Direct Rail Services train query

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I was waiting this afternoon on Shrewsbury station on platform 4 for the 1559 ATW service to Wilmslow, when a DRS train appeared with all engines and coaches in DRS livery, heading northwards.

The train was comprised of 37409/coach 9428/coach9419/57009. It was held in the running line between platform 3 and platform 4, until my train had departed. There were staff with orange vests in both of the coaches.

Can anyone advise what this 2 coach train with an engine at either end might have been.

 

[DarloRich]

both of those are DRS Nuclear Flask Escort Vehicles

http://www.departmentals.com/photo/9419
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
taken from a fellow board memebrs flickr!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/63611615@N06/6053175843/in/photostream

 

[GearJammer]

It would'nt have been 37109, that ones preserved on the ELR in EWS livery.

 

[45104]

was 37409 and 57009 returning from plymouth to gresty road. they've been route learning the paignton branch in rediness for a new freight flow ( using goodrington to fuel engines )

 

[shedman]

Does anyone know what the interior of these coaches are like? Are they just a normal layout or like a kind or board room set up (like the NMT)

 

[fgwrich]

was 37409 and 57009 returning from plymouth to gresty road. they've been route learning the paignton branch in rediness for a new freight flow ( using goodrington to fuel engines )

Interesting - So going off topic for a moment, whats this new freight flow from Paington involving then? Surely some of the tourists arn't that bad

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

It would'nt have been 37109, that ones preserved on the ELR in EWS livery.

Sorry about that...typo error. I did mean to type 37409 (I have now amended my original posting).
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Does anyone know what the interior of these coaches are like? Are they just a normal layout or like a kind or board room set up (like the NMT)

From what I could see, in both coaches, the main body was 2 + 2 with tables, but there were sections towards the ends of both coaches that were enclosed, so there may have been other types of equipment that I could not see.

 

[shedman]

Thanks Paul, I've always wondered!

 

[eastdyke]

' ...... other types of equipment that I could not see '

I would think it highly likely that 'other types of equipment' are both carried and need to be kept out of general view.

Bearing in mind that DRS is a wholly owned subsidiary of the NDA (Nuclear Decommissioning Authority).

 

[jopsuk]

"other types of equipment" will likley include mundane stuff such as a galley, loo etc, as well as presumably a secure weapon cabinet. Unlikely to include anything more than that. As I understand, these are only needed when High Level waste is being moved?

 

[WillPS]

So these impenetrable nuclear flasks occasionally need to be escorted by gunmen!?! Wow.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

"other types of equipment" will likley include mundane stuff such as a galley, loo etc, as well as presumably a secure weapon cabinet. Unlikely to include anything more than that. As I understand, these are only needed when High Level waste is being moved?

I think that one of the two coaches had slightly more of an "enclosed" area than the other, if that is of any assistance to you.

 

[jopsuk]

So these impenetrable nuclear flasks occasionally need to be escorted by gunmen!?! Wow.

Only when carrying material that would be of use to those who wish to build a dirty bomb or worse. Escort (as far as I know) is provided by the Civil Nuclear Constabulary or Ministry of Defence Police* as appropriate.

*NB: this is not the same things as the Royal Military police. These two are similar forces to the BTP- civilian, non-territorial and with officers in all parts of the UK.

 

[northernrail]

It would'nt have been 37109, that ones preserved on the ELR in EWS livery.

Of topic a bit but is it not Blue now?

 

[Hydro]

So these impenetrable nuclear flasks occasionally need to be escorted by gunmen!?! Wow.

Gunmen?! Police officers.

There's a requirement for certain MoD workings to have an escort. MoD police usually do it. Fleet Protection Group Royal Marines have a hand in road based weapons movement, i don't known if they're involved in rail movements of waste material. Clear details are obviously quite sketchy.

I know at least one of the escort vehicles has a window in the coach end to enable forward/rear viewing. I'd lay money on the coach interior being similar to our test vehicle mess coaches. Kitchen, storage and emergency equipment. I doubt there would be a weapons cabinet, they're no good locked away. There's a documentary on SEG on the Internet somewhere and they're always open about carrying firearms, as befits the sensitive role they perform.

 

[DarloRich]

Gunmen?! Police officers.

There's a requirement for certain MoD workings to have an escort. MoD police usually do it. Fleet Protection Group Royal Marines have a hand in road based weapons movement, i don't known if they're involved in rail movements of waste material. Clear details are obviously quite sketchy.

I know at least one of the escort vehicles has a window in the coach end to enable forward/rear viewing. I'd lay money on the coach interior being similar to our test vehicle mess coaches. Kitchen, storage and emergency equipment. I doubt there would be a weapons cabinet, they're no good locked away. There's a documentary on SEG on the Internet somewhere and they're always open about carrying firearms, as befits the sensitive role they perform.

It is the Civil Nuclear Constabulary who look after the civilian nuclear products. MOD Police look after security of nuclear weapons. I understand that "Specialist" military units are involved in this work shall we say! What I am unsure of is who is responsible for guarding military grade nuclear products on the move. I don’t really know who to ask and don’t want to dig to far - All I care about is that SOMEONE does so to prevent any unpleasantness! I would follow Hydros assumption of the internal layout but might also except to find some kind of secure weapon storage (I imagine some long trips might need more than one shift and those off duty will have to secure their weapons) and/ or communication equipment

Some interesting information here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_Nuclear_Constabulary

 

[Nym]

There will be a secure place to store weapons, as it is a requirement on all MoD vehicles that all driving or operating personell (drivers, secondmen etc) have a storage rack for their weapons, as the're issued to one person. You'd be supprised as to what regements can be involved with the escourt of these meterials, you may or may not be supprised as to what kind of armoment is carried when escourting such metrieals (and thats all I'm going to say on the matter).

*Rests up his RLC Beret*

 

[DarloRich]

In the words (almost) of DCI Gene Hunt i hope the train is surrounded by armed bast*rds!

I would hope they had lots of weapons in case any "unpleasantness" developed. I would also hope the targeted any "persons causing unpleasantness" with "extreme prejudice"!

I would rather that than someone nick the material for nefarious purposes or cause a radioactive spill.

Do you know if they get complimentary food and drink served by a host? Is it a full meal service or just snacks and drinks? Is there a trolley

 

[Hydro]

There will be a secure place to store weapons, as it is a requirement on all MoD vehicles that all driving or operating personell (drivers, secondmen etc) have a storage rack for their weapons, as the're issued to one person. You'd be supprised as to what regements can be involved with the escourt of these meterials, you may or may not be supprised as to what kind of armoment is carried when escourting such metrieals (and thats all I'm going to say on the matter).

*Rests up his RLC Beret*

Racks/clips yes, not cabinets! "Frank, where's the keys?" "Have you tried behind the sofa?" "Quick, they're coming!" "OK, OK...if I were a set of keys...where would I be?"

My father was involved in this type work many years ago now. Very, very interesting but obviously not quite for public consumption to any vast degree.

 

[Xenophon PCDGS]

I wonder why both coaches 9419 and 9428 were included, if the only reason why was to return the staff back to Crewe from the Devon area where they had been, according to previous postings....or is it essential that they run as a pairing for the trial work they had been on. Obviously, I do not want to probe too deeply, should there be sensative matters involved.

 

[DarloRich]

I wonder why both coaches 9419 and 9428 were included, if the only reason why was to return the staff back to Crewe from the Devon area where they had been, according to previous postings....or is it essential that they run as a pairing for the trial work they had been on. Obviously, I do not want to probe too deeply, should there be sensative matters involved.

There was no such train and what you actually saw was swamp gas reflected of venus causing the blurring of your vison as a coal train passed you. (And i was never here!)

I think they run in semi fixed formations. 9419 has some sort of window in the sealed off corridor connection at the rear of the carriage

 

[Hydro]

DRS do use them for road learning due to the staff facilities on board IIRC.

 

[Nym]

Racks/clips yes, not cabinets! "Frank, where's the keys?" "Have you tried behind the sofa?" "Quick, they're coming!" "OK, OK...if I were a set of keys...where would I be?"

My father was involved in this type work many years ago now. Very, very interesting but obviously not quite for public consumption to any vast degree.

Well, not quite a cabinet, but stowage is provided, for their many weapons (not just firearms).
I don't know the specifics for rail but I honestly wouldn't be surprised if there where LAWs or Javelins (Not the throwey stick thing) on board...

Although LAWs are proberbly more likely as the're standard issue to the forces, and much more errr, close range than Javelins.

I used to be in the forces so have a fair bit of knowledge, but obviously can't discuss specifics. But yeah, I do remember once when a certain idiot locked my rifle onto the rack (we had locking racks for long distance stuff). And was quite well shouted at for doing so...

 

[ainsworth74]

I don't know the specifics for rail but I honestly wouldn't be surprised if there where LAWs or Javelins (Not the throwey stick thing) on board...

Are they expecting to have to fight off an assault by a Soviet tank company hock:

 

[Hydro]

MoD plod won't have LAW or Javelin. Javelin is grossly inappropriate anyway, and pretty useless for that type of work.

The old RM escorts for weapons convoys were extremely well armed, but all that traffic goes by road rather than rail. I daresay they're still well tooled up but obviously specifics aren't known.

 

[Nym]

Are they expecting to have to fight off an assault by a Soviet tank company hock:

The LAW66 is ideal for smaller vehicles like off roaders etc that would be used in ram raids and as assault vehicles...

 

[ainsworth74]

The LAW66 is ideal for smaller vehicles like off roaders etc that would be used in ram raids and as assault vehicles...

I agree as you say the LAW is a good weapon for this sort of thing (I certainly wouldn't fancy being in a Land Rover that took a LAW through the windscreen). My comment was aimed at the suggested use of Javelin which is a proper anti-tank weapon with a 8 kilo warhead and a range of 2.5k (figures from wiki so your mileage may vary) is total overkill and inappropriate for this type of threat.

 

[GearJammer]

Of topic a bit but is it not Blue now?

Yeah your right, my mistake.