Eurostar service (train 9116) in March cancelled

[TheWierdOne]

Sure, but that's just making an investment from income for future benefit - the ultimate aim is still to maximise profit.

An investement from income would be buying new trains, my original answer is perhaps not worded the best. I was aiming to illustrate that you might sacrifice short-term profit to maximise profit in the long-term

 

[Mikey C]

If you're trying to grow a long term business, then "randomly" cancelling trains 5 weeks ahead isn't a great way of going about it.

Short term cost savings, but it hardly gives a good impression to the "customers" affected.

 

[RT4038]

I also agree if got the trains anyway, and timetable slots, then a dynamic organisation would be making money by filling 3 trains at highest combined revenue, rather than settling for revenue from two, and zero revenue from third train.

That will depend what the highest combined revenue offset by the costs of running three trains is, compared to the highest combined revenue offset by the costs of running two trains?

Not necessarily, the principal reason I can think of off the top of my block would be sacrificing some profit in order to make the service more attractive and increase future revenue by building customer loyalty. For instance, running more journeys than is financially optimal in order to increase customer convenience and encourage more journeys in future.

That depends whether they think taking a long term view is more advantageous than paying off their Covid debt is. The long term view is purely speculative, whereas paying down the Covid debt before the competition comes along may be a more pressing imperative.

If you're trying to grow a long term business, then "randomly" cancelling trains 5 weeks ahead isn't a great way of going about it.

Short term cost savings, but it hardly gives a good impression to the "customers" affected.

SNCF have lots and lots of experience of high speed train competition and the economic behaviour / loyalty of customers. And some very successful open-access operations too. They must be doing something right. Cheapest possible fares, hence the need to pay down the debt now.....?

 

[TheWierdOne]

SNCF have lots and lots of experience of high speed train competition and the economic behaviour / loyalty of customers. And some very successful open-access operations too. They must be doing something right. Cheapest possible fares, hence the need to pay down the debt now.....?

SNCF by most accounts has an absolutely atrocious record of customer service, and seems to regard customers as everything that is wrong with the railway. The fact they have open-access competition in operation or starting soon on most of their flagship routes is probably indicative that they have not captured the market as well as they could’ve done.

 

[RT4038]

SNCF by most accounts has an absolutely atrocious record of customer service, and seems to regard customers as everything that is wrong with the railway. The fact they have open-access competition in operation or starting soon on most of their flagship routes is probably indicative that they have not captured the market as well as they could’ve done.

Does the presence of SNCF on (successful) open access operations in Austria, Italy and Spain indicate that the incumbent operators did not capture the market as well as they could have done? Or does it merely indicate what everybody already knows is that monopoly always breeds complacency?

I have travelled on E* and SNCF many, many, many times and have received customer service no worse than any other railway system. In fact, most journeys having gone without incident at all. There is no indication that any competitor on Channel Tunnel routes will have better or worse customer service - the competition will inevitably end up on the lowest common denominator of fares, which will dictate a common denominator of customer service, by and large. (level of customer service comes at a cost, of course)

 

[Trainbike46]

My experience with Eurostar customer service is actually pretty good - with me at least, they've always behaved reasonably. Given what we know about the infrastructure charges, I don't think the lowest fares could be a lot lower than they are. The main criticism that I think one could reasonably have of Eurostar is that they are slow to respond to situations - both strategic/long-term, and occasionally on the ground in case of disruption.

 

[williamn]

There is no indication that any competitor on Channel Tunnel routes will have better or worse customer service

Short of them starting and demonstrating it what would such indication be 3 years ahead of time?!

 

[RT4038]

Short of them starting and demonstrating it what would such indication be 3 years ahead of time?!

Which is why post #34 is absurd in assuming that 'customer service' will be a significant factor in any competitive situation on Channel Tunnel railways. Much of the 'atrocious' customer service is related to abnormal events where large numbers of customers all want personal time hungry service from small numbers of available personnel, and/or large sums of money spent on them in comparison to the fare paid - both scenarios likely to be replicated amongst any competitor too.

 

[Snow1964]

Which is why post #34 is absurd in assuming that 'customer service' will be a significant factor in any competitive situation on Channel Tunnel railways. Much of the 'atrocious' customer service is related to abnormal events where large numbers of customers all want personal time hungry service from small numbers of available personnel, and/or large sums of money spent on them in comparison to the fare paid - both scenarios likely to be replicated amongst any competitor too.

Although these events can affect many thousands, (not just a few hundred) so need systems in place, like stadiums where information, restart times, and what to do in meantime can be quickly disseminated.

If rebookings are needed, can't expect a small number of personnel to cover thousands of people, so need to have automated processes in reserve that are ready to spring into action, and a better system for estimating the disruption duration. It's proper contingency planning, not trying to make it up on the hoof.

 

[RT4038]

Although these events can affect many thousands, (not just a few hundred) so need systems in place, like stadiums where information, restart times, and what to do in meantime can be quickly disseminated.

If rebookings are needed, can't expect a small number of personnel to cover thousands of people, so need to have automated processes in reserve that are ready to spring into action, and a better system for estimating the disruption duration. It's proper contingency planning, not trying to make it up on the hoof.

All of which costs lots of money, for relatively little use. It is cheaper to have meltdown occasionally, whichever competitor you are.

 

[rvdborgt]

All of which costs lots of money, for relatively little use. It is cheaper to have meltdown occasionally, whichever competitor you are.

In fact, Eurostar have already some things in place, such as emails they send out for people to rebook. It's just that these don't necessarily comply with legislation in force, since they leave out/don't offer certain mandatory things.

 

[riceuten]

Indeed.

They really desperately need competition.

You really honestly think Vermin Trains will be that different ?

 

[Snow1964]

You really honestly think Vermin Trains will be that different ?

As it is looking like they will be third operator to start, behind Eurostar and Trenitalia. Going to have to do something to get market share, and annoying customers is not likely to be done so casually as it is now by the exclusive operator.

 

[riceuten]

I don't think any operator is in the business of deliberately annoying customers, but they did a pretty good job of that with the West Coast franchise.

 

[MattSGB]

I don't get all the Virgin trains hate. On corridors with competition (like West Midlands to London) they used to have some absolute bargain advanced fares, including affordable first class. They even occasionally upgraded my standard advanced ticket to first class for free. They had a pretty good catering service and the staff were mostly happy until Avanti came along.

By comparison, last time I used Avanti first class for a weekday service, the 9 coach pendalino only had the low-capacity end coach allocated as first class (all the others were standard premium), the lone staff member spent most of the time browsing social media in the galley, the train was in reverse formation that was not announced so we had to walk through the whole train with luggage, the reservation system was broken so we couldn't sit in the individual facing seats that we booked, and the only breakfast options were long-life bacon rolls.

My point is that Virgin service was better than almost all of the competition at the time, and first class was way better quality than the ever degrading Eurostar plus service. On a high-speed international service with genuine competition I am quite hopeful that they might shake up the standard of service, particularly in premium classes. Eurostar seriously need a sharp kick in a sensitive place.

 

[williamn]

I don't get all the Virgin trains hate.

No nor me, I’m pretty sure most regular WCML travellers would have them back in a heart beat.