Are SWR's on board announcements excessive?

[Bikeman78]

My train travel is mostly on SWR and GWR, and on both it seems to me that almost all the add-on messaging (i.e. other than the necessary stuff like route and stops) is relentlessly negative. It's all focussed on don't do this, or this is how we'll punish you if you do that, or you should report someone if they do the other. The impression it gives is that their trains are a hotbed of risks, fare evasion and crime, and while this might be the case in some locations at certain times, it isn't most passengers' daily experience. When I see ticket checks being carried out, it's very unusual to see anyone picked up for no ticket or wrong ticket. Maybe I'm just lucky in using law-abiding routes - even loud music or loud phone calls are very rare, I'm happy to say!

This was exactly the point made by Ian Walmsley in Modern Railways recently. Constant written and audible warnings everywhere.

 

[markle]

Clearly I am in the minority but I can't say it's ever bothered me on SWR.

I think the guard announcements are actually a nice touch and remind you that there is a person on the train to help - given that part of the whole argument for guards being on trains is for customer assistance / reassurance / safety, it makes sense that the guard actually advertises that they are there.

 

[talldave]

Clearly I am in the minority but I can't say it's ever bothered me on SWR.

I think the guard announcements are actually a nice touch and remind you that there is a person on the train to help - given that part of the whole argument for guards being on trains is for customer assistance / reassurance / safety, it makes sense that the guard actually advertises that they are there.

It's not a plane so all the "welcome on board" "thank you for choosing to travel with us today" (I didn't, I don't have a choice) drivel is brain numbing when you hear it day in, day out. For those of us coming from Southern territory we're used to polite "bing bong we're approaching .." announcements which are easy to ignore if you want.

 

[Foxcover]

Just been on a 197 from Wrexham Central to Bidston whose PIS was stuck at Wrexham General. Pretty much the entire journey taken up with the full station listing in Welsh, then English, every 3 minutes!

 

[markle]

It's not a plane so all the "welcome on board" "thank you for choosing to travel with us today" (I didn't, I don't have a choice) drivel is brain numbing when you hear it day in, day out. For those of us coming from Southern territory we're used to polite "bing bong we're approaching .." announcements which are easy to ignore if you want.

It may be because I've become immune to it over many, many years of travel with them, but I can't say I find it that irksome. But then I tend to not sweat the small stuff in life.

You say it's redundant to thank people for choosing SWR, but many passengers have indeed chosen SWR over, say, driving for their journey.

 

[DelW]

Two trips on SWR 444s yesterday (Sunday).

At literally every station, passengers were "welcomed" on board with two or three of:
"This is British Transport Police .... See it Say it Sorted"
"You must have a ticket ... Penalty fares ... Prosecution"
"Our staff are equipped with body worn cameras ... Offenders will be reported to BTP"

Those already on board were bombarded with this at every stop. We even had This is BTP See it, say it etc. twice between Clapham Junction and Waterloo, all of five minutes journey.

Do SWR's management realise just how hostile and unwelcoming all this sounds? It may even be counter-productive, by making it appear that crime and fare-evasion are the norm on every trip, rather than as rare as they actually are.

By comparison, two trips in 159s were mercifully silent (and the seats were comfier too). Why does each generation of trains have to be so much worse to travel in than its predecessors?

 

[talldave]

It may be because I've become immune to it over many, many years of travel with them, but I can't say I find it that irksome. But then I tend to not sweat the small stuff in life.

You say it's redundant to thank people for choosing SWR, but many passengers have indeed chosen SWR over, say, driving for their journey.

In the same way that an airline passenger on a single airline route could have gone by boat???

It's pushing the boundaries of common sense and in this faux-nationalised era, I'm sure the government doesn't thank us for clogging up the trains at all.

On SWR you can even board a coach marked "Quiet zone" in order to have your ears bombarded with useless waffle and endless threats of prosecution.

 

[ThisIsSurbiton]

Do SWR's management realise just how hostile and unwelcoming all this sounds? It may even be counter-productive, by making it appear that crime and fare-evasion are the norm on every trip, rather than as rare as they actually are.

Certainly counter-productive for an extra reason - I'll be listening to something else to avoid it and could miss anything interesting.

On SWR you can even board a coach marked "Quiet zone" in order to have your ears bombarded with useless waffle and endless threats of prosecution.

I don't think there should be any auto announcements in the quiet carriage, except perhaps one announcement about no announcements if you see what I mean, so nobody is disadvantaged. I'd still want to hear from the guard at the ends of the journey, makes everything a bit more human.

There was talk here of a reduction in announcements on the Arterio fleet, could be wishful thinking but my last trip on one was more pleasant. Let's hope it's real and rolled-out to the Desiros soon.

 

[Bikeman78]

Two trips on SWR 444s yesterday (Sunday).

At literally every station, passengers were "welcomed" on board with two or three of:
"This is British Transport Police .... See it Say it Sorted"
"You must have a ticket ... Penalty fares ... Prosecution"
"Our staff are equipped with body worn cameras ... Offenders will be reported to BTP"

Those already on board were bombarded with this at every stop. We even had This is BTP See it, say it etc. twice between Clapham Junction and Waterloo, all of five minutes journey.

Do SWR's management realise just how hostile and unwelcoming all this sounds? It may even be counter-productive, by making it appear that crime and fare-evasion are the norm on every trip, rather than as rare as they actually are.

By comparison, two trips in 159s were mercifully silent (and the seats were comfier too). Why does each generation of trains have to be so much worse to travel in than its predecessors?

I don't really have much reason to travel on SWR anymore. I will enjoy the peace.

 

[3rd rail land]

Rode on a 458 & 701 on a return journey from Clapham Junction to Wokingham on 28th February.

The only announcements were the next station is, the remaining calling points of the train and about the short platform at Longcross. There was the odd announcement from the guard but it really wasn't needed as all the station stop info was covered by the auto announcements.

No see, say it, sorted, you must have a ticket etc but with given the frequent stops on the route the announcements were pretty frequent even without these.

 

[talldave]

SWR are sadly compensating for the reduction in guard announcements. This morning we have a barrage of BTP announcements and threats about prosecution for ticket offences at EVERY stop.

Please, please SWR just stop. Let us travel in peace.

 

[Kite159]

SWR are sadly compensating for the reduction in guard announcements. This morning we have a barrage of BTP announcements and threats about prosecution for ticket offences at EVERY stop.

Please, please SWR just stop. Let us travel in peace.

Blame the DfT for that, they want SWR to come down harder on those who think that the correct payment is optional, especially on the metro services.

 

[Phil R]

Blame the DfT for that, they want SWR to come down harder on those who think that the correct payment is optional, especially on the metro services.

But it doesn't work. Many of the sorts who evade payment just scoff at these announcements. Seen that many times, on one occasion recently a group mockingly repeated the announcements into Waterloo. I next saw them neatly tailgating through the underground barriers.

 

[3rd rail land]

Blame the DfT for that, they want SWR to come down harder on those who think that the correct payment is optional, especially on the metro services.

How do automated announcements about paying the correct fare reduce the amount of fare evasion that occurs? If someone is intent on not paying the correct fare an announcement won't do anything to persuade them not to.

Have posters at stations and on trains warning about the consequences and have revenue enforcement work more metro services and stations where metro services call at but please stop the barrage of announcements about the subject.

 

[talldave]

Blame the DfT for that, they want SWR to come down harder on those who think that the correct payment is optional, especially on the metro services.

Then the DfT are idiots. Hopefully they're paid on performance and when this aural bombardment is measured at having zero impact we can sack them or promote them out of harms way onto another government disaster such as smart metering

 

[Kite159]

Probably some civil servant has decided by playing the message it reduces the chance of a chancer trying to play the "I didn't know I had to pay" card when in front of a judge.

 

[3rd rail land]

Probably some civil servant has decided by playing the message it reduces the chance of a chancer trying to play the "I didn't know I had to pay" card when in front of a judge.

Sounds like something a civil servant would say. I wish they would take just a moment to think before barking out stupid orders such as playing pointless announcements about fare evasion.

 

[Kite159]

Sounds like something a civil servant would say. I wish tehy take just a moment to think before barking out stupid orders such as playing pointless announcements about fare evasion.

Especially if said civil servant doesn't actually use the train when they have to report to the office

 

[Vexed]

Probably some civil servant has decided by playing the message it reduces the chance of a chancer trying to play the "I didn't know I had to pay" card when in front of a judge.

But it's a strict liability offence... Utterly pointless.

 

[Phil R]

Especially if said civil servant doesn't actually use the train when they have to report to the office

Oh they hate going in, apparently. Bit of a crass generalisation but I've heard on good authority there is a lot of moaning. Meanwhile try despatching a train from home unless it's 1/76th scale.

 

[talldave]

It doesn't get any better! It's as if we're scraping the barrel of things to talk about. Today's new one is a warning to stay behind the yellow line - whilst we're on the train!

 

[43096]

It doesn't get any better! It's as if we're scraping the barrel of things to talk about. Today's new one is a warning to stay behind the yellow line - whilst we're on the train!

Which could be interpreted as that you must stay train side of the yellow line when you leave the train.

 

[Recessio]

Which could be interpreted as that you must stay train side of the yellow line when you leave the train.

That's one way to increase passenger numbers

 

[brooklynbound]

It's not just the trains. I've just been on a 701 from Clapham Junction where on boarding we were welcomed with a series of threatening announcements rather than a sensible this is the XXXX to Weybridge.
In the five minutes before the train arrived there were 5 announcements including one saying it's illegal to beg at LUL stations. Nothing about today's trains. Clapham Junction isn't an LUL station and isn't even served by LUL trains!
They didn't bother to announce the train as it arrived or at all in the 5 minutes before it turned up.

 

[MikeWM]

Was on various 701s yesterday visiting some places between Reading and London, and goodness me the number of announcements was incredibly tedious. It seemed as if someone had explicitly sat down and thought 'that 'see it, say it, sorted' message isn't sufficiently irritating, so let's come up with a really long version that starts with a voice saying 'this is the British Transport Police' even though it isn't (it's an automated announcement...) and play it after every single station call. And once more just before arrival into Waterloo too, in case you haven't already heard it enough'.

'Then let's add some messages about ticketless travel after most stops, and a few other things besides.'

'Then let's have the guard make some manual messages too, when there is a short gap in other announcements'.

I was very pleased to get off the train and I left feeling very glad I'm not a regular customer on SWR. Why on earth is there this constant drive to make on the on-board environment for passengers ever more miserable?

I also heartily agree with the point above about how these announcements are always so negative and always telling you in a very authoritarian way what you must and mustn't do. I find this very unpleasant. I used to actually enjoy travelling by train but things just get more and more irritating.

 

[DelW]

Was on various 701s yesterday visiting some places between Reading and London, and goodness me the number of announcements was incredibly tedious. It seemed as if someone had explicitly sat down and thought 'that 'see it, say it, sorted' message isn't sufficiently irritating, so let's come up with a really long version that starts with a voice saying 'this is the British Transport Police' even though it isn't (it's an automated announcement...) and play it after every single station call. And once more just before arrival into Waterloo too, in case you haven't already heard it enough'.

'Then let's add some messages about ticketless travel after most stops, and a few other things besides.'

'Then let's have the guard make some manual messages too, when there is a short gap in other announcements'.

I was very pleased to get off the train and I left feeling very glad I'm not a regular customer on SWR. Why on earth is there this constant drive to make on the on-board environment for passengers ever more miserable?

I also heartily agree with the point above about how these announcements are always so negative and always telling you in a very authoritarian way what you must and mustn't do. I find this very unpleasant. I used to actually enjoy travelling by train but things just get more and more irritating.

It's an absolute pain for those of us who have no alternative but SWR. It's horrible enough on the Desiros, but maybe even worse on 701s as they stop so frequently.

Their assumption seems to be that most or all passengers are would-be fare dodgers or violent thugs, who can only be kept down by constantly threatening and berating them. It makes for a really hostile and unpleasant atmosphere, as if you're constantly being accused of criminality.

I can only assume that the managers or (un)civil servants who mandate this aural assault never travel on their trains. Do they all get chauffeur driven cars, or are they all just stone deaf?

 

[MikeWM]

It's an absolute pain for those of us who have no alternative but SWR. It's horrible enough on the Desiros, but maybe even worse on 701s as they stop so frequently.

Their assumption seems to be that most or all passengers are would-be fare dodgers or violent thugs, who can only be kept down by constantly threatening and berating them. It makes for a really hostile and unpleasant atmosphere, as if you're constantly being accused of criminality.

Indeed that was exactly the impression I came away with. As with so much else in modern life, it will make no difference whatever to those who do want to do bad things, but makes life deeply unpleasant for the rest of us.

 

[Bikeman78]

Was on various 701s yesterday visiting some places between Reading and London, and goodness me the number of announcements was incredibly tedious. It seemed as if someone had explicitly sat down and thought 'that 'see it, say it, sorted' message isn't sufficiently irritating, so let's come up with a really long version that starts with a voice saying 'this is the British Transport Police' even though it isn't (it's an automated announcement...) and play it after every single station call. And once more just before arrival into Waterloo too, in case you haven't already heard it enough'.

'Then let's add some messages about ticketless travel after most stops, and a few other things besides.'

'Then let's have the guard make some manual messages too, when there is a short gap in other announcements'.

I was very pleased to get off the train and I left feeling very glad I'm not a regular customer on SWR. Why on earth is there this constant drive to make on the on-board environment for passengers ever more miserable?

I also heartily agree with the point above about how these announcements are always so negative and always telling you in a very authoritarian way what you must and mustn't do. I find this very unpleasant. I used to actually enjoy travelling by train but things just get more and more irritating.

I think someone needs to sit down and ask two questions about every announcement. Who is it aimed at? What can they reasonably do with the information? If the answer to question two is nothing, or we don't know, then it should be binned. Reduced toilets is a good one. WTF am I supposed to do with that information? No toilets would be useful, because then I know that I need to go before I board, but reduced toilets just causes uncertainty. Similarly, the "some of the lifts at Clapham Junction are not working" message would be a lot more useful if it specified which platforms. If I'm already sitting on the train at Waterloo, it's a bit late anyway.

Anyway, unless I drag myself out on Friday then I probably won't have to travel on SWR for several years. I won't miss it.

 

[Ian Hardy]

I can only assume that the managers or (un)civil servants who mandate this aural assault never travel on their trains. Do they all get chauffeur driven cars, or are they all just stone deaf?

They probably wear those noise cancelling headphones so they aren't aware of the results of their decisions.

 

[Parallel]

I don’t really understand why the approach to onboard PIS varies so much if it is DfT interference - Northern and SWR are constantly playing with and changing their announcements but Southeastern’s and LNER’s, as far as I am aware, have remained relatively unchanged since before they were directly managed by the department. Are LNER and SE pushing back on the DfT requests?