforums.co.uk

 

[mansonlo49]

Well, to recap
701014 came from Eastleigh to Wimbledon yesterday (Wednesday 22/04/26).
37501, 701507 & 701511 are currently on their way to DerbyLL from Bicester (Thursday 23/04026).
That seems to leave no loco for todays (Thursday 23/04/26) drag 5Q87 Bicester to Wimbledon as yesterdays move from Leicester was cancelled.
So I suspect that 5Q87 is a non-runner ?.

btw curious is that 37 first hauled 701 or its being done previously

 

[Stephen42]

Does that suggest an imminent entry into passenger service?

It's often a sign that it's near entering passenger service. 019 came into service less than 10 days from its last run on those trips or three weeks counting an earlier run on the same set of services. Others have had a smaller gap between the two (not something I track).

055 did the same set on Tuesday. I wouldn't like to guess which one would enter service first.

Although it is worth remembering that when the 458 upgrade and 4car conversion was announced in April 2021, they also said lease had been extended to 2027.

So not clear if they are being withdrawn (and returned) early, or just parked whilst still being paid for until next year until going off lease.

So 701s might be phased in, but if they are stuck with paying for 458s, then timescale of phasing in replacements might be lower priority

While the award has been cancelled, this quote from a maintenance transparency notice suggests the intent is for them to disappear at pace. The dates won't necessarily be accurate, it's a procurement notice not a detailed plan, but that's 14 weeks which if it happens is close to a pair a week replaced by 701s.

SWRL's class 458 is entering a descaling of services before being placed in warm storage from 20/04/2026 to 03/08/2026

This week has 42 701 diagrams, next week has 43 (but one fewer 458/4 pair) making 53 daily 701 diagrams sufficient to replace them all. That's doable with the 701/0s alone with ability to have one or two not in passenger service as well.

While they are paying for 458/4s regardless, accompanying costs like maintenance and training new employees can be reduced by having them in store for that period. The 701s are paid for and the maintenance capability for the whole lot so might as well use them. I would agree the financial cost involved means that significant delays likely lead to withdrawal slip rather than heading to store regardless.

 

[OneTrackMinded]

There's a separate thread for 458/4 speculation:

The thread you have linked specifically says “no speculation”.

 

[Goldfish62]

The thread you have linked specifically says “no speculation”.

So it does!

Anyway, this thread is definitely not for 458/4 speculation!

 

[swr444]

i think we’ll see more 450 diagrams go over to 701s, probably alternating with the 458s. The 458/4s won’t disappear that quickly.

 

[Siemens Staines]

i think we’ll see more 450 diagrams go over to 701s, probably alternating with the 458s. The 458/4s won’t disappear that quickly.

Is it possible that both may happen at the same time so that 701s replace pairs of 450s on metro services and those 450s replace pairs of 458/4s?

 

[NSEWonderer]

Is it possible that both may happen at the same time so that 701s replace pairs of 450s on metro services and those 450s replace pairs of 458/4s?

More so just 701s displacing 450s. 450s wouldn't be displacing 458/4s which are solely confined to Windsor side of which sees barely any 450s now. It will be interesting to see how some drivers at Staines and Feltham, more so the latter manage to keep Desiro competency as I dare say more than 90% of their work involves just 458 and 701 now

 

[Siemens Staines]

More so just 701s displacing 450s. 450s wouldn't be displacing 458/4s which are solely confined to Windsor side of which sees barely any 450s now. It will be interesting to see how some drivers at Staines and Feltham, more so the latter manage to keep Desiro competency as I dare say more than 90% of their work involves just 458 and 701 now

I was just thinking along the lines of a short term measure if SWR want the 458/4s gone by August. The subject of Staines and Feltham retaining 450 competency came up a while ago and apparently they still had booked main line work on 450s, to Woking or Farnham I guess. I thought that 450s were the base traction for all SWR emu drivers, but of course that may all have changed by now. I notice that the last two pairs of 450s released by 701 introductions have not been redeployed elsewhere and have effectively become spare. This week one of those pairs should have been used on the Hounslow extras although in practice the morning train never ran.

 

[73128]

A source for the interview in question would be appreciated.

I've said it on this forum before and I'll say it again; SE already have enough fleets and I can't see them wanting to operate yet another.

Rumoured that heading for Southern (who have some experience with similar) to displace 377 to SE.

 

[Bobcp]

Well, to recap
701014 came from Eastleigh to Wimbledon yesterday (Wednesday 22/04/26).
37501, 701507 & 701511 are currently on their way to DerbyLL from Bicester (Thursday 23/04026).
That seems to leave no loco for todays (Thursday 23/04/26) drag 5Q87 Bicester to Wimbledon as yesterdays move from Leicester was cancelled.
So I suspect that 5Q87 is a non-runner ?.

I assume that 93004 which arrived from RTC Derby, as an ROG working (0Q71), on Monday 21st. remains at BicesterMOD for moving the 701/5's around the site.

 

[Peter Sarf]

I assume that 93004 which arrived from RTC Derby, as an ROG working (0Q71), on Monday 21st. remains at BicesterMOD for moving the 701/5's around the site.

I wonder what was used before 93004 went there to move 701/5s around ?. I doubt moving 701s around has become much more common ?.
(I mean they get moved regularly to stop the bearings getting distorted anyway).

I note a 37 did the actual drag.of a pair of 701/5s from Bicester to Derby on Thursday 23/04/2026 and for those who did not notice it was via London !.

 

[Bobcp]

I wonder what was used before 93004 went there to move 701/5s around ?. I doubt moving 701s around has become much more common ?.
(I mean they get moved regularly to stop the bearings getting distorted anyway).

I note a 37 did the actual drag.of a pair of 701/5s from Bicester to Derby on Thursday 23/04/2026 and for those who did not notice it was via London !.

37510 and 37611, to name but two, have all spent lengthy periods there in the past.
Also I believe they have at least one, on site, MOD shunter.

 

[norbitonflyer]

I assume that 93004 which arrived from RTC Derby, as an ROG working (0Q71), on Monday 21st. remains at BicesterMOD for moving the 701/5's around the site.

They really are struggling to find a use for the 93s aren't they?

 

[Peter Sarf]

37510 and 37611, to name but two, have all spent lengthy periods there in the past.
Also I believe they have at least one, on site, MOD shunter.

Thanks. Was Long Marston different btw, as I think there are a few shunters there ?.

They really are struggling to find a use for the 93s aren't they?

That was my thought. But I suppose maybe using less diesel than a 37.
But not far away are eight class 18s with nothing to do.

I see a pattern here, stock (units & locos) lying around not being used.

 

[swr444]

Rumoured that heading for Southern (who have some experience with similar) to displace 377 to SE.

Using what DOO cameras? I doubt it.

 

[Cach17]

Rumoured that heading for Southern (who have some experience with similar) to displace 377 to SE.

Somewhere relatively quiet and self-contained like the Coastway routes out of Brighton may well be an ideal home, akin to the 313s.

Regardless, it had better be Southern. It'd be insane if GX replaced their entire fleet for the fourth time in under 30 years!

(On that tangent, GX once hired a pair of 458s for about a year in 05/06 to provide cover and enable the last of the 73/488/489 sets to be retired. They were never actually used in service though.)

 

[Peter Sarf]

I assume that 93004 which arrived from RTC Derby, as an ROG working (0Q71), on Monday 21st. remains at BicesterMOD for moving the 701/5's around the site.

If 93004 is being used for shunting 701/5s at Bicester then does that indicate that 93s might get used for an actual drag ?.

I am thinking the shunts at Bicester with 93004 might be more than just a loose shunt but more of a practice move with brakes controlled ?.
(a precursor to 93s being found suitable for dragging 701/5s, or at east making sure each 701/5 is ready for a drag).

 

[FRSZMZ56]

Looks like the promise of a timetable overhaul thanks to the 701 rollout and public ownership is starting with a "Share your Views" page now online ahead of the full consultation and implementation in Dec 27/May 28:

Following our recent transfer to public ownership and the rollout of our new Arterio trains, maximising fleet capacity across the network, we’re taking the opportunity to fully refresh our timetable – the first major timetable change on this network in over 20 years.

Have your say on the SWR Future Timetablele

We’re taking the opportunity to fully refresh our network. Share your feedback to help us build a timetable fit for the future.

www.southwesterntimetable.com

Although somewhat related to the 701 rollout, if there's a SWR Timetable thread somewhere it might be more applicable to discuss there

 

[Goldfish62]

Looks like the promise of a timetable overhaul thanks to the 701 rollout and public ownership is starting with a "Share your Views" page now online ahead of the full consultation and implementation in Dec 27/May 28:

Have your say on the SWR Future Timetablele

We’re taking the opportunity to fully refresh our network. Share your feedback to help us build a timetable fit for the future.

www.southwesterntimetable.com

Although somewhat related to the 701 rollout, if there's a SWR Timetable thread somewhere it might be more applicable to discuss there

That page has been around for a while, but as you say it's a start!

 

[NSEWonderer]

I was just thinking along the lines of a short term measure if SWR want the 458/4s gone by August. The subject of Staines and Feltham retaining 450 competency came up a while ago and apparently they still had booked main line work on 450s, to Woking or Farnham I guess. I thought that 450s were the base traction for all SWR emu drivers, but of course that may all have changed by now. I notice that the last two pairs of 450s released by 701 introductions have not been redeployed elsewhere and have effectively become spare. This week one of those pairs should have been used on the Hounslow extras although in practice the morning train never ran.

Only one or two early duties at Feltham have Desiro work from what I understand. None of the late jobs do. Staines still has a few Desiro work although come May that may reduce even more.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Apr 2026 ==

Somewhere relatively quiet and self-contained like the Coastway routes out of Brighton may well be an ideal home, akin to the 313s.

Regardless, it had better be Southern. It'd be insane if GX replaced their entire fleet for the fourth time in under 30 years!

(On that tangent, GX once hired a pair of 458s for about a year in 05/06 to provide cover and enable the last of the 73/488/489 sets to be retired. They were never actually used in service though.)

I had old photos of that unit

 

[Ridgeblog]

I had old photos of that unit
View attachment 203023View attachment 203022
View attachment 203021

Ironic that the gatwick express branding (which looked quite stylish in that font and almost as good as the single "express" logo) sits well on the unit as the swt long distance livery they used to wear looked quite similar to the later livery the 460s wore when southern took over the brand. It's almost foreshadowing both fleets eventually ending up and unifying at swt!

 

[Goldfish62]

Only one or two early duties at Feltham have Desiro work from what I understand. None of the late jobs do. Staines still has a few Desiro work although come May that may reduce even more.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Apr 2026 ==


I had old photos of that unit
View attachment 203023View attachment 203022
View attachment 203021

They were converted to 2+2 seating and had extra luggage racks fitted.

 

[Big Jumby 74]

I was just thinking along the lines of a short term measure if SWR want the 458/4s gone by August. The subject of Staines and Feltham retaining 450 competency came up a while ago and apparently they still had booked main line work on 450s, to Woking or Farnham I guess. I thought that 450s were the base traction for all SWR emu drivers, but of course that may all have changed by now. I notice that the last two pairs of 450s released by 701 introductions have not been redeployed elsewhere and have effectively become spare. This week one of those pairs should have been used on the Hounslow extras although in practice the morning train never ran.

Granted much has changed, even since I took to the armchair permanently, but IIRC Feltham as is, was specific to the 701 introduction, so my guess is that as such Desiro knowledge may be limited to perhaps one link/xx number of duties for contingency reasons.
The same might be said of Staines, although they have a history of non Windsor side work, stoppers to Woking etc (as mentioned above) albeit those are all going over to 701 of course, but the premier (?) main line turn for SN was once the 16.50 Waterloo to Pompey, as far as Guildford if my grey cells recall correctly (and that's a big IF !).

My gut would say SN need to retain Desiro work, even if just for contingency/main line diversions via Chertsey, and so they would ideally be given Desiro diagrams (something like Basing/Alton's ?) between Waterloo and Woking perhaps in the base plan, even if only a percentage of the overall establishment at SN.
Shall now retire to my armchair - anyone know where I can acquire a S/H 450 drivers seat....

 

[Bigfoot]

My gut would say SN need to retain Desiro work, even if just for contingency/main line diversions via Chertsey, and so they would ideally be given Desiro diagrams (something like Basing/Alton's ?) between Waterloo and Woking perhaps in the base plan, even if only a percentage of the overall establishment at SN.
Shall now retire to my armchair - anyone know where I can acquire a S/H 450 drivers seat....

Staines don't sign the Byfleet curve for mainline diversions nor do Feltham. The depot you think would (especially Staines). Bizarrely at least some of Strawberry Hill do. Logic

 

[Big Jumby 74]

Staines don't sign the Byfleet curve for mainline diversions

Last I heard that short stretch could be covered by video/dvd (or whatever) in the class room, but that may have changed of course. Certain ML depots proved problematic for when STP planned diversions were in place round that way, and (forgive me if my memory has failed me) Salisbury was one in question, combination of (lack of) route knowledge and associated (lack of) traction knowledge for pilots?
As said, 'one' may well be long out of date on the rules by now.

PS: Strawberry Hill may have some history in that many a test train worked out and back from there back in BR days, to locations various, long before there were any dedicated driver pools (eg Portabrook) to undertake such work. Just a thought?

 

[Peter Sarf]

Last I heard that short stretch could be covered by video/dvd (or whatever) in the class room, but that may have changed of course. Certain ML depots proved problematic for when STP planned diversions were in place round that way, and (forgive me if my memory has failed me) Salisbury was one in question, combination of (lack of) route knowledge and associated (lack of) traction knowledge for pilots?
As said, 'one' may well be long out of date on the rules by now.

PS: Strawberry Hill may have some history in that many a test train worked out and back from there back in BR days, to locations various, long before there were any dedicated driver pools (eg Portabrook) to undertake such work. Just a thought?

The De-icing units used to be kept at Strawberry Hill back in the last century. They would have roved far and wide only bounded by the juice rail.