West Coast Motors & Borders Buses

[CMBS]

The cal mac ferry at least connects with the train into Glasgow Central. Western ferries leaves you well outside either town centre and without any decent transport connection aside a bus stop.

The problem for the cal mac ferry is that it’s been undermined over the years, the removal of through ticketing with ScotRail and using ferries unable to cope with the conditions on the firth of Clyde don’t help, but severing the through transport connection to Glasgow is not the solution. Buses don’t really cut it for many people for a journey if that distance.

That's presumably why a public consultation was and still is planned for as of March regarding the service (with no date due yet)
Specifically stated under the Transport section of the March meeting subtitled "Further Action Required" - "Development of Gourock/Dunoon survey questionnaire"

 

[CMBS]

About 4 26 plate E200 MMC's have been ordered in the Borders, with the first entering service without labelling last week.

 

[DunsBus]

About 4 26 plate E200 MMC's have been ordered in the Borders, with the first entering service without labelling last week.

12602 - YX26ORO, entered service on 9th April. Apparently 14 are due as replacements for the ex-Perryman's Versas, which are due to transfer to Oban once all of the new E200MMCs are in service. However, as the Versas' Borders obituaries has been written more than once I'll wait until I see visible evidence that they actually are going!

All of the new E200MMCs are from ADL stock, so no bike racks or tables unlike on 11913-11922 and 12001-12010.

 

[route101]

About 4 26 plate E200 MMC's have been ordered in the Borders, with the first entering service without labelling last week.

I took a 26 plate example last weekend on the 51. £12.10 single if not using the app single fare!

 

[CMBS]

12602 - YX26ORO, entered service on 9th April. Apparently 14 are due as replacements for the ex-Perryman's Versas, which are due to transfer to Oban once all of the new E200MMCs are in service. However, as the Versas' Borders obituaries has been written more than once I'll wait until I see visible evidence that they actually are going!

All of the new E200MMCs are from ADL stock, so no bike racks or tables unlike on 11913-11922 and 12001-12010.

Unfortunate shame to see that a lot of the Argyll depots (especially Rothesay/Mull and coaches in Dunoon/Ardrishaig) are being used as dumping grounds for old stock before they eventually get written off.

Another thing to point out on the Argyll fleet is the neglect of livery maintenance, with many buses having half labels or no labels at all, and some vehicles wearing two liveries at once (the latter livery obviously being a minor defect) as a result of using spare parts.

 

[JKP]

Unfortunate shame to see that a lot of the Argyll depots (especially Rothesay/Mull and coaches in Dunoon/Ardrishaig) are being used as dumping grounds for old stock before they eventually get written off.

Another thing to point out on the Argyll fleet is the neglect of livery maintenance, with many buses having half labels or no labels at all, and some vehicles wearing two liveries at once (the latter livery obviously being a minor defect) as a result of using spare parts.

Personally I would prefer that Borders Buses kept the ex Perrymans Versas rather than ubiquitous ADL stock e200s. The Versas have good legroom and are generally in vgc for their age.

 

[CMBS]

All network maps have been removed from WCM and Borders' websites.

Regional route maps still viewable on individual route pages.

 

[route101]

All network maps have been removed from WCM and Borders' websites.

Regional route maps still viewable on individual route pages.

Any reason why?

 

[CMBS]

Any reason why?

No reason. Biggest guess would be upcoming rebranding (It has already been applied to Kintyre Express timetables) as well as being many years out of date (being uploaded pre-COVID)

 

[Volvodart]

West Coast Motors have finally posted something about the X19 on Facebook

X19 service update

West Coast Motors is now operating the X19 service on behalf of Stagecoach

Customers can now track the X19 live on the West Coast Motors app, making it easier to plan your journey and see when your bus is on its way.

There are no changes to the X19 timetable, and the service will continue to run as normal.

Ticket purchasing through the West Coast Motors app will follow, with more details to be confirmed soon. X19 tickets remain available through existing channels.

Please remember that X19 tickets are valid on the X19 service only and cannot be used on other West Coast Motors services.

For general enquiries, feedback or complaints about the X19, please continue to contact Stagecoach Customer Services. https://www.stagecoachbus.com/help-and-contact/faqs/contact-us

 

[smtglasgow]

I’m still fascinated by how this works for both WCM and Stagecoach. Presumably the X19 does OK, but West Coast will be looking to hit a certain margin and Stagecoach will want to make something out of it too – is it making enough to keep both happy? The City-QE Hospital section can be pretty quiet.

I know this kind of sub-contracting isn’t new, but this is a major cross-city service with a pretty high PVR. The only comparable Scottish example I can think of was when Dart buses ran the Pollok services in the early 2000s – and that didn’t end well.

West Coast taking over completely seems the logical next step, but maybe they’re both biding their time to see how (or if) franchising pans out.

 

[MotCO]

I’m still fascinated by how this works for both WCM and Stagecoach. Presumably the X19 does OK, but West Coast will be looking to hit a certain margin and Stagecoach will want to make something out of it too – is it making enough to keep both happy? The City-QE Hospital section can be pretty quiet.

I know this kind of sub-contracting isn’t new, but this is a major cross-city service with a pretty high PVR. The only comparable Scottish example I can think of was when Dart buses ran the Pollok services in the early 2000s – and that didn’t end well.

West Coast taking over completely seems the logical next step, but maybe they’re both biding their time to see how (or if) franchising pans out.

Do Stagecoach have any staff retention / recruitment issues? Is their depot full, or is space required to install electric charges? These may be other factors which mean that Stagecoach are unable to run the route, but still want to regain control in the future.

 

[Stan Drews]

Do Stagecoach have any staff retention / recruitment issues? Is their depot full, or is space required to install electric charges? These may be other factors which mean that Stagecoach are unable to run the route, but still want to regain control in the future.

Stagecoach have closed the depot (Cumbernauld) which operated the X19, as they said the depot was no longer sustainable.

 

[AilsaBus]

Stagecoach have closed the depot (Cumbernauld) which operated the X19, as they said the depot was no longer sustainable.

Never understood why they moved from Blochairn to Cumbernauld, Blochairn was a prime location for a depot just minutes from the City Centre.

 

[Spsf3232]

I’m still fascinated by how this works for both WCM and Stagecoach. Presumably the X19 does OK, but West Coast will be looking to hit a certain margin and Stagecoach will want to make something out of it too – is it making enough to keep both happy? The City-QE Hospital section can be pretty quiet.

I know this kind of sub-contracting isn’t new, but this is a major cross-city service with a pretty high PVR. The only comparable Scottish example I can think of was when Dart buses ran the Pollok services in the early 2000s – and that didn’t end well.

West Coast taking over completely seems the logical next step, but maybe they’re both biding their time to see how (or if) franchising pans out.

WCM will simply have a contact to cover staffing, vehicle maintenance, fueling and cleaning. They don't have any dealings with the money that the X19 earns as that will pass to Stagecoach.

It will simply be what the X19 makes in revenue, less contracted costs to make it worth while stagecoach keeping it

 

[Sealink]

The cal mac ferry at least connects with the train into Glasgow Central. Western ferries leaves you well outside either town centre and without any decent transport connection aside a bus stop.

The problem for the cal mac ferry is that it’s been undermined over the years, the removal of through ticketing with ScotRail and using ferries unable to cope with the conditions on the firth of Clyde don’t help, but severing the through transport connection to Glasgow is not the solution. Buses don’t really cut it for many people for a journey if that distance.

Connections on the Dunoon side aren't that bad, at times two buses an hour from Hunters Quay to Dunoon (Services 480, 489). Forgot late night connections, mind.

On the other side there is also a two per hour bus service to Glasgow (Service 901)

But I would still prefer Gourock Pier to Dunoon Pier, and I can see through tickets and a dedicated Rail Sail page on the ScotRail website

 

[Volvodart]

There has been another update on Facebook about the X19:-

Glasgow service update – X19

Good morning,

West Coast Motors is currently operating the Stagecoach X19 service on behalf of Stagecoach.

The X19 will normally operate using Stagecoach buses, however if any Stagecoach vehicles are unavailable, West Coast Motors vehicles may be used on some journeys.

No matter which vehicle is operating your service, all X19 journeys can be tracked live using the West Coast Motors app or website.

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

There has been another update on Facebook about the X19:-

Glad you can track the service again, Those MCV Evolutions are a treat on the service nice and smooth with them being Volvo, get the odd Evora on it too, Some of the Stagecoach E400MMCs must be off for maintenance there's been a right shortage of them recently, they're all absolutely knackered from their X25 days

 

[CMBS]

The public survey regarding the renewed CalMac service with the 907 service proposal has been opened on DCC's Facebook page, with the final verdict on the service expected to be decided when it is closed in August.
Service 907 is listed as Option 4 of alternative ferry options - "Similar to the previous 907 service except service to Glasgow Buchanan Street would be limited stop, and run every 2 hours to Glasgow, but every 20 minutes to Gourock Railway Station with no need to get off the bus at Hunters Quay / McInroys Point"

Official statement from DCC on this year's annual meeting which took place a few days ago - "The Transport Lead has also spent considerable amount of time investigating and costing the reinstatement of the 907 bus service from Dunoon to Glasgow. A hybrid solution is being suggested that would see the current Ferry service stopped in favour of a 2 hourly service between Dunoon / Glasgow and a 20 minute service between Dunoon and Gourock Railway station. The Ferry survey referenced below has this as an option, hence seeking community views before progressing further." - https://img1.wsimg.com/blobby/go/f884b801-c565-4d50-9296-52465391011c/downloads/268966b8-0074-4622-bbd5-226d8cb7b214/DCC TM240516 Minutes AGM 2026 - Draft.pdf?ver=1778838633422 at page 19

 

[Strathclyder]

WCM have bought more B8/Evoras, only know this as I spotted an all white 26-plate example on the 17 in Faifley on Wednesday evening.

Checking BLOTW confirms that 3 examples were registered under the Craig name last month: SF26 WCC/WCD/WCE (12606 thru 608).

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

WCM have bought more B8/Evoras, only know this as I spotted an all white 26-plate example on the 17 in Faifley on Wednesday evening.

Checking BLOTW confirms that 3 examples were registered under the Craig name last month: SF26 WCC/WCD/WCE (12606 thru 608).

They're always on the X19 mostly, speculation is that they're ment to be going in Stagecoach blue, Sounds odd tbh never know, All 3 are on the X19 again today

 

[CMBS]

WCM have bought more B8/Evoras, only know this as I spotted an all white 26-plate example on the 17 in Faifley on Wednesday evening.

Checking BLOTW confirms that 3 examples were registered under the Craig name last month: SF26 WCC/WCD/WCE (12606 thru 608).

There was briefly a fourth one listed, assuming that was an error since the reg was slightly off

They're always on the X19 mostly, speculation is that they're ment to be going in Stagecoach blue, Sounds odd tbh never know, All 3 are on the X19 again today

I think a new livery is expected following the CoC rebrand but assuming the 907 proposals go ahead or not (most likely + the survey has extremely poor turnout) there is a chance of them possibly being trialed on the new service if it was to happen as WCM are interested in operating it. But then I also see WCM adding them as permanent extra X19 stock

 

[Dfatcontroller]

There was briefly a fourth one listed, assuming that was an error since the reg was slightly off

The 4th one was actually SF26VXD which was mis-reported in the PSV Circle as with Craig, Cumbernauld. Correctly locally to be Craig/WCM but was actually the Ferrymill Motors one.

 

[Mollman]

They're always on the X19 mostly, speculation is that they're ment to be going in Stagecoach blue, Sounds odd tbh never know, All 3 are on the X19 again today

Compass in Sussex have buses in Stagecoach livery for services they operate on behalf of Stagecoach, so not unheard of.

 

[Dfatcontroller]

They're always on the X19 mostly, speculation is that they're ment to be going in Stagecoach blue, Sounds odd tbh never know, All 3 are on the X19 again today

All three were on the X19 again today too.

 

[JD2168]

The 4th one was actually SF26VXD which was mis-reported in the PSV Circle as with Craig, Cumbernauld. Correctly locally to be Craig/WCM but was actually the Ferrymill Motors one.

SF26 VXD is currently with Stagecoach Yorkshire on loan from Ferrymill Motors numbered FM50, seen on Friday on 6 in Sheffield Centre

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

All three were on the X19 again today too.

NSAs work for the X19 too

 

[Dfatcontroller]

NSAs work for the X19 too

NSA?

 

[AndrewTaylor95]

NSA?

Next stop announcements

 

[DunsBus]

Compass in Sussex have buses in Stagecoach livery for services they operate on behalf of Stagecoach, so not unheard of.

Also happened in 1998 with Redby Travel in Sunderland, and in 2001 with Dart Buses in Paisley. Both these companies had buses in Stagecoach livery for services run on Stagecoach's behalf.