Merseyrail 777 introduction

[Liverpool 507]

To be fair they could sort asdo tomorrow, throw a couple of 8cars on Ormskirk to Hunts Cross (which is the plan) then decide to keep the timetable as it is.
Theres no law that says it has to revert back and frankly it works better as it is.

It takes longer than it used to with over generous timetabling. Three minutes from Birkdale to Hillside, four minutes between Hightown and Hall Road, three minutes between Seaforth & Litherland and Bootle New Strand is ridiculous. There needs to be more than four 8 cars diagrams as the 1732 and 1747 off of Central to Southport are regularly full and standing.

 

[jamesst]

It takes longer than it used to with over generous timetabling. Three minutes from Birkdale to Hillside, four minutes between Hightown and Hall Road, three minutes between Seaforth & Litherland and Bootle New Strand is ridiculous. There needs to be more than four 8 cars diagrams as the 1732 and 1747 off of Central to Southport are regularly full and standing.

The overall journey time Southport to Liverpool is one minute longer than it was pre timetable change and with the many cautionary aspects you get coming down thanks to all the level crossings any extra time is very welcome.
I agree with you re the 8 cars though.

 

[Formby EMU Fan]

Currently on 777 005 Southport ->Liv Central 2G62 2106 service, recorded PA announcements sound like they are under water!

 

[M60lad]

Is it normal for the exterior displays on services to/from Chester to show Chester as a destination even when the sets are heading towards Liverpool? I was on 777022 on Saturday and while the interior displays were all working perfectly the exterior signs seemingly were stuck on Chester.

Unfortunately due to late running this set was terminated at Rock Ferry on its way out of Liverpool.

 

[Polarbear]

Is it normal for the exterior displays on services to/from Chester to show Chester as a destination even when the sets are heading towards Liverpool? I was on 777022 on Saturday and while the interior displays were all working perfectly the exterior signs seemingly were stuck on Chester.

Unfortunately due to late running this set was terminated at Rock Ferry on its way out of Liverpool.

No, not normal, but a bit too commonplace with the 777’s.

I’ve seen several variations of what should be displayed, including Northern Line services displaying Wirral destinations & vice versa.

For someone like me, it’s mildly amusing, but for those with disabilities, or customers not familiar with the area, it’s a big problem.

 

[azzarazza]

Didn't catch the unit numbers but an 8 car was at Town Green today around 1200, out of service and with the testing banners on the doors. Came in then reversed back towards Liverpool. Although the front and rear half were in disagreement with their destination displays, the rear train said Ormskirk and the front said out of service.

 

[rb124]

Re Hunts Cross - Southport reinstatement. I do not understand why the current situation is tolerated. I believe it was only 3 morning services and 3 evening services that were timetabled historically as 6 car/8 car services. Frankly it is Cressington that should be missing out on a few service stops rather than a halving of service frequency in the evening for everyone on the Hunts Cross branch (and the significant markets (as shown in post above) between Hunts Cross and Southport branch stations not being served with a direct service). If necessary offer a shuttle bus between Cressington and Aigburth or South Parkway in lieu of the cancelled services but I really dont see why everyone else should suffer for 2+ years! The inconvenient truth, I suspect, is that the removal of the evening services has saved a load of cost for Merseyrail and as their franchise winds down that suits them just fine :/

 

[Lloyds siding]

Is it normal for the exterior displays on services to/from Chester to show Chester as a destination even when the sets are heading towards Liverpool? I was on 777022 on Saturday and while the interior displays were all working perfectly the exterior signs seemingly were stuck on Chester.

Unfortunately due to late running this set was terminated at Rock Ferry on its way out of Liverpool.

Yes, there isn't a terminus in Livepool, so trains need to be showing 'Chester' well before they hit the loop line. I believe that change over to the Chester display is usually at Birkenhead Central.

 

[pokemonsuper9]

Yes, there isn't a terminus in Livepool, so trains need to be showing 'Chester' well before they hit the loop line. I believe that change over to the Chester display is usually at Birkenhead Central.

Normally it is on departure from James St (the first time), with the train previously displaying Liverpool Central.

 

[Phillipimo]

Didn't catch the unit numbers but an 8 car was at Town Green today around 1200, out of service and with the testing banners on the doors. Came in then reversed back towards Liverpool. Although the front and rear half were in disagreement with their destination displays, the rear train said Ormskirk and the front said out of service.

Realtime Trains suggests it was 011 and 012. Doing a couple of rounds trips from Kirkdale depot as 5T43/44/45/46. Driver training perhaps.

 

[Peakrider]

Despite of this, the male voice I find very AI and irritating.

There are also new signs on the end of most island platforms on the Southport line informing drivers of a reminder on which side to release doors at and if they are a 4 or 8 car service.

777007.

I have also noticed various units are absolutely filthy inside, like they haven’t been mopped for days. You can also see dirt build up under seats and in corner areas. Clearly the trains aren’t getting hoovered/swept either. I’ve also heard that units that stable at Southport and wirral line stations do not get cleaned by Stadler overnight. Any biohazards onboard are cleaned by station staff!

The four units that overnight at RFY definitely get cleaned every night.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==

They've found a way to make them worse?

Need to scrap all the pointless announcements that the grating male voice barks at us. The antisocial behaviour announcements all day long just imply travel on Merseyrail is unsafe, the reminders to have a valid ticket are too late (play it on the platforms) and the classic is the ridiculous warning to fare dodgers that this station has ticket gates (so get off elsewhere to avoid a fine)!!
We all managed perfectly well on the 507/8s with Julie Berry telling us the next stop and destination.

 

[MR-507508]

As part of the additional evening services following Evertons game this evening, there is a working from Headbolt Lane to Hunts Cross. I know this has ran in the past following a game. Quite a rare working. Even more unusual, this service terminated on platform 2 at Hunts Cross - perhaps marking the first 777/1 to do this?

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:s72021/2026-02-23/detailed#allox_id=0

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==

The four units that overnight at RFY definitely get cleaned every night.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==

How do you know for sure?

 

[Peakrider]

As part of the additional evening services following Evertons game this evening, there is a working from Headbolt Lane to Hunts Cross. I know this has ran in the past following a game. Quite a rare working. Even more unusual, this service terminated on platform 2 at Hunts Cross - perhaps marking the first 777/1 to do this?

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:s72021/2026-02-23/detailed#allox_id=0

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Feb 2026 ==


How do you know for sure?

I overlook it.

 

[jamesst]

All units should get a clean every night.

The main issues are a) stadlers determination to operate with as few staff as possible meaning the cleaners are spread quite thinly and b) in the case of the Wirral the sheer amount of locations the units are stored at compared to the Northern

 

[Ellis101]

Hunts Cross trains are not always switching platforms at Central and if they do theres screens on the platforms and announcements, theres not much to be confused about on a narrow island platform.

My issue is on such a narrow cramped island platform there is more and more people now waiting around to continue onto southport as a lot of the hunts cross branch travelers are going to southport.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 24 Feb 2026 ==

Re Hunts Cross - Southport reinstatement. I do not understand why the current situation is tolerated. I believe it was only 3 morning services and 3 evening services that were timetabled historically as 6 car/8 car services. Frankly it is Cressington that should be missing out on a few service stops rather than a halving of service frequency in the evening for everyone on the Hunts Cross branch (and the significant markets (as shown in post above) between Hunts Cross and Southport branch stations not being served with a direct service). If necessary offer a shuttle bus between Cressington and Aigburth or South Parkway in lieu of the cancelled services but I really dont see why everyone else should suffer for 2+ years! The inconvenient truth, I suspect, is that the removal of the evening services has saved a load of cost for Merseyrail and as their franchise winds down that suits them just fine :/

I've been suffering for 2+ years and I simply just refuse to go out of an evening now it's not a nice experience when you're freezing to death at 10pm with 25-30 minutes for the next train whilst every other service is every 15 minutes it is completely unacceptable and I'm really fed up of it.

 

[Kite159]

I've been suffering for 2+ years and I simply just refuse to go out of an evening now it's not a nice experience when you're freezing to death at 10pm with 25-30 minutes for the next train whilst every other service is every 15 minutes it is completely unacceptable and I'm really fed up of it.

So at the same time of night when services on the Wirral have dropped to also half-hourly (and on certain nights can be very much overcrowded)?

 

[Phillipimo]

So at the same time of night when services on the Wirral have dropped to also half-hourly (and on certain nights can be very much overcrowded)?

Indeed, the Southport line is and was the only line to retain a 15 minute frequency until the end of service. It is certainly frustrating for Hunts Cross line passengers that this has been taken away, but it is the same experience as most of the Merseyrail network.

 

[M28361M]

The 15 minute evening frequency on the Hunts Cross line was a relatively recent innovation, coming in around 2008. I seem to remember the rationale at the time was mainly to provide an enhanced service to the newly-opened Liverpool South Parkway. I think extending all services to HNX only required one extra unit and crew so it was relatively easy to do.

The current timetable may be in line with other parts of Merseyrail, but it's still a 50% cut in service compared to previously, and not really in keeping with the promise of great improvements that the 777s were supposed to bring.

Incidentally, I can see on RTT that for the second year in a row the "temporary" timetable will temporarily change again for the Grand National event from 9-11 April, with Ormskirk cut back to Liverpool and Southport trains running through to Hunts Cross.

 

[Ellis101]

Indeed, the Southport line is and was the only line to retain a 15 minute frequency until the end of service. It is certainly frustrating for Hunts Cross line passengers that this has been taken away, but it is the same experience as most of the Merseyrail network.

Is it not by far statistically the most used line?

Also is it not one of the most important for Merseytravel because of their focus on Airport connectivity?

Update: As I posted this mass confusion at a peak time central once again as the Hunts Cross train is switched to platform 2 at about 30 seconds notice because the southport service is in the way!

 

[baldyman26]

How is a train switching platforms at Liverpool Central is the most inconvenient thing in the world. It's 10 steps and there are people literally announcing it on the tannoy as the train comes in. Unless you are plumbed into headphones which is a person's own problem, trains switching at Central is literally the least of a Merseyrail passenger's issues!
Let's celebrate the train actually turning up!

 

[Ellis101]

How is a train switching platforms at Liverpool Central is the most inconvenient thing in the world. It's 10 steps and there are people literally announcing it on the tannoy as the train comes in. Unless you are plumbed into headphones which is a person's own problem, trains switching at Central is literally the least of a Merseyrail passenger's issues!
Let's celebrate the train actually turning up!

When theres hundreds of people on the platform its not the easiest thing to do especially when its a infamously narrow platform

 

[Lloyds siding]

my last rush-hour trip towards Southport left from Platform 1, with notice being given by the platform announcer as the train arrived. Could have been worse: there were no trains on the Chester or Ellesmere Port lines for two hours because of a track/signalling fault. I'd already jumped on to a scheduled bus from Bebington to Liverpool rather than wait for replacement buses to be organised.

 

[bramling]

Had a visit to Liverpool over the weekend, a few thoughts.

Firstly the 777s felt very awkward. For me the two biggest issues are the door positioning and uneven floors. I can see no benefit at all from having the doors positioned as they are, and I felt it was contributing to glacial station dwells times.

In terms of the service pattern, there were 8-car trains running during the midday period on the Southport route, which I felt was welcome. If the current service pattern makes this more viable then I’d support it being permanent, as clearly the Central-Southport section seems to be the busiest part of the system. More unfortunate was the lack of any lengthened trains on any other routes.

All in all money has been spent on the system. However comparing to 15 years ago, I’m not sure what tangible improvement the passenger actually sees. If anything the 777s are less comfortable than the 507/508 fleet, and clearly reliability is still poor. Any performance improvement is being nullified by long station dwells. Meanwhile, despite refurbishment, to me the stations now look no better than they did before refurbishment, if anything worse as the colours used appear extremely clinical and the finishes give a feeling of being low-quality.

Finally, I agree with the comments made that the male voice now used on the 777s is horribly jarring.

 

[baldyman26]

Well it looks like change is in the air with the "jarring" male voice. I was on a train to Ormskirk today, they appear to have changed him. The one now appears to be a bit more well spoken and has a better tone more suited to announcements if that makes sense. Still AI but the "shouty" messages were no longer there and neither were the automatic ticket barrier ones, at least, I didn't hear them. The no smoking announcement is but it's shorter and less shouty and the police one has been changed too.

There is clearly a reason some reason announcements aren't Julie which to me are the ones that need a bit more attention. They also now show connections on the screens as you approach the stations where you can change. But the non enthusiasts still don't batter an eye lid so suppose it's neither here or there.
Whatever changes are made, Merseyrail will never please everyone.

 

[Ellis101]

However comparing to 15 years ago, I’m not sure what tangible improvement the passenger actually sees. If anything the 777s are less comfortable than the 507/508 fleet, and clearly reliability is still poor. Any performance improvement is being nullified by long station dwells.

You'd think replacing near half a century old trains would deliver better reliability and at least some performance improvements however that has yet to be seen.
For me all the new trains have meant is less capacity during peak times...

It seems like figuring out how to use SDO at Cressington, reversing a temporary timetable and having working announcements is like trying to find the zodiac killer so I'm not the biggest fan of them.

 

[bramling]

You'd think replacing near half a century old trains would deliver better reliability and at least some performance improvements however that has yet to be seen.
For me all the new trains have meant is less capacity during peak times...

It seems like figuring out how to use SDO at Cressington, reversing a temporary timetable and having working announcements is like trying to find the zodiac killer so I'm not the biggest fan of them.

Agreed. I’m not really sure what improvement the guard situation offers compared to the way the 507/508 used to be worked, especially when they were able to depart with the rear cab door still open. I realise that arrangement would have been hard to replicate on the new trains.

Likewise who on earth specified the doorway positions? I realise Merseyrail isn’t as densely used as somewhere like London, but even so the layout borders on insane. Unfortunately it’s baked in for the entire lifespan of the trains. One can bet that when they are eventually replaced, their replacements will be touted as having “‘more evenly spaced doorways” as an improvement.

 

[Prime586]

Likewise who on earth specified the doorway positions? I realise Merseyrail isn’t as densely used as somewhere like London, but even so the layout borders on insane. Unfortunately it’s baked in for the entire lifespan of the trains. One can bet that when they are eventually replaced, their replacements will be touted as having “‘more evenly spaced doorways” as an improvement.

I think we probably know the answer to that...

The design brief was likely 'put the same number of vestibules in the 4-car 777 as the 3 car 507/508 had'. If they put an extra vestibule in the end cars, it would further reduce the seating capacity. The T&W 555s are full of doors, but they have mostly longitudinal metro-style seating and are configured for large numbers of standees instead (which there have been complaints about, compared to the bus-style seating of the Metrocars).

 

[Bletchleyite]

I think we probably know the answer to that...

The design brief was likely 'put the same number of vestibules in the 4-car 777 as the 3 car 507/508 had'. If they put an extra vestibule in the end cars, it would further reduce the seating capacity. The T&W 555s are full of doors, but they have mostly longitudinal metro-style seating and are configured for large numbers of standees instead (which there have been complaints about, compared to the bus-style seating of the Metrocars).

It was so they could fit an 8 car with all doors platformed on a 120m platform, I believe.

Then they extended them anyway

 

[RMTGuard]

ASDO will be with us soon. Still work to do on the train - training and infrastructure complete.

 

[bramling]

I think we probably know the answer to that...

The design brief was likely 'put the same number of vestibules in the 4-car 777 as the 3 car 507/508 had'. If they put an extra vestibule in the end cars, it would further reduce the seating capacity. The T&W 555s are full of doors, but they have mostly longitudinal metro-style seating and are configured for large numbers of standees instead (which there have been complaints about, compared to the bus-style seating of the Metrocars).

I’m not keen on the new T&W fleet either, again the layout just doesn’t seem to work as well as what they are replacing. And indeed the mix of journey lengths on there I’d imagine is quite similar to Merseyrail.

Much as I’m not overly keen on the Desiro City (though mainly due to factors which could be quite easily changed rather than anything more fundamental), I can’t help but feel a 717-style train would have been better for the Merseyrail end-user. I’m not so sure on the perennial issue of wheel wear in the loop tunnel though, and whether this would have made a 717 less suitable operationally.