Wagon fleet news and discussion

[class442]

These would be the FBA wagons, which were previously used for the HS2 Tunnel Panels between West Ruislip and Grain, however I am unsure if this flow still runs. If the run has since ceased, GBRf are probably just taking the chance to put these on intermodals since they still have the capability to carry containers and are just lying around without much else work to do. I do remember seeing a few of these at Peterborough myself last year, so I would imagine they are using it to allow more containers to be loaded?

This run should restart in May, at least to Willesden.

 

[hwl]

This run should restart in May, at least to Willesden.

These would be the FBA wagons, which were previously used for the HS2 Tunnel Panels between West Ruislip and Grain, however I am unsure if this flow still runs. If the run has since ceased, GBRf are probably just taking the chance to put these on intermodals since they still have the capability to carry containers and are just lying around without much else work to do. I do remember seeing a few of these at Peterborough myself last year, so I would imagine they are using it to allow more containers to be loaded?

The first "Euston" TBM has started so the segment stockpile at Willesden will start falling rapidly hence the the need to increase the supply rate to Willesden (they have slowly been filling the storage area over the last 5-6months). They probably had about 8% delivered before the start of tunnelling so another set of wagons would be useful.

 

[Adrian Barr]

last week I noticed a selection of relatively elderly "flat" wagons in the consist of a GBRF intermodal train passing Peterborough.

These were from the 600000-600024 batch, which I haven't seen in intermodal consists for several years.

I remember seeing FBA wagons in an intermodal consist in TOPS a few years ago and wondering "what the heck is an FBA wagon?"

The caption to this photo has a bit of background history - they were previously KFA container flats in use with British Gypsum, numbered in the BGL 953xx series.
600015 at Peterborough en route from Felixstowe to Doncaster Railport in 2018: https://www.flickr.com/photos/125049968@N03/25662706077/ (Photo: Douglas Rawson)

BGL 95310 seen when new at Derby RTC in 1994: https://www.flickr.com/photos/82085846@N02/49889000163/ (Photo: Dave Bower)

Wagons in use with British Gypsum in 1995 on the Settle & Carlisle behind 60027: https://www.flickr.com/photos/187414118@N06/54634896339/ (Photo: Dave Peachey)

FBA 600019 at Doncaster Wabtec works in 2014 (apparently they were refurbished here before going into service with GBRF on intermodal trains): https://www.flickr.com/photos/73574431@N06/14232657561/ (Photo: Peter Bester)

I'd not paid much attention to them being 40ft container flats before - the British Gypsum container flows must have been unusual in using 20ft (PFA), 40ft (KFA) and 60ft (KFA / FCA) flat wagons at various times in the 2000s. I think the 40ft length has an advantage on the segment flows by reducing the length of the train - Freightliner use standard FSA container flats on the Hartlepool services, but due to the weight of the segments there's an empty 20ft space in the middle of each wagon:

Loaded FSA wagons on the Hartlepool - Willesden segment train in 2024: https://www.flickr.com/photos/darrenjb/53811063034/ (Photo: Darren JB)

As mentioned in the railfreight thread (posts #2302 to #2306) the Hartlepool trains have been running to Grain recently to add to the stockpile there.

Back to the FBA wagons - cradles are seen mounted on 600006 at Tonbridge Yard in 2023: https://www.flickr.com/photos/60854097@N06/52626969153/ (Photo: Pats Trains UK)

The Grain to West Ruislip service en route in daylight in 2024: https://www.flickr.com/photos/nicjoynson/53896327125/ (Photo: Nic Joynson)

When the Grain to West Ruislip flow halted, they must have had the cradles removed and gone back into use on regular intermodals with GBRF. 4M07 / 4L07 from Felixstowe to Birch Coppice and back seems to have been the regular service for several of the FBA wagons last week.

While on the subject of concrete tunnel segments, this photo of loaded FCAs at Tallington in 2021 is worth including here:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/icypixel/51192839915/ (Photo: Class313)
The Tallington segments were for a London sewer project, and were a smaller diameter when compared to the HS2 tunnel segments.

Empty FCAs at Grain after delivering segments from Tallington in 2021:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/sparkiesphotos/52278467109/ (Photo: Jacob Sparkles)

Separately a question; would anyone be able to advise if any wagons from the FLA (606101-606180), FTA (607001-607140) or FSA 608001-608560) batches are long term stored, or scrapped?

I still need a handful of these for confirmed sightings, and would be interested to know if there is any chance of seeing them in service or not.

There are numerous FLA / FSA / FTA stored. In addition to the ones at Bristol (post #89) there are wagons at Doncaster Railport, Southampton Maritime and Guide Bridge in TOPS. If you have the numbers of the handful in question I'll see where they are.

I remember at least one FLA was seriously damaged in the collision at Loversall (near Doncaster) a few years back, with 606017 - no longer on TOPS - seen after recovery from the site:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/tayrail/52268794111/ (Photo: Jim Ramsey)
The accident report doesn't give details of wagon numbers, but mentions the rear 4 wagons of the Freightliner service involved were damaged.

 

[StanFromEccles]

Hello all, I don't use this website much and I'm not sure if this is the right thread to ask on but I had a few questions relating to 4-wheeled wagons.

Does anybody know what's happening, or has happened, with the TUAs which used to run between Lindsey and Immingham, now that the refinery has stopped operating.

And are there any dates on when the Walsall-Earle's Sidings PCA tankers are getting replaced

Any answers would be appreciated

 

[Adrian Barr]

Does anybody know what's happening, or has happened, with the TUAs which used to run between Lindsey and Immingham, now that the refinery has stopped operating.

They are all still in the sidings at Lindsey refinery according to TOPS, along with a large number of TEAs.

That includes VTG 70107, first wagon visible in this rare 2019 shot of the working, which delivered methanol to Lindsey refinery from the former Simon Storage West tank farm (later owned by Inter Terminals and now Exolum).
https://www.flickr.com/photos/dbs60100/40696436583/ (Photo: DBS60100)

There was also a set of bogie tanks used on the same working - the bogie tanks carried ethanol while the TUAs carried methanol to the refinery (both presumably used for blending into petrol, which I understand typically contains 5 or 10% ethanol when sold at the pump).

And are there any dates on when the Walsall-Earle's Sidings PCA tankers are getting replaced

I don't know about specific dates, but the Earles - Walsall flow uses 2 sets of wagons, with 36 wagons being the usual train length. If the new bogie wagons are being delivered in batches of 18, each of the next 2 deliveries will presumably displace one set of PCAs each time, with Breedon having 62 JPA wagons on order according to their website:
https://www.breedongroup.com/media/...imillion-pound-investment-in-new-build-wagons

 

[Dunfanaghy Roa]

I remember seeing FBA wagons in an intermodal consist in TOPS a few years ago and wondering "what the heck is an FBA wagon?"

The caption to this photo has a bit of background history - they were previously KFA container flats in use with British Gypsum, numbered in the BGL 953xx series.
600015 at Peterborough en route from Felixstowe to Doncaster Railport in 2018: https://www.flickr.com/photos/125049968@N03/25662706077/ (Photo: Douglas Rawson)

Some of them appeared at Southampton Docks in the early days of the Gypsum traffic to Mountfield. They were brilliant, especially compared to the MoD and BG PFAs. They had brakes that would stop on a sixpence. My flabber was totally gasted when they were taken away. Definitely a backwards move on BG's part.
Pat

 

[StanFromEccles]

They are all still in the sidings at Lindsey refinery according to TOPS, along with a large number of TEAs.

That includes VTG 70107, first wagon visible in this rare 2019 shot of the working, which delivered methanol to Lindsey refinery from the former Simon Storage West tank farm (later owned by Inter Terminals and now Exolum).
https://www.flickr.com/photos/dbs60100/40696436583/ (Photo: DBS60100)

There was also a set of bogie tanks used on the same working - the bogie tanks carried ethanol while the TUAs carried methanol to the refinery (both presumably used for blending into petrol, which I understand typically contains 5 or 10% ethanol when sold at the pump).



I don't know about specific dates, but the Earles - Walsall flow uses 2 sets of wagons, with 36 wagons being the usual train length. If the new bogie wagons are being delivered in batches of 18, each of the next 2 deliveries will presumably displace one set of PCAs each time, with Breedon having 62 JPA wagons on order according to their website:
https://www.breedongroup.com/media/...imillion-pound-investment-in-new-build-wagons

I've heard Phillips 66 are taking over the Lindsey site, so perhaps a possibility of the TUAs moving back into their regular service

 

[eastwestdivide]

Continuing the Hope 4-wheeler story, just saw a 70 with 18 bogie tanks on today's Dewsbury-Hope.

 

[Noseygit]

Out of curiosity the 70 4663 range wagons on GBRF circuit the batch of these from 341 - 400 have still not yet entered the country despite the higher numbered ones coming , so are we to presume that the missing batch has been cancelled or does anyone know when they are likely to come ??

Kind Regards
Tony

 

[geordieblue]

Looks like the timber wagons previously used on the Baglan flow (which I thought was meant to be coming back) are being scrapped - unless there’s another use intended for them: LINK

 

[furnessvale]

Looks like the timber wagons previously used on the Baglan flow (which I thought was meant to be coming back) are being scrapped - unless there’s another use intended for them: LINK

Didn't I read in another post that the ability to use a new timber facility at Kingmoor to full extent, will be hindered by the lack of timber wagons?

 

[Adrian Barr]

Out of curiosity the 70 4663 range wagons on GBRF circuit the batch of these from 341 - 400 have still not yet entered the country despite the higher numbered ones coming , so are we to presume that the missing batch has been cancelled or does anyone know when they are likely to come ??

I'm not sure why there's a gap in the number range, but this August 2023 announcement from GBRF declared that the final FEA-G wagons had been delivered. That was a couple of years ago, so it looks unlikely that any more are coming: https://www.gbrailfreight.com/the-final-fea-g-intermodal-wagons-have-now-arrived-in-the-uk/

Looks like the timber wagons previously used on the Baglan flow (which I thought was meant to be coming back) are being scrapped - unless there’s another use intended for them: LINK

There's a couple of interesting photos of them being propelled down the Cardiff Docks branch from Tidal Yard:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/turners_pics/55115206767/ (Photo: Martin Turner)
https://www.flickr.com/photos/turners_pics/55116080496/ (Photo: Martin Turner)

I think these wagons are owned by Touax. It's unusual for wagon hire companies to instantly dispose of wagons after a traffic flow ends unless they are sure they have no further use (or they are obsolete / being replaced by new wagons / not cost effective to repair or maintain due to being non-standard etc.).

Apart from the loading point for imported slab and coil for Tata (adjacent to Roath Dock), the only other facility down the Cardiff Docks branch is the export scrap terminal for Ward Recycling at Queen Alexandra Dock. This is where the GBRF operated scrap trains from Burton go to (unlike the DB scrap trains into Cardiff Tidal which are for 7Steel - previously Celsa - at Tremorfa works). Are the scrap trains from Burton still running?

I've not known any wagons to be scrapped by Ward in Cardiff Docks (although DB cut up plenty of redundant steel wagons inside Tidal Yard) but it's not an obvious location for wagon storage either.

Google maps now has some more up-to-date imagery showing the Ward recycling terminal, with GBRF bogie box wagons visible adjacent to Longships Road. There's a wall or fence which separates the scrap terminal from the adjacent docks branch / sidings. It's within the docks complex with no public access, so I can't find any photos of the terminal itself.

The track layout of the terminal doesn't appear to have changed much since it's use by "Coastal Containers," with 37698 seen here in 2004 with an "Enterprise" trip to Newport:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/93293618@N05/55121521850/ (Photo: FEWS FOTS)

 

[Dunfanaghy Roa]

The timber wagons are the heavily modified Rover Hi-Cubes. Why they weren't recoded and renumbered (as per TSI) I have no idea, but 3623 Rfnoos was created in 2008 (to match the 3524 Rnoos Dutch log carriers?).
I expect they were pretty flogged by the end.
Pat

 

[littledude]

The timber wagons are the heavily modified Rover Hi-Cubes. Why they weren't recoded and renumbered (as per TSI) I have no idea, but 3623 Rfnoos was created in 2008 (to match the 3524 Rnoos Dutch log carriers?).
I expect they were pretty flogged by the end.
Pat

That’s not quite true, the wagons that have gone for scrap are the GERS 97xxx KFAs, which are former Cargowaggon vans from years gone by. The former Rover Cubes retained their 70 4739 xxx numbers.

The Dutch (blue) log carriers are 84 3523s, themselves being conversions of former German 80 4741 vans.

Tom

 

[Intercity_225]

Realtime Trains | 6E94 1533 March Up Yard Gbrf to Doncaster Down Decoy Gbrf | 01/04/2026

Real-time train running information for 6E94 1533 departure from March Up Yard Gbrf to Doncaster Down Decoy Gbrf on 01/04/2026. From Realtime Trains, an independent source of train running info for Great Britain.

www.realtimetrains.co.uk

Could this move be taking the leftover IIA sand wagons from the Middleton Towers - Goole Glassworks service (which finished in December) and 99 test runs into storage? Never seen a path like it before.

 

[Adrian Barr]

Could this move be taking the leftover IIA sand wagons from the Middleton Towers - Goole Glassworks service (which finished in December) and 99 test runs into storage? Never seen a path like it before.

It could well be... there's a 6Z26 schedule for 07:26 Thursday morning from Doncaster Down Decoy to Goole Glassworks, so they could be taking the wagons for storage there.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:R39347/2026-04-02/detailed

Oddly, there's also a path for an 0Z24 10:08 Doncaster Down Decoy - Goole Glassworks on the same day - possibly the origin and destination should be the other way round?

 

[yorkshirerail]

It could well be... there's a 6Z26 schedule for 07:26 Thursday morning from Doncaster Down Decoy to Goole Glassworks, so they could be taking the wagons for storage there.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:R39347/2026-04-02/detailed

Oddly, there's also a path for an 0Z24 10:08 Doncaster Down Decoy - Goole Glassworks on the same day - possibly the origin and destination should be the other way round?

Deleted

 

[Intercity_225]

It could well be... there's a 6Z26 schedule for 07:26 Thursday morning from Doncaster Down Decoy to Goole Glassworks, so they could be taking the wagons for storage there.

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:R39347/2026-04-02/detailed

Oddly, there's also a path for an 0Z24 10:08 Doncaster Down Decoy - Goole Glassworks on the same day - possibly the origin and destination should be the other way round?

Or, could the path be for the ex-coal hoppers sat in there. I don't know wagon types well, but they are black and have 'Touax' on the side. I don't know when they came here and don't know why they're here.

 

[Adrian Barr]

There are some IKAs and IWAs at March used as brake force / adaptor wagons on the LUL stock moves to/from Goole. It could be related to that (previous schedules have been set up to the glassworks for these moves), although I can't see any planned movements leaving Goole.

 

[Intercity_225]

There are some IKAs and IWAs at March used as brake force / adaptor wagons on the LUL stock moves to/from Goole. It could be related to that (previous schedules have been set up to the glassworks for these moves), although I can't see any planned movements leaving Goole.

Guess we'll have to find out which it is tomorrow!

 

[Geeves]

I'm not a wagon expert but I believe these might be MEA wagons?

A large selection are currently being scrapped at EMR Liverpool.

I can't remember the last time I saw a train of wagons of this type but presumably that traffic is not coming back sadly.

 

[littledude]

I'm not a wagon expert but I believe these might be MEA wagons?

A large selection are currently being scrapped at EMR Liverpool.

I can't remember the last time I saw a train of wagons of this type but presumably that traffic is not coming back sadly.

Looks like an SSA scrap (pardon the pun) wagon to me

 

[Adrian Barr]

I'm not a wagon expert but I believe these might be MEA wagons?

Yes, SSA wagon as per above post. Interesting to see some of them made it to EMR Liverpool for scrapping (presumably by road).

The last flow they were used on was a weekly train of scrap metal from Trostre to Margam for Port Talbot steelworks. This flow ceased around the time the blast furnaces shut down, since the scrap was used in the associated BOS plant which closed at the same time. 470043 seen here on that flow in 2021: https://www.flickr.com/photos/nat37670/51143400057/ (Photo: Kernow Ned)

They are fairly old wagons, dating back to the early 1980s with many of them built on second-hand underframes. They were originally private owner wagons, as seen here with RLS5016 looking quite different as a POA wagon in 1987: https://www.flickr.com/photos/36034969@N08/52414422892/ (Photo: Adrian Nicholls)

They were purchased by British Rail in 1990, recoded SSA and renumbered, as this LTSV profile explains: https://www.ltsv.com/w_profile_008.php
Some received new bodies in 1996 which changed their appearance.

They were concentrated on scrap traffic to Aldwarke during the EWS era, although they were also used on some other scrap flows like St Blazey to Cardiff EMR. Later they ended up on a variety of flows such as spoil from Angerstein to Roxby Gullet, or Ground Granulated Blast Furnace Slag (GGBS) from Redcar to Scunthorpe. The last time I saw a rake of them in use was when they covered for unavailable MBA wagons on the Barking - Immingham scrap flow a few years ago.

Some of the wagons from Margam were sent to Kingsbury for scrap, so I'm not sure where the ones at EMR have come from - possibly some that were lurking in sidings and unfit for rail movement.

 

[fgwrich]

Quick Wagon related question, do we know who bought the former TFL / Metronet FEA-B’s that were up for Auction earlier this year (640931 and 640939-943). I believe all that were sold have now left Eastleigh Works.

Thanks!

Answering my own question, it seems a number are still spread across Eastleigh works and have recently received modifications including new cylinders etc. I’m still unclear as to who has bought them though.

 

[Rhysdabeast]

Yes, SSA wagon as per above post. Interesting to see some of them made it to EMR Liverpool for scrapping (presumably by road).

The last flow they were used on was a weekly train of scrap metal from Trostre to Margam for Port Talbot steelworks. This flow ceased around the time the blast furnaces shut down, since the scrap was used in the associated BOS plant which closed at the same time. 470043 seen here on that flow in 2021: https://www.flickr.com/photos/nat37670/51143400057/ (Photo: Kernow Ned)

They are fairly old wagons, dating back to the early 1980s with many of them built on second-hand underframes. They were originally private owner wagons, as seen here with RLS5016 looking quite different as a POA wagon in 1987: https://www.flickr.com/photos/36034969@N08/52414422892/ (Photo: Adrian Nicholls)

They were purchased by British Rail in 1990, recoded SSA and renumbered, as this LTSV profile explains: https://www.ltsv.com/w_profile_008.php
Some received new bodies in 1996 which changed their appearance.

They were concentrated on scrap traffic to Aldwarke during the EWS era, although they were also used on some other scrap flows like St Blazey to Cardiff EMR. Later they ended up on a variety of flows such as spoil from Angerstein to Roxby Gullet, or Ground Granulated Blast Furnace Slag (GGBS) from Redcar to Scunthorpe. The last time I saw a rake of them in use was when they covered for unavailable MBA wagons on the Barking - Immingham scrap flow a few years ago.

Some of the wagons from Margam were sent to Kingsbury for scrap, so I'm not sure where the ones at EMR have come from - possibly some that were lurking in sidings and unfit for rail movement.

I believe EMR Liverpool took all of the stuff that had been lingering in Basford Hall and also some stuff which was tripped round from the PAD last year. 470051 and 470169 were the 2 SSA's.

Both seen here in Basford Hall Yard 29th April 2025:


Another angle showing some of the MHA's in the same line as well:

 

[Rhysdabeast]

Today the stored wagons that were in Fiddlers Ferry were moved in 2 trips to Crewe Gresty Green. These wagons were a mix of HOA's, HHA's and IIA's. I managed to view them all by getting on the train from Crewe to Nantwich and return. Also I noted there seemed to be some flats (FSA's?), some with green boxes on, like the ones seen in this photo, would anyone know the number of these, not sure they will be showing on TOPS unless someone has kindly updated the locations!

Thanks

 

[Adrian Barr]

I believe EMR Liverpool took all of the stuff that had been lingering in Basford Hall and also some stuff which was tripped round from the PAD last year. 470051 and 470169 were the 2 SSA's.

With them being marshalled together like that in Basford Hall, I wonder if the coalfish and the two SSAs moved to Liverpool EMR together by rail?

A July 2022 list of wagons had MFA 391396, MHAs 394016, 394016, 394158, 394251, 394331, 394512, 394657, 394866, 394897, 394937, 394951, 396076, 396109, 396142 and MTAs 395180 / 395211 shown at Crewe on TOPS, at either Basford Hall, Gresty Road or Gresty Lane (along with the two SSAs 470051 / 470169 and an SPA 460610). All appeared to be stored or defective.

The only one of those which remains in existence on TOPS is 396109, which worked into Basford Hall on 7th July 2019 on a 6Y53 engineers train from Northwich and never left Crewe. TOPS shows it moved to Gresty Lane on 09/10 (likely 2019) and back to Basford Hall on 30/09 (likely 2025). I'm not sure if the wagon is still physically at Crewe but TOPS thinks it is...

A wagon history for 470051 (done before it was deleted from TOPS) shows that it had been in use conveying scrap rail to Aldwarke. The exact year is unknown but it was on a 6E35 Basford Hall - Aldwarke on 09/06 conveying scrap rail from Gresty Road, empty from Aldwarke to Whitemoor on 11/06 on a 6L16, loaded with scrap rail back to Aldwarke on 18/06 on 6E14, then empty back to Crewe on 6M46 on 20/06. It appears to have been reloaded with scrap rail at Gresty Road, but never travelled due to a defect and ended up being stored at Crewe.

Some interesting photos of these trains of scrap rail to Aldwarke, which were running circa 2014/2015:

Freightliner 70003 hauls one MBA and 8 SSAs from Aldwarke to Crewe on 20/06/14:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/60963146@N04/14536781091/ (Photo: clagmaster)

Colas 70809 hauls a mixed rake of SSAs and MBAs past Toton with 6M46 Aldwarke - Crewe empties on 23/05/14
https://www.flickr.com/photos/colin_outandabout/14274192193/ (Photo: pokeyphoto)

DRS 66413 on an Aldwarke - Whitemoor working with SSAs and MBAs on 05/06/15
https://www.flickr.com/photos/kierencross/18502551321/ (Photo: Kieren Cross)

And this shot is rather intriguing, showing those green Freightliner low-height 30ft containers in use on this traffic:

Freightliner 66512 with 6M46 Aldwarke - Crewe, hauling what appears to be 6 FEAs, 1 SSA and 7 MBAs on 03/09/14
https://www.flickr.com/photos/dave1963/24014271613/ (Photo: Dave Wragg)

I noted there seemed to be some flats (FSA's?), some with green boxes on, like the ones seen in this photo, would anyone know the number of these

Finding these was a bit of a challenge since they were transferred on TOPS from Gresty Green to Basford Hall on Wednesday evening, where they were hard to find amongst the other FSAs there.

Six FSAs stand out as the ones you are looking for - 608045, 608046, 608389, 608390, 608463 and 608474.

The first two (045/046) are from the pool used on Hartlepool concrete segment traffic. Their last workings on this circuit last year were 4M52 Hartlepool - Grain 04/12, 4E52 Grain - Hartlepool 05/12, 4M52 Hartlepool - Willesden 05/12, and 4E54 Willesden - Hunslet Sidings 06/12. They are then shown moving empty (with the cassettes used for loading the concrete segments presumably removed at some point) on 27th January this year on a 6D66 from Hunslet to Doncaster Railport. After loading with the green containers they formed a 6M70 from Doncaster Railport to Crewe Gresty Green on the same day. This is pictured passing Woodburn Junction - the train later called in at Earles to pick up 608389 / 608390 (see below).
https://www.flickr.com/photos/49068127@N06/55064516850/ (Photo: Gavin B)

The photo linked at the end of post #93 shows some of those green containers loaded to an IKA in a siding near Doncaster Railport during accident recovery work in 2022 - possibly they were still there after that use.

The other 4 FSAs (389 / 390 / 463 / 474) are in a pool by themselves which appears to be for wagons waiting maintenance or in restricted use. 608463 / 608474 working as a pair appear to have been out of use on regular Freightliner traffic since July 2023, when they were moved empty on 24/07 on a 4V54 Southampton Maritime - Bristol Freightliner terminal for storage. A YouTube video titled "Bristol Freightliner Railport; 70016 collects stored container flats" shows 70016 collecting a short rake of Freightliner flats for movement to Basford Hall as a 4M20 on 13/10/23. 608463 / 608474 were included in this move, and reached Guide Bridge on 09/11/23 on a 4H67 wagon trip for maintenance. On 16/11/23 they moved back to Basford Hall on a 6K68 trip, and the wagons are shown on TOPS acquiring their containers while at Crewe (although it might have been done at Guide Bridge and updated later) with no other movements recorded apart from being tripped to Gresty Green and back.

608389 (working in a pair with 608390) appears to have been out of use on regular Freightliner workings since July 2024. It moved from Basford Hall to Guide Bridge on the 6H67 wagon trip on 11/07/24, then returned to Basford Hall on 4K66 on 23/07/24, moving onward to Hunslet on the 6E53 wagon trip the following day. TOPS shows this wagon acquiring the containers at Leeds Midland Road. On November 25th (either 2024 or 2025) it worked from Hunslet to Doncaster Railport and back as 6G01 / 6G02. At some point it was moved to Earles Sidings (possibly detached en route from one of the regular Hunslet to Tunstead wagon moves) and from there it was attached to the 27th January 6M70 movement to Crewe Gresty Green which had originated from Doncaster Railport with 66415 hauling 608045 / 608046 (mentioned above). The extra two wagons in the consist can be seen as 6M70 passes Hale in the gloom:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/142410950@N03/55064093922/ (Photo: Colin Peter Hobson)

I'm not sure about the current intended use of these low-height containers - I remember them originally being used on ballast / spoil traffic loaded to FEAs, where each container was roughly equivalent to a coalfish in terms of capacity. I think this might have been around the time of the West Coast Route modernisation, when Forders Sidings were in use as part of the project - I guess these containers were a quick way of providing extra capacity for ballast / spoil traffic without building more wagons.

 

[Rhysdabeast]

With them being marshalled together like that in Basford Hall, I wonder if the coalfish and the two SSAs moved to Liverpool EMR together by rail?

A July 2022 list of wagons had MFA 391396, MHAs 394016, 394016, 394158, 394251, 394331, 394512, 394657, 394866, 394897, 394937, 394951, 396076, 396109, 396142 and MTAs 395180 / 395211 shown at Crewe on TOPS, at either Basford Hall, Gresty Road or Gresty Lane (along with the two SSAs 470051 / 470169 and an SPA 460610). All appeared to be stored or defective.

The only one of those which remains in existence on TOPS is 396109, which worked into Basford Hall on 7th July 2019 on a 6Y53 engineers train from Northwich and never left Crewe. TOPS shows it moved to Gresty Lane on 09/10 (likely 2019) and back to Basford Hall on 30/09 (likely 2025). I'm not sure if the wagon is still physically at Crewe but TOPS thinks it is...

A wagon history for 470051 (done before it was deleted from TOPS) shows that it had been in use conveying scrap rail to Aldwarke. The exact year is unknown but it was on a 6E35 Basford Hall - Aldwarke on 09/06 conveying scrap rail from Gresty Road, empty from Aldwarke to Whitemoor on 11/06 on a 6L16, loaded with scrap rail back to Aldwarke on 18/06 on 6E14, then empty back to Crewe on 6M46 on 20/06. It appears to have been reloaded with scrap rail at Gresty Road, but never travelled due to a defect and ended up being stored at Crewe.

Some interesting photos of these trains of scrap rail to Aldwarke, which were running circa 2014/2015:

Freightliner 70003 hauls one MBA and 8 SSAs from Aldwarke to Crewe on 20/06/14:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/60963146@N04/14536781091/ (Photo: clagmaster)

Colas 70809 hauls a mixed rake of SSAs and MBAs past Toton with 6M46 Aldwarke - Crewe empties on 23/05/14
https://www.flickr.com/photos/colin_outandabout/14274192193/ (Photo: pokeyphoto)

DRS 66413 on an Aldwarke - Whitemoor working with SSAs and MBAs on 05/06/15
https://www.flickr.com/photos/kierencross/18502551321/ (Photo: Kieren Cross)

And this shot is rather intriguing, showing those green Freightliner low-height 30ft containers in use on this traffic:

Freightliner 66512 with 6M46 Aldwarke - Crewe, hauling what appears to be 6 FEAs, 1 SSA and 7 MBAs on 03/09/14
https://www.flickr.com/photos/dave1963/24014271613/ (Photo: Dave Wragg)



Finding these was a bit of a challenge since they were transferred on TOPS from Gresty Green to Basford Hall on Wednesday evening, where they were hard to find amongst the other FSAs there.

Six FSAs stand out as the ones you are looking for - 608045, 608046, 608389, 608390, 608463 and 608474.

The first two (045/046) are from the pool used on Hartlepool concrete segment traffic. Their last workings on this circuit last year were 4M52 Hartlepool - Grain 04/12, 4E52 Grain - Hartlepool 05/12, 4M52 Hartlepool - Willesden 05/12, and 4E54 Willesden - Hunslet Sidings 06/12. They are then shown moving empty (with the cassettes used for loading the concrete segments presumably removed at some point) on 27th January this year on a 6D66 from Hunslet to Doncaster Railport. After loading with the green containers they formed a 6M70 from Doncaster Railport to Crewe Gresty Green on the same day. This is pictured passing Woodburn Junction - the train later called in at Earles to pick up 608389 / 608390 (see below).
https://www.flickr.com/photos/49068127@N06/55064516850/ (Photo: Gavin B)

The photo linked at the end of post #93 shows some of those green containers loaded to an IKA in a siding near Doncaster Railport during accident recovery work in 2022 - possibly they were still there after that use.

The other 4 FSAs (389 / 390 / 463 / 474) are in a pool by themselves which appears to be for wagons waiting maintenance or in restricted use. 608463 / 608474 working as a pair appear to have been out of use on regular Freightliner traffic since July 2023, when they were moved empty on 24/07 on a 4V54 Southampton Maritime - Bristol Freightliner terminal for storage. A YouTube video titled "Bristol Freightliner Railport; 70016 collects stored container flats" shows 70016 collecting a short rake of Freightliner flats for movement to Basford Hall as a 4M20 on 13/10/23. 608463 / 608474 were included in this move, and reached Guide Bridge on 09/11/23 on a 4H67 wagon trip for maintenance. On 16/11/23 they moved back to Basford Hall on a 6K68 trip, and the wagons are shown on TOPS acquiring their containers while at Crewe (although it might have been done at Guide Bridge and updated later) with no other movements recorded apart from being tripped to Gresty Green and back.

608389 (working in a pair with 608390) appears to have been out of use on regular Freightliner workings since July 2024. It moved from Basford Hall to Guide Bridge on the 6H67 wagon trip on 11/07/24, then returned to Basford Hall on 4K66 on 23/07/24, moving onward to Hunslet on the 6E53 wagon trip the following day. TOPS shows this wagon acquiring the containers at Leeds Midland Road. On November 25th (either 2024 or 2025) it worked from Hunslet to Doncaster Railport and back as 6G01 / 6G02. At some point it was moved to Earles Sidings (possibly detached en route from one of the regular Hunslet to Tunstead wagon moves) and from there it was attached to the 27th January 6M70 movement to Crewe Gresty Green which had originated from Doncaster Railport with 66415 hauling 608045 / 608046 (mentioned above). The extra two wagons in the consist can be seen as 6M70 passes Hale in the gloom:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/142410950@N03/55064093922/ (Photo: Colin Peter Hobson)

I'm not sure about the current intended use of these low-height containers - I remember them originally being used on ballast / spoil traffic loaded to FEAs, where each container was roughly equivalent to a coalfish in terms of capacity. I think this might have been around the time of the West Coast Route modernisation, when Forders Sidings were in use as part of the project - I guess these containers were a quick way of providing extra capacity for ballast / spoil traffic without building more wagons.

Hi Adrian,

Thanks for the detailed post. AFAIK the wagons were all moved by road. From a list I saw a few months ago they were all tagged "DNL" on TOPS, they had to be moved to the MHD to be roaded out. Apparently 369109 derailed during that move so didn't end up going. I can confirm as of yesterday it is still there in a rake of MXA lobsters.

Thanks for the info RE the 608's, saw them yesterday in Basford Hall with the boxes attached still. Certainly an interesting read on the moves they have undergone within the last few years and what the intent of the boxes is for, once again thanks for the detailed write up.

 

[Intercity_225]

Does anyone know what's happening with the leftover IIA wagons following the Middleton Towers - Goole Glassworks service ending? Right now they're dumped in March Up Yard.

 

[Freightmaster]

Does anyone know what's happening with the leftover IIA wagons following the Middleton Towers - Goole Glassworks service ending? Right now they're dumped in March Up Yard.

I think GBRf have been using them for class 99 testing.



MARK