Leaving Early

[district]

Surley any conductor worth his salt wont allow his train to leave early? Today yet again me and JohnB missed a train as it left 3 1/2 minutes early, when the guard could see people attempting to board.

We confronted him at the next station where he denied knowing of any reason to leave early. He didn't apologise either.

SET were very good though when we rang up


Anyone else caught trains leaving early?

 

[bradders1983]

How did you confront him at the next station when you missed the train??? Did you catch up with it by road?

 

[313103]

Today yet again me and JohnB missed a train as it left 3 1/2 minutes early.

We confronted him at the next station where he denied knowing of any reason to leave early.

How very interesting. You missed a train because the train left early, yet confronted the Conductor at the next station!. Now i have been accused of lots of things on here, stupidity isnt one of them. Now unless you was either Superman or Harry Potter there is no way you could have missed the same train that you confronted the Conductor on. May i suggest that you look through your statement again and see where you went wrong!

Oh and by the way if you did ccontact South Eastern Trains and you was happy with what they said, why do you also need to feel to put your complaint on here. Why did you not also contact your MP and London Travel Watch or indeed National Rail complaints Group (not Sure of the right name).

I see this as yet another lets bash the staff again, we havent had one in a while............ but wait yes we have though its about Drivers on Trans Pennine Express.

 

[district]

Firstly since I want to join the industry I am totally against staff bashing in anyway. The train terminated at the next station and formed another service. I put this on here for a general discussion.

Let me re-iterate: I am NOT a staff basher and are PRO staff since I want to join myself, it was the guards attitude.

 

[JohnB_]

The train was the CHX service to HGS. The train left early at SLQ and sits at HGS for some time before returning to CHX.

Do not always think the worst of people...

 

[ralphchadkirk]

The 0826 left SLQ 1 late.
The 0857 left 2 late.
The 1000 left on time.

Those are the only three trains so far today from CGX to HGS at SLQ.

 

[district]

SET confirmed they were aware of our train leaving 3.5mins early.

 

[313103]

The train was the CHX service to HGS. The train left early at SLQ and sits at HGS for some time before returning to CHX.

Do not always think the worst of people...

Can you explain to me in English the coded messages. So you complained and got a response from South Eastern Trains, once again why do you feel the need to rport this on a internet forum when you know exactly what answer your going to get. For a start you know as well as i do that whn you ask the question 'Has this happened to anyone else?' the answer is going to be yes plan and simple. There have been times when as a Guard worth his salt has left a station early for lots of things like being told to by Control, being told to by police, the passenger timetable being different from the working timetable, my watch being wrong, my watch showing a different time to that at a station, by me making a mistake all thses and probably more have happened to me alone and i am sure that the Conductor will be reprimanded and have letters placed on file. I trust that should you or your friend get a job on the railway that you dont make a mistake because the same outcome will come to you both whether its your fault or not.

 

[district]

The 0826 left SLQ 1 late.
The 0857 left 2 late.
The 1000 left on time.

Those are the only three trains so far today from CGX to HGS at SLQ.

The train was the 0928 HGS service, not sure if it was a CHX or a Cannon. It left at 0925 and 30 seconds. The next train was the 0932 Southern to Ashford Intl, which calls at Hastings next. We took this and then spoke to the guard.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Can you explain to me in English the coded messages. So you complained and got a response from South Eastern Trains, once again why do you feel the need to rport this on a internet forum when you know exactly what answer your going to get. For a start you know as well as i do that whn you ask the question 'Has this happened to anyone else?' the answer is going to be yes plan and simple. There have been times when as a Guard worth his salt has left a station early for lots of things like being told to by Control, being told to by police, the passenger timetable being different from the working timetable, my watch being wrong, my watch showing a different time to that at a station, by me making a mistake all thses and probably more have happened to me alone and i am sure that the Conductor will be reprimanded and have letters placed on file. I trust that should you or your friend get a job on the railway that you dont make a mistake because the same outcome will come to you both whether its your fault or not.

I just wanted to instigate a discussion, I didnt want to staff-bash. I wouldn't have bothered but his attitude was that he didnt know of any reason why he had to leave early.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

So now you've named the service! You're not helping yourself here.

 

[district]

I'm really not sure why I bother...

 

[ralphchadkirk]

I'm really not sure why I bother...

Nor are we. You've already complained to SET. Why post it on here? Then, why post the train details? I was checking the service details you gave and not one left early. Then, suddenly, those are wrong and it was another train. Then you decide to post the actual times.

(By the way, if it left at 0925 and 30 seconds and was scheduled to leave at 0928 then it left 2 1/2 minutes early. Not 3 1/2. Odd that there are so many errors, no?)

 

[district]

Nor are we. You've already complained to SET. Why post it on here? Then, why post the train details? I was checking the service details you gave and not one left early. Then, suddenly, those are wrong and it was another train. Then you decide to post the actual times.

(By the way, if it left at 0925 and 30 seconds and was scheduled to leave at 0928 then it left 2 1/2 minutes early. Not 3 1/2. Odd that there are so many errors, no?)

Why did the guy at SET confirm to me he was aware of my particular train then?

I wanted to instigate discussion, that's all.

 

[yorkie]

Why post it on here?

Quite frankly, why not?

If the answer is "because SET may find out and tell him off" then, my response to that is "So would you deny him the right to report it directly to SET?"

If that is not the answer please enlighten me.

 

[Mike395]

I have re-instated the thread after removing it for review - whilst we welcome open debate, please ensure that you're being polite to other members whilst doing so. Thanks

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Quite frankly, why not?

If the answer is "because SET may find out and tell him off" then, my response to that is "So would you deny him the right to report it directly to SET?"

If that is not the answer please enlighten me.

See the PM answer.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Why did the guy at SET confirm to me he was aware of my particular train then?

Because it left early? Something has obviously happened, and SET are dealing with it. No need to post it around.

I wanted to instigate discussion, that's all.

Discussion about what? It's happened, you've complained. What else is there to discuss? Whether other people have been delayed? Undoubtably they have.

 

[northernrail]

Nor are we. You've already complained to SET. Why post it on here?

Because District asked if anyone has missed trains for leaving early, not to have a rant or in this case a debate...

 

[rmt-driver]

Maybe the guards watch was wrong.. sometimes if I get the signal a few minutes early I just go, especially if I am finishing soon!

 

[TDK]

The train was the CHX service to HGS. The train left early at SLQ and sits at HGS for some time before returning to CHX.

Do not always think the worst of people...

But the next station is not correct is it?

 

[bb21]

I am sorry to disappoint but I really cannot see any staff-bashing in this thread. I hope you will all agree with me that as this is a job in the public eye, anything that does not keep to the standards promised and unexplained can be questioned by the travelling public.

Now the train is recorded as having left 3 early at Battle, but only 1 early at St Leonards Warrior Square. However I am also aware that some data might not be the most accurate, as they are the recorded times at the signal box when the train enters or leaves a station. The story that the OP gave is definitely plausible, especially in view of the fact that neither of the two statistics are reported by TRUST.

With regard to naming the service, I cannot see anything that the OP has mentioned which SET are not already aware. I am sure that SET will review their own data and records to determine what exactly happened. The OP has not been abusive or rude to anybody, and he has not named the service in such a way that the member of staff in question can be identified by a member of the travelling public in order that they hurl abuse at him.

I trust that you will agree with me that unfortunately performance at jobs in the public service sector will be scrutinised by the public by the very nature of them. There is nothing wrong with questioning what might have happened and sharing experience, as long as it is done in a reasonable way.

 

[ralphchadkirk]

The OP has not been abusive or rude to anybody,

By the OP's admission, he confronted the guard which suggests an element of aggression (confront: Meet (someone) face to face with hostile or argumentative intent). Perhaps it was a poor choice of words, but to me, that does not sound like an acceptable way to go about making a complaint.

 

[northernrail]

By the OP's admission, he confronted the guard which suggests an element of aggression (confront: Meet (someone) face to face with hostile or argumentative intent). Perhaps it was a poor choice of words, but to me, that does not sound like an acceptable way to go about making a complaint.

Sorry but does your signature not count for anyone else?

 

[ralphchadkirk]

Sorry but does your signature not count for anyone else?

It clarifies my point. I doubt the OP walked up to the conductor and said "In the following conversation, I may come across as confrontational but that is not my intention" then that's fine.

 

[bb21]

By the OP's admission, he confronted the guard which suggests an element of aggression (confront: Meet (someone) face to face with hostile or argumentative intent). Perhaps it was a poor choice of words, but to me, that does not sound like an acceptable way to go about making a complaint.

If there is aggression involved and possibly something physical then I agree that it would have been inappropriate. However we don't know exactly what was actually said and done at that moment in time or whether he just asked the guard why he left early so I can't really say anything about it.

The point I was trying to make is that there is no evidence of staff-bashing in this thread. The OP didn't make general sweeping statements and didn't do anything that could cause additional harm or abuse towards the member of staff in question. His timing could be out by a minute or two, however I would think that SET would double-check his claim with what they have and draw the correct conclusion from it, or they will be able to provide an explanation for why the train left early.

 

[sonic2009]

Looking at LDB this service the 0747 London Cannon Street - Hastings service left SLQ only 1 early, but left battle 3 early, i do believe that guards sometimes have a different working timetable to the public timetable, I've had this once.before where.a FGW service left GMV 10mins early, towards Hereford, i put a complaint in also spoke to the guard who i knew and he showed me.that his timetable was different to the public timetable, i think there was engineering works on.at the time.

 

[hairyhandedfool]

It's not uncommon for trains to leave stations early by my watch, but then I guess there is a point there, who's clock did the guard use? was it correct? did the confronted guard agree simply so you would go away and he could get on with his job?

I've missed a few trains because my local station has no clock and my watch obviously didn't agree with the guard's (usually on a Sunday too!).

It could be said that if the trains were timetabled properly this would be very rare, but I don't think it will be completely eradicated and people will still complain the train left early when they miss them.

 

[bb21]

It could be said that if the trains were timetabled properly this would be very rare, but I don't think it will be completely eradicated and people will still complain the train left early when they miss them.

Indeed. That's why the TOC in question should double-check when such a complaint is received to ensure that they reach the correct conclusion.

 

[dooton]

Why are you all being so flippin rude to the chap? You must all understand how annoying it must be to turn up and find your train leaving - even if its 2 &1/2 mins! Now as long as the OP didn't go to the conductor guns blazing then even a "i'm sorry i didn't realise I went early" would have solved the situation. But he didn't he was said to have been rude about it. All members of staff are rude at times even me. But there is no excuse for a train leaving early unless it has been specifically requested from control, which in this case it appears not.

OP bashing is just as bad as staff bashing so lets all calm down and have the friendly discussion that the OP was trying to have.

Sorry didn't see the sensible discussion on the second page!

 

[northernrail]

Anyone else caught trains leaving early?

Luckily its not happened to me, my mum told me its happened to her before, but she was probably late and doesn't like to admit it

 

[Flamingo]

My record is seven minutes - an unmanned platform late at night, and I wasn't using the amended diagram - my mistake, but no-body turned up after I had left, according to control looking at the CCTV, so I dodged a bullet. My mistake, I'll freely admit it.

However, I have had people accuse me of locking the doors early (30 seconds before departure time, as advertised), and people saying "My watch says it's XXXX", well tough, my watch is set by radio control (company issue), so that's what I go by.

As regards the Guard and SWT control "agreeing", that might be just agreeing with the customer as he is always right, and followed by "Now bugger off and annoy somebody else" muttered under their breath as they walked away.

I find that Trust is pretty accurate, and if trains do leave early, it is usually swiftly followed by a phone-call from control saying "What are you playing at", followed by paperwork and (if it is a common occurrence), interviews without coffee with both line managers and competence managers (who can ruin your whole week, never mind your day).

Edited to add: In certain circumstances, trains at Reading on the up, and Newport on the down can be sent off early, as there are so many trains leaving these stations for Paddington and Cardiff Central respectively that if a platform is needed, then the train will just be told to sod off and clear the platform for the next one.