Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
That's because the priority seats (2 rows) are on the blue side. The other seats are similarly spaced.
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XC Voyager Refurbishment
- Thread starter Energy
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That's because the priority seats (2 rows) are on the blue side. The other seats are similarly spaced.
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R
RailUK Forums
Ah okay, I always assumed that all of one side had increased leg room.
You learn something new every day!
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Sorry, I wasn't *quite* right. That's the end coach, which has 4 priority rows, not 2, on the blue side, and none on the red side. That might be why you thought it was all rows on that side.
Seating plan: https://www.crosscountrytrains.co.uk/sites/default/files/2025-09/voyager-trains-oct-2023-3.pdf
Either way it's priority rows that cause the misalignment.
That seating plan really highlights how space inefficient Voyagers are doesn't it.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
The Avanti one probably does more - just 52 seats in coach D when a Mk2 coach with the same sort of layout and a body 3m shorter fits 64.
There's barely two thirds of the length used by seating. It's extremely poor.
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
I actually prefer the updated new livery to the one with the blue vinyls. I thought it looked too busy, now I like it a lot.
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Isn't the reason they don't line up in that photo because one side has a luggage rack before the first pair of seats, whereas the other side just starts with seats straight away?
occone
Member
No mention of anything under the floor - one of the big differences between the ex-Avanti units and XC ones are how much better the Avanti ones seem to run - quieter and less shaky.
The XC 220 I was on yesterday felt like I was sat on a tractor. I arrived after 3h positively carbonated.
Have louder door hustle alarms been installed too? The original XC ones are very quiet and I've seen a door auto close on people a few times.
The XC 220 I was on yesterday felt like I was sat on a tractor. I arrived after 3h positively carbonated.
Have louder door hustle alarms been installed too? The original XC ones are very quiet and I've seen a door auto close on people a few times.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
In that coach (the end one) it's because of the priority rows, but in other coaches it's for the reason you state.
py_megapixel
Established Member
As built the ones on the Voyagers can barely be heard over the engines. The signal buzzer is louder; in fact, the first time I travelled on a Voyager, I thought that was the alarm! (I now know that Voyagers have an unusual dispatch process where the guard uses a bell-code to ask the driver to close the doors, so you can hear the buzzer sounding just before the doors close).
The Avanti sets had louder alarms fitted when they were refurbished. No idea if the XC ones are getting them.
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
Funny that you state the blue ones have more legroom though, because I'm sure C09 that I like is red.
Mind you, I've been on a lot of ex-Avanti ones lately. Interestingly enough, C09 is not aligned with the windows on those, but it is (perfectly) on legacy Voyagers.
I’m intrigued to see the Voyager refurbishment in person. The images make the interiors seem very grey, bright and corporate, though a lot cleaner.
The seats don’t look ideal for such long journeys - they look a bit flimsy in standard class (I have used them in the refurbished class 458s and they are fine for the routes those trains serve) and the first class equivalents hardly scream comfort.
The external livery clashes quite a bit - who would’ve thought bright red/pink, grey and teal would work? It clashes in almost every way possible!
The seats don’t look ideal for such long journeys - they look a bit flimsy in standard class (I have used them in the refurbished class 458s and they are fine for the routes those trains serve) and the first class equivalents hardly scream comfort.
The external livery clashes quite a bit - who would’ve thought bright red/pink, grey and teal would work? It clashes in almost every way possible!
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
That's just the end coach. The others may be different, in particular they have full rows of 4 priority seats.
I seem to remember Avanti reversing both the coach letters and the seat numbering?
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
They look smart but a bit drab, don't they.
And we know what the first class is like from Avanti's Everos. I'm of the opinion that they're extremely, extremely poor in the Everos when compared to the luxury of Pendolino first class seating, and of course the XC Voyagers will be making the exact switch from the same as in the Pendolinos to that in the Everos.
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Perhaps, but all 5 car units with CrossCountry are A B C D F now regardless of whether they're legacy units or ex-Avanti units.
YorksLad12
Established Member
Possibly, ta. Doesn’t make me less grumpy about it
Oh well, they might be replaced in ten years…!
Snapper
Established Member
Here's pictures from the launch of the CrossCountry refurbished Voyager fleet and a look inside the first train. https://paulbigland.blog/.../alstom-beacon-rail-and.../
I do hope the toilets walls receive new vinyl coverings, that's a lot of white space and we all know where that leads...
Sad. No more Whip-Ma-Whop-Ma-Gate greeting you as the door grinds open, end of an era!
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From what I can see the refurbishment looks good. Certainly appreciate the better positioned power sockets and the seats look more comfy and spacious (proof will be in the real travelling experience). I’d have painted the vestibule roofs internally white to brighten the interiors at the boarding points. Would it have been possible maybe to have put a partition in the first class coach to reduce first class by 1 bay and have had 2 bays of 4 standard at the inner end for maybe a tiny increase in standard seats on each unit? Otherwise a really good refit from what I can see.
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
I'd question that. In such a tight layout that's exactly where my knee goes.
Best place is under the seat you're sitting on, not as easy to find but it's the only place it doesn't obstruct anything.
Seats as mentioned earlier are subjective. I’ll reserve full judgement till I travel on them but I found the old seats ok and I’m 5.8, if the headrest area is slightly narrower it may increase the feeling of space too, the power points were an issue if sitting in an isle seat so that’s now resolved. The blurb says the legroom is increased and from the pics to me at least the seats appear very slightly thinner which may be beneficial and don’t have that bar underneath. I’ll guess we’ll all have to see when we travel but I certainly don’t think its a bad refit considering some of the modern offer with ironing boards that are upright and rock hard. Id agree a GBR thought in the process might have been an advantage but it’s a fairly neutral seat fabric for now.
Couple more questions to anybody in the know.
Are the lights warm LED or the ridiculously bright white used by Hitachi (I feel changing those could be a massive improvement to those trains).
Any automatic announcements added? After tinkering around for years, even northern have a half working automatic station announcement now. It’s not great but it’s at least consistently not great rather than random inaudible TMs making the announcements badly.
Do the personal overhead reading lights work? Many haven’t worked for a while but they’re potentially a great addition over most other uk trains. You even get those in coaches so not too much to expect these days.
Have they done anything to fix the internal doors closing on you when queuing to get out. That’s a very irritating “feature” of Voyagers. There was no sensor, they just closed on a timer regardless of whether you were stood or walking through the middle of them, often trapping you in their evil clutches. Flippin useless. Hope (but doubt) that’s been addressed.
Are the lights warm LED or the ridiculously bright white used by Hitachi (I feel changing those could be a massive improvement to those trains).
Any automatic announcements added? After tinkering around for years, even northern have a half working automatic station announcement now. It’s not great but it’s at least consistently not great rather than random inaudible TMs making the announcements badly.
Do the personal overhead reading lights work? Many haven’t worked for a while but they’re potentially a great addition over most other uk trains. You even get those in coaches so not too much to expect these days.
Have they done anything to fix the internal doors closing on you when queuing to get out. That’s a very irritating “feature” of Voyagers. There was no sensor, they just closed on a timer regardless of whether you were stood or walking through the middle of them, often trapping you in their evil clutches. Flippin useless. Hope (but doubt) that’s been addressed.
Can anyone confirm or deny this? It’s one of my biggest bugbears…
There seems to be plenty of people complaining about the lack of mobile signal, however I’ve had trips on Voyagers where I’ve streamed music, video and work calls over the full journey from Leeds to Bristol (minor blip around Worcestershire). This has not been the case for a while, and I’ve struggled to get a signal a lot of times in the post couple of years.
That leads me to believe that the problem is with the network rather than the train. If the quality of signal has deteriorated but nothing on the train has changed, the problem must be the network. MVNOs are probably being squeezed out by Virgin Media who now own the O2 network. Tesco, GiffGaff etc are being deprioritised by O2, thus creating connection problems for many people.
That said, reception for all will improve without the window costing.
TT-ONR-NRN
Veteran Member
My Talkmobile network has become suddenly unusable in so many places and while travelling from Manchester to Oxford each week I now find my phone data is completely unusable once we’ve gone south of Coventry. I heard it might be due to an alleged recent ban on a Chinese mobile phone service supplier in the UK that most UK phone networks relied on, meaning almost everyone suddenly has poor data, but that’s not something I’ve looked into.
I did consider it might be this infamous “Voyager window film” though, combined with the rural landscape of southern Warwickshire and northern Oxfordshire.
For years (on Three now, for many years) I’ve had effectively zero mobile coverage on many journeys in the region between Plymouth and Glasgow. Additionally, it seems to stop GPS too which I don’t get on any other trains, my phone often hasn’t realised I’ve left my originating station despite hours and hundreds of miles having passed.
ValentaFan1974
Member
- Joined
- 8 Jul 2014
- Messages
- 393
The film on the windows blocking GPS and phone signal is not a myth. I believe the windows with the emergency escape writing on them in each carriage (either end) don’t have the film on them to allow them to shatter properly in the event of an emergency so you may find phone and GPS might work better in those spaces.
From my point of view, I really hope the film is removed on the refurbs as working on board is made worse at the moment when there are WiFi issues on the train and the 4G/5G signal cannot get through to allow us to do our jobs properly.
From my point of view, I really hope the film is removed on the refurbs as working on board is made worse at the moment when there are WiFi issues on the train and the 4G/5G signal cannot get through to allow us to do our jobs properly.
Internal doors. Almost certainly not.
But a design weakness that does need addressing.
ValentaFan1974
Member
- Joined
- 8 Jul 2014
- Messages
- 393
By the end of the month apparently
Bletchleyite
Veteran Member
Noticed this in Paul Bigland's blog:
Have the units been retrofitted with underfloor heating? This wasn't quoted as part of the refurb that I saw - any more information on this?
Have the units been retrofitted with underfloor heating? This wasn't quoted as part of the refurb that I saw - any more information on this?