• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

Ex-banker banned from railway after dodging £5,900 of train fares

Unixman

Member
Joined
16 Mar 2012
Messages
167
The Times is reporting that Joseph Malloy, a former senior executive with HSBC, has been sentenced to ten months in jail, suspended for 18 months, along with a requirement to undertake 80 hours of approved work. He was ordered not to travel on Southeastern Railway for 12 months and to pay the company £5,000 compensation.
"A wealthy ex-HSBC executive who used a “sophisticated” ticketing scam to shave thousands of pounds off the cost of his journeys to work has been banned from using his local railway.

Joseph Molloy bought tickets between stations at the beginning and end of his journey, but not all those in between. The technique, known as “doughnutting”, exploits ticket barriers to create a “hole” in payment.

Molloy used the fraud at least 740 times to save £5,911 over 11 months while travelling on Southeastern Railway, Inner London crown court was told. How he was caught was not stated."

https://www.thetimes.com/uk/crime/article/ex-city-banker-sentenced-dodging-train-fares-m9j82sw9p

(Paywall)
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

wilsontown

Member
Joined
11 Feb 2012
Messages
144
I wouldn't particularly describe that as a sophisticated fraud, all kinds of chumps get caught for it all the time. Unless there's something I'm missing?
 

swt_passenger

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Apr 2010
Messages
34,320
“Sophisticated”? I suspect there could probably be hundreds get caught, and we only see a small fraction of them posting here.
 

FenMan

Established Member
Joined
13 Oct 2011
Messages
1,542
I wouldn't particularly describe that as a sophisticated fraud, all kinds of chumps get caught for it all the time. Unless there's something I'm missing?

He wasn't convicted for the doughnutting. He pleaded guilty to fraud by false representation, a very different beast to a "normal" railway offence.

Although the report doesn't go into detail, it does mention he was obtaining Jobcentre Plus fare discounts as well as doughnutting. I suspect the former led to the fraud charge.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

jfollows

Established Member
Joined
26 Feb 2011
Messages
10,181
Location
Wilmslow
Thank you for the link.
Will Hanson, representing Molloy, said: “He was going through a pretty difficult period when he did this. He cannot explain why he did this. It is a fraud that was discreet in nature, committed against no individual and no one from the public was made to suffer and a large private company was the victim.”
What utter rubbish. The usual “victimless crime” rubbish. Glad it was thrown out.
After the court hearing Molloy changed his clothes to make it difficult to be identified and vaulted a wall in an attempt to avoid being photographed.
I don’t think he was proud of what he did.
 
Last edited:

hornbeampark

Member
Joined
27 Dec 2023
Messages
43
Location
Harrogate
There is a photograph of him leaving court following sentence in the article.

Judging by the quantity of luggage in his possession I think (and I suspect he thinks) he is lucky to have avoided prison.

I wonder why the TOC took such a robust approach here when we have seem some quite lofty out of court settlements on this forum.
 

Haywain

Veteran Member
Joined
3 Feb 2013
Messages
24,877
Although the report doesn't go into detail,
Not huge detail but this does throw a bit more light on the matter:
The banker used false names and addresses to buy two key smartcards on which train tickets were uploaded between October 2023 and September 2024. He also obtained Jobcentre Plus discounts that gave 50 per cent off ticket prices.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

What utter rubbish. The usual “victimless crime” rubbish. Glad it was thrown out.
And then this:
Molloy was suffering from stress because of health difficulties and the death of his mother.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

There is a photograph of him leaving court following sentence in the article.

Judging by the quantity of luggage in his possession I think (and I suspect he thinks) he is lucky to have avoided prison.
A photograph of someone that might be him:
After the court hearing Molloy changed his clothes to make it difficult to be identified and vaulted a wall in an attempt to avoid being photographed.
 

fandroid

Established Member
Joined
9 Nov 2014
Messages
2,570
Location
Hampshire
It shows that if you really go heavy on the fare evasion and try to hide behind aliases, the railway could very well prosecute for fraud and prison sentences are not impossible.

However, both doughnutting and using a discount you're not entitled to are very easily detected crimes if it goes on long enough. All the "clever" stuff is then not only wasted but compounds the risk. These guys think their luck will last forever, the fools
 

AlterEgo

Verified Rep - Wingin' It! Paul Lucas
Joined
30 Dec 2008
Messages
29,729
Location
LBK
The police/CPS appear to have prosecuted this one. As they should.
 

John R

Established Member
Joined
1 Jul 2013
Messages
6,152
I wonder is it a coincidence that a few of the high value fare evasion cases that make it to court (as opposed to having settlement offers made, which surely they would have jumped at the chance of) are those of people in senior positions in organisations where integrity is paramount and required by a regulator.
 

hornbeampark

Member
Joined
27 Dec 2023
Messages
43
Location
Harrogate
I wonder is it a coincidence that a few of the high value fare evasion cases that make it to court (as opposed to having settlement offers made, which surely they would have jumped at the chance of) are those of people in senior positions in organisations where integrity is paramount and required by a regulator.

Perhaps, or perhaps their knowledge of the financial sector and fraud prevention/detection measures inherently broadens the scale and sophistication of their fare evasion.
 

AlterEgo

Verified Rep - Wingin' It! Paul Lucas
Joined
30 Dec 2008
Messages
29,729
Location
LBK
I wonder is it a coincidence that a few of the high value fare evasion cases that make it to court (as opposed to having settlement offers made, which surely they would have jumped at the chance of) are those of people in senior positions in organisations where integrity is paramount and required by a regulator.
We only hear the ones that make the news, which won't report every case. Someone of substantial means who is on the fiddle is quite newsworthy.
 

BrianW

Established Member
Joined
22 Mar 2017
Messages
2,134
He wasn't convicted for the doughnutting. He pleaded guilty to fraud by false representation, a very different beast to a "normal" railway offence.

Although the report doesn't go into detail, it does mention he was obtaining Jobcentre Plus fare discounts as well as doughnutting. I suspect the former led to the fraud charge.

-----

Free to read version of the Times article:-

Thank you for the link to a free version. Several aspects stand out, including;
- A wealthy ex-HSBC executive
- The senior executive caught the train from close to his £2 million home in Orpington, south London, to London Bridge station. He then travelled on to his office at Canary Wharf.
- The banker used false names and addresses
- The banker was appointed head of passive equity at HSBC Global Asset Management in 2015. He retired last year.
- Molloy was suffering from stress because of health difficulties and the death of his mother.
- He also obtained Jobcentre Plus discounts that gave 50 per cent off ticket prices.

At least no pet ate his homework.
The judge appears to have shown Mr Molloy a great deal of compassion and mercy; perhaps, on the verge of Lent, he will be able to 'repent in sackcloth and ashes' and pay his debt through his 80 hours of approved work before he gets a new job.
 

Mattplans

Member
Joined
27 Sep 2024
Messages
720
Location
London, UK
I wonder is it a coincidence that a few of the high value fare evasion cases that make it to court (as opposed to having settlement offers made, which surely they would have jumped at the chance of) are those of people in senior positions in organisations where integrity is paramount and required by a regulator.

The case regarding Jonathan Paul Burrows (ex Blackrock hedge fund manager who doughnutted using an Oyster card at Cannon Street) was offered an out of court settlment. https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/rather-large-out-of-court-settlement.99253/

The article said:

Train companies are reported to be testing GPS technology to track passengers’ movements which will help prevent “doughnutting”.

I can't help but wonder if this is referring to the GPS-based ticketing trials being conducted on EMR. Not sure the aim of this is really to prevent doughnutting like the article claims, and there must be so many ways this technology itself can be exploited to gain a lower fare. Obviously not as easy as buying a ticket with a discount you aren't entitled to, however.

The article said:

How he was caught was not stated.

I suspect he was caught following a data trawl that identified suspicious travel behaviour rather than being stopped in person. The article goes on to say he stopped this behaviour 'of his own volition prior to being arrested' (but not prior to being caught?). If he wasn't stopped on the railway while doing it, it is likely they lacked the leverage that allows train companies to offer ooc settlements and they had to pursue another route.

The article says he used "fake addresses" when purchasing the key smartcards. But how would he have received the smartcard in the mail if he used a fake address? (unless you can get these smartcards at stations rather than just having them delivered - happy to be corrected)
 
Last edited:

WesternLancer

Veteran Member
Joined
12 Apr 2019
Messages
15,453
Thank you for the link to a free version. Several aspects stand out, including;
- A wealthy ex-HSBC executive
- The senior executive caught the train from close to his £2 million home in Orpington, south London, to London Bridge station. He then travelled on to his office at Canary Wharf.
- The banker used false names and addresses
- The banker was appointed head of passive equity at HSBC Global Asset Management in 2015. He retired last year.
- Molloy was suffering from stress because of health difficulties and the death of his mother.
- He also obtained Jobcentre Plus discounts that gave 50 per cent off ticket prices.

At least no pet ate his homework.
The judge appears to have shown Mr Molloy a great deal of compassion and mercy; perhaps, on the verge of Lent, he will be able to 'repent in sackcloth and ashes' and pay his debt through his 80 hours of approved work before he gets a new job.
He may now or in due course be able to get a Job Centre Plus railcard for genuine reasons.
 

ainsworth74

Forum Staff
Staff Member
Global Moderator
Joined
16 Nov 2009
Messages
31,144
Location
Redcar
What utter rubbish. The usual “victimless crime” rubbish. Glad it was thrown out.
In fairness it is the role of the defence representative to pain their client in the best light possible during sentencing. How much weight the judge places on that of course is variable. Thankfully in this case the answer is "not much" but still important that anyone has the best case put forward for them!
 

STINT47

Member
Joined
16 Aug 2020
Messages
877
Location
Nottingham
This story does seem to confirm that most fare evasion is not done because people cannot afford it but because they think they can get away with it and its in their nature.

Also money does not make you a better person.
 

ainsworth74

Forum Staff
Staff Member
Global Moderator
Joined
16 Nov 2009
Messages
31,144
Location
Redcar
This story does seem to confirm that most fare evasion is not done because people cannot afford it but because they think they can get away with it and its in their nature.
Is that not really the case with a lot of crime in general? Obviously some of it happens "in the heat of the moment" or due to diminished reasoning capacity (booze usually!) but a huge chunk of it only happens because people make the assessment they won't get caught...

(One of the reasons why the "WE MUST MAKE SENTENCES EVER HARSHER, BURN THOSE WHO STEAL PHONES AT THE STAKE" type refrain to be a bit barmy. If they don't think they'll be caught then the punishment almost doesn't matter. But that's probably for another thread! :lol: )
Also money does not make you a better person.
For sure!
 

Greyman1

Member
Joined
5 Nov 2023
Messages
45
Location
Bristol
The case regarding Jonathan Paul Burrows (ex Blackrock hedge fund manager who doughnutted using an Oyster card at Cannon Street) was offered an out of court settlment. https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/rather-large-out-of-court-settlement.99253/



I can't help but wonder if this is referring to the GPS-based ticketing trials being conducted on EMR. Not sure the aim of this is really to prevent doughnutting like the article claims, and there must be so many ways this technology itself can be exploited to gain a lower fare. Obviously not as easy as buying a ticket with a discount you aren't entitled to, however.



I suspect he was caught following a data trawl that identified suspicious travel behaviour rather than being stopped in person. The article goes on to say he stopped this behaviour 'of his own volition prior to being arrested' (but not prior to being caught?). If he wasn't stopped on the railway while doing it, it is likely they lacked the leverage that allows train companies to offer ooc settlements and they had to pursue another route.

The article says he used "fake addresses" when purchasing the key smartcards. But how would he have received the smartcard in the mail if he used a fake address? (unless you can get these smartcards at stations rather than just having them delivered - happy to be corrected)

You used to be able to collect smartcards from ticket offices. You could then register them to a name and address after and tick the no mail option. So it would never go to the linked address, or recieve any form of letters, or advertising junk mail.
 

Farang

Member
Joined
17 May 2018
Messages
150
"After the court hearing Molloy changed his clothes to make it difficult to be identified and vaulted a wall..."

Giving us a preview of his new fare dodging tactic?
 

duffield

Established Member
Joined
31 Jul 2013
Messages
3,305
Location
East Midlands
There is a photograph of him leaving court following sentence in the article.
...

That's pretty hilarious, him strenuously trying to avoid being seen or photographed leaving court, when the article has a high quality full face photo of him right at the beginning.
 

jonathan01n

Member
Joined
29 Apr 2017
Messages
112
Location
Lincoln
This story does seem to confirm that most fare evasion is not done because people cannot afford it but because they think they can get away with it and its in their nature.

Also money does not make you a better person.
Yes exactly. Also Southeastern is operated by Dft so the "evil private business" do not stand either.
 

Trackman

Established Member
Joined
28 Feb 2013
Messages
4,325
Location
Lewisham
This story does seem to confirm that most fare evasion is not done because people cannot afford it but because they think they can get away with it and its in their nature.

Also money does not make you a better person.
Some wealthy people or otherwise think they shouldn't need to pay. I have a couple of stories about wealthy people doing this, but won't clog up the thread.

And correct, money does not make you a better person.
 

island

Veteran Member
Joined
30 Dec 2010
Messages
17,914
Location
0036
You used to be able to collect smartcards from ticket offices. You could then register them to a name and address after and tick the no mail option. So it would never go to the linked address, or recieve any form of letters, or advertising junk mail.
You still can on Southeastern.
 

The exile

Established Member
Joined
31 Mar 2010
Messages
9,524
Location
Somerset
In fairness it is the role of the defence representative to pain their client in the best light possible during sentencing. How much weight the judge places on that of course is variable. Thankfully in this case the answer is "not much" but still important that anyone has the best case put forward for them!
There is a difference between offering mitigating circumstances and belittling an offence because the theft wasn’t from an individual.
 

AlterEgo

Verified Rep - Wingin' It! Paul Lucas
Joined
30 Dec 2008
Messages
29,729
Location
LBK
There is a difference between offering mitigating circumstances and belittling an offence because the theft wasn’t from an individual.
Not really. The court has to adjudge the level of harm caused to the victim. Depriving £5000 from a large company with tens of million in turnover is a different level of harm to defrauding an old lady of her last £5000. It is not unreasonable for the defence to make this point, given it's a fact that the court will use in determining the sentence. It's probably a significant factor in the judge deciding to suspend the sentence.


High impact – move up a category; if in category 1 move up the range​

  • Serious detrimental effect on the victim whether financial or otherwise (including emotional and psychological harm)
  • Victim particularly vulnerable (due to factors including but not limited to their age, financial circumstances, mental capacity)
If the loss caused or intended is of no or minimal financial value but high impact – circumstances may make it appropriate to move up more than one category

Medium impact – move upwards within the category range​

  • Considerable detrimental effect on the victim whether financial or otherwise

Lesser impact – no adjustment​

  • Some detrimental impact on victim, whether financial or otherwise

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Indeed, who would employ him now?
He'll be in consultancy soon, no doubt. Marginally more honest work. :lol:
 

Top