ENCTS and paper receipts

[kijeta]

I was wondering if anyone knows of any areas (and/or operators) that still issue paper receipts for ENCTS cards?

I miss collecting them (from when I had a <18yo free travel card in the area I used to live in, that would print paper receipts) and I would gladly go to another side of England just to be able to do so again.

Is it often possible to ask the driver to print it? I've tried a couple times to no success.

Thanks!

 

[Acathater]

if by receipts you mean tickets, then Stagecoach in Cumbria and North Lancs do, as also do Preston Bus and Blackpool bus. Probably others in Lancashire as well
It's a council-defined thing, not a company one

 

[kijeta]

if by receipts you mean tickets, then Stagecoach in Cumbria and North Lancs do, as also do Preston Bus and Blackpool bus. Probably others in Lancashire as well
It's a council-defined thing, not a company one

Thank you! Is there any way to check which councils offer tickets? Or is it just a case of waiting for other ENCTS users to report their experience.

 

[ChrisC]

if by receipts you mean tickets, then Stagecoach in Cumbria and North Lancs do, as also do Preston Bus and Blackpool bus. Probably others in Lancashire as well
It's a council-defined thing, not a company one

Stagecoach East Midlands do but I’m not sure if this is a council defined thing. As far as I know no other bus companies operating in the same area do. It‘s quite confusing in some parts Derbyshire where both Stagecoach East Midlands and Stagecoach Yorkshire run buses in the same area. I travelled on two Stagecoach buses in Derbyshire yesterday where I was expected to collect a ticket on one bus but not on the other.

 

[Dwarfer1979]

Thank you! Is there any way to check which councils offer tickets? Or is it just a case of waiting for other ENCTS users to report their experience.

It may be the council requiring or the operator doing it but no county we serve (over 20 currently and at least another dozen we don't anymore but have recently enough to judge), nor one I have traveled in recently has such a requirement (or ever did, even when we did issue tickets when free travel was first introduced it was a company instruction to attempt to make sure travel was properly recorded when it may have been able to influence reimbursement but we stopped that probably 15 years ago) so Lancashire may be a one-off - basically no one in the East or North Midlands or Home Counties has such a requirement and I can't think of an operator I have seen issue one in years (but I haven't been up to Lancashire for a while).

 

[KHCT]

Stagecoach East Midlands do issue paper tickets when an ENCTS pass is used, but East Yorkshire do not. Both operate in the same council areas so I'd suggest it isnt due to the council. I always thought it odd given that other Stagecoach divisions don't do this and it seems like a waste.

 

[PeterC]

Stagecoach East Midlands do issue paper tickets when an ENCTS pass is used, but East Yorkshire do not. Both operate in the same council areas so I'd suggest it isnt due to the council. I always thought it odd given that other Stagecoach divisions don't do this and it seems like a waste.

I can recall being on buses where the machine seemed to churn out a ticket when you tapped on but tge driver retained it. Maybe the wrong sort of ticket machine or paranoid management. In other fields I have known local managers insist on staff hanging on to obsolete procedures.

 

[ACBest]

Stagecoach East Midlands did a trial a few years back of not printing a ticket when presenting an ENCTS pass, and if memory serves correctly, they stated that the outcome of that trial was a huge reduction in the number of recorded journeys, so they went back to printing tickets to confirm that the card had been accepted.

 

[Wawanesa]

There doesn't seem to be any logic in whether operators issue tickets or not. First Essex Buses do issue tickets but First Eastern Counties (under the same management) don't. It can't be a council decisicion because neither Arriva in Colchester nor Hedingham & Chambers issue tickets.

 

[323235]

Stagecoach East Midlands did a trial a few years back of not printing a ticket when presenting an ENCTS pass, and if memory serves correctly, they stated that the outcome of that trial was a huge reduction in the number of recorded journeys, so they went back to printing tickets to confirm that the card had been accepted.

Why would there be a reduction in recorded journeys? If passengers are presenting their passes and the ticket machine is correctly accepting it.

 

[Dwarfer1979]

Why would there be a reduction in recorded journeys? If passengers are presenting their passes and the ticket machine is correctly accepting it.

Presumably the issue is that the driver & passenger think that the card has been recorded but it hasn't actually scanned. Possibly it is a particular issue at Stagecoach as the VIX machines they use are less obvious to the passenger at least about acceptance, Ticketers seems to have quite a loud beep and light string whilst VIXs flash green around the card reader in a manner which may be less obvious. I'm not sure about the latest generation currently used by Stagecoach but I know the previous generation of VIX machines were quite temperamental around card presentation (it didn't like when the card was slid on and preferred a clear placement) which could be an issue for pensioners in particular whilst other machines can be less prone though it can still be an issue for some.

I hadn't noticed Stagecoach machines doing that so widely but it would appear more widespread than I thought if largely an operator choice than council instruction.

 

[65477]

When did ENTCS reimbursement change from the actual journey to a flat rate and did this affect the issue of ticket issuing? I can recall reading of comments in the early days about people being issued with tickets valid beyond their stated destination.

 

[dgl]

First Wessex used to issue them when we still had the Wayfarer machines that couldn't traffic the card, can't remember if the replacement Almex machines did and the current Ticketer machines don't.

 

[Cesarcollie]

When did ENTCS reimbursement change from the actual journey to a flat rate and did this affect the issue of ticket issuing? I can recall reading of comments in the early days about people being issued with tickets valid beyond their stated destination.

it isn’t really a flat rate. That might be the outcome, but it’s based on a blend of adult passengers journey lengths/fares.

 

[CN12 AWU]

Believe Stagecoach South Wales do or atleast they used to print tickets with passes

 

[Dwarfer1979]

When did ENTCS reimbursement change from the actual journey to a flat rate and did this affect the issue of ticket issuing? I can recall reading of comments in the early days about people being issued with tickets valid beyond their stated destination.

It depends where you are as many places were using a reimbursement based on an average adult fare from the start (& some actually had a negotiated fixed rate or share of a fixed pot of funds based on proportion of total ENCTS passengers carried) so often the actual trip made had no affect on the payment received by the operator.

In many cases, even where the reimbursement was based on this calculated rate based on average adult fare a company may have still recorded the trips and issued tickets in order to understand where their passengers were travelling in the hope that they would be able to negotiate an enhanced rate due to passengers making longer than average journeys but I don't think that was ever successful so many stopped wasting the paper of printing tickets for no benefit.

 

[Acathater]

Just to add confusion.... Caught a Lonsdale 85 today which shares part of Stagecoach 5 route between Morecambe and Carnforth.....
No ticket. To quote the driver "we don't like rubbish"
So same route, one does one doesn't

 

[Hyebone]

Just to add confusion.... Caught a Lonsdale 85 today which shares part of Stagecoach 5 route between Morecambe and Carnforth.....
No ticket. To quote the driver "we don't like rubbish"
So same route, one does one doesn't

The same happens with route 77 between Chesterfield and Worksop. It's jointly run by Yorkshire and East Midlands divisions. East Midlands ticket machines print an ENCTS receipt, but Yorkshire's do not.

You regularly get passengers on Yorkshire 77s holding their hand in front of the machine expecting a ticket that simply isn't printing!

 

[Simon75]

Traveled on First Essex X10 no ticket issued with my disabled pass

 

[Acathater]

if by receipts you mean tickets, then Stagecoach in Cumbria and North Lancs do, as also do Preston Bus and Blackpool bus. Probably others in Lancashire as well
It's a council-defined thing, not a company one

Just to confuse things it looks like Preston no longer print tickets for ENCTS passes

 

[Wawanesa]

Traveled on First Essex X10 no ticket issued with my disabled pass

First Essex have stopped issuing tickets for ENCTS passes within the last month which brings them in to line with other operators in the county.