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The Labour Party under Andy Burnham

brad465

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I think it’s easy to underestimate how big the draw of being PM is to these types. It’s like captaining a Champions League winning football team or being F1 World Drivers Champion.

Blackballing him would look very bad on Starmer surely? Burnham could still lose, Reform are going to throw everything they have at this now.
If I was in that constituency trying to derail Labour, I'd be voting FOR Burnham, knowing he is a liability trying to become PM from his current position outside parliament. Of course not every non-Labour voter will think that way.
 
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muz379

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Burnham could still lose, Reform are going to throw everything they have at this now.
As will the greens, going by the results at the General election in 2024 it is certainly going to be an interesting by-election and not an immediate shoe in for any party.
 

Thirteen

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If Burnham stood and won, surely he can't do both as he still has two years left of Mayor of Greater Manchester, Boris Johnson served as MP as well as Mayor of London but he only had a year left.
 

Topological

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It is a difficult challenge now for the Labour NEC.

Allow Burnham and there is a potential chain of events that builds to a new PM
Don't Allow Burnham and there is a clear storm of "running scared" that builds on the changes to local elections

From a Manchester perspective, I would still expect a Labour mayor. Perhaps not the landslide past elections have been, but Manchester will always be red.

(Someone is going to mention that there is a sky blue colour doing better these days, but then what colour are Reform?)
 
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If Burnham stood and won, surely he can't do both as he still has two years left of Mayor of Greater Manchester, Boris Johnson served as MP as well as Mayor of London but he only had a year left.
He would be disqualified from being the Mayor of Greater Manchester on becoming a member of the House of Commons (MP). Boris Johnson was both an MP and the Mayor of London for a year as the law allows someone to be both an MP and the Mayor of London.
 

Trackman

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George Galloway on X/twitter says he will stand for the worker's party if Burnham is the labour candidate.
All warming up nicely!
 

Harpo

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It’s not a great look for Labour when its rebels imply there’s so little strength in depth that they have no credible replacement for Starmer in the commons currently.

No threat to the ‘king’ til Birnam Wood come to Westminster? ;)
 
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Nicholas Lewis

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Starmer doesn't need the seat to control Commons of course but for all Reforms chutzpah I cant see them being able to take that seat if Burnham is selected being its in his manor of course. Also Burnham has to be selected and Starmer could block it with his chums in the NEC. That could risk internal civil war if he doesn't handle it well although he finally grew a backbone over Trumps outrageous NATO comments last week so perhaps we will see him digging in. The other problem with Burnham though is he is spend today worry about it after Ive gone politician and that could rock the bond markets. That philosophy is fine if you have a clean sheet but the UK doesn't and the recent history lesson of Truss should be enough to warn him of the perils of this approach.

Anyhow never a dull moment.
 

telstarbox

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jfollows

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He would be disqualified from being the Mayor of Greater Manchester on becoming a member of the House of Commons (MP). Boris Johnson was both an MP and the Mayor of London for a year as the law allows someone to be both an MP and the Mayor of London.
Yes, see my post above, https://www.railforums.co.uk/threads/the-labour-party-under-keir-starmer.272035/post-7642883

Police & Crime Commissioners can not also be MPs, and the Mayor of Manchester includes the PCC role.

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From https://www.theguardian.com/politic...om-byelection-race-by-labour-ruling-committee
Labour’s national executive committee has blocked Andy Burnham’s request to seek selection for the Gorton and Denton byelection, according to Labour sources.

The decision is likely to set off a ferocious row with allies of the Greater Manchester mayor.


Of the 10-strong “officers’ group” of the NEC, the vote went eight to one against Burnham, a Labour source said. The chair, the home secretary, Shabana Mahmood, abstained.

Under Labour rules, metro mayors and police and crime commissioners must seek the NEC’s permission to stand for parliament.

Burnham said on Saturday afternoon he wanted to contest the seat after the sitting MP, Andrew Gwynne, said he intended to stand down.

While he had won support for the bid from a series of cabinet ministers, allies of Keir Starmer warned against the disruption that could follow if Burnham, widely viewed as seeking to challenge the prime minister, re-entered parliament.

However, the decision to block him is likely to spark a huge backlash, with senior Labour figures including Ed Miliband, the energy secretary, and Lucy Powell, the party’s deputy leader, saying it would be wrong to block him.
I don’t think that Labour, its NEC in particular, sees any benefit in allowing him to stand, and having to contest the mayoral election, which will cost £££££ and either could be lost to Reform.
 
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Purple Train

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I don’t think that Labour, its NEC in particular, sees any benefit in allowing him to stand, and having to contest the mayoral election, which will cost £££££ and either could be lost to Reform.
There's no real "win" for Starmer in this situation, as you say. But obviously the optics of blocking his one realistic leadership challenger are appalling.
 

Bayum

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And he’s been blocked from standing.

Andy Burnham has been blocked from standing as a candidate for an upcoming parliamentary by-election in Gorton and Denton by Labour's ruling body.
As a directly elected mayor, Burnham had to get approval from Labour's national executive committee (NEC), after he applied to be a candidate on Saturday.
Some NEC members were concerned about an expensive mayoral election to replace Burnham, and allies of Prime Minister Sir Keir Starmer feared he could mount a leadership challenge, should he return to Westminster.
The move is likely to infuriate Labour MPs and some ministers who said local party members should have had the option of choosing the Greater Manchester mayor as the candidate.
The decision was made by 10 members of the NEC, including Home Secretary Shabana Mahmood on Sunday morning.
Earlier, she told the BBC allowing elected mayors to run as candidates in parliamentary by-elections had "organisational implications" for the party.
 

Topological

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Labour really do not like elections.

I guess they are already fielding a lot of comeback on the delayed local elections, so having another case in which they are not willing to put a decision to the people is not creating a new fire.
 

LNW-GW Joint

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The Guardian reports that there was only one vote for Burnham, with 8 against (Mahmood as chair abstained).
The last thing Labour needs is an internal personality fight.
 

brad465

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The Guardian reports that there was only one vote for Burnham, with 8 against (Mahmood as chair abstained).
The last thing Labour needs is an internal personality fight.
Given that margin of defeat for Burnham, his supporters don't really have a leg to stand on here. Had he lost by 1-2 votes it might have been a different story.
 

Topological

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Given that margin of defeat for Burnham, his supporters don't really have a leg to stand on here. Had he lost by 1-2 votes it might have been a different story.
The margin suggests that the NEC are loyal to the party, it says nothing of opinions on Sir Kier.

It was always going to be a very one-sided vote because if you had something like 6-3 or 5-4 either way then people would be pointing to division and dithering.

All this says is that the NEC agreed on which side they would all cast their votes.

If I was a suporter of Burnham then I would not be taking anything from the numbers.

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George Galloway on X/twitter says he will stand for the worker's party if Burnham is the labour candidate.
All warming up nicely!
Sad we will not get to see that now.

Galloway will have more chance against whoever Labour now choose, but there wont quite be the media circus. Will Galloway stand, or prove once again that he is just in it for attention?
 

ainsworth74

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Will Galloway stand, or prove once again that he is just in it for attention?
Is water wet? The thing that gets me is that he keeps finding groups of voters who seem to think: "Well every other constituency he's ended up winning he's used simply as a bully pulpit for his own benefit. But maybe we'll be different..."
 

Topological

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Is water wet? The thing that gets me is that he keeps finding groups of voters who seem to think: "Well every other constituency he's ended up winning he's used simply as a bully pulpit for his own benefit. But maybe we'll be different..."
It is the hope of being different, the hope that by Galloway winning it will bring the constituency into the public attention, that perhaps government will somehow divert resoureces to them.

It might actually work in this case, because it is Labour in power and this is a Labour seat. I never got why anyone would think a Galloway victory would make the Conservatives do anything though. Conservatives do not spend in these Labour constituencies whatever happens. But Labour might see bad optics in a noisy Galloway and might just aim to prevent him holding at the general election.

I am someone who would only vote for the big 3 parties anyway, so maybe I am not reading the rationale for voting Galloway right.
 

PGAT

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It is clear as day now that Labour have surrendered this seat to the Greens
 

jfollows

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Another London centric decision.
I think that anyone who cares about Manchester would rather see Burnham remain as its mayor, rather than fight (and possibly lose) a self-serving by-election and compel an election for a replacement mayor.
 

Topological

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I think that anyone who cares about Manchester would rather see Burnham remain as its mayor, rather than fight (and possibly lose) a self-serving by-election and compel an election for a replacement mayor.
Some would, some would not.

I have large interest in Manchester, but cannot see how it requires Burnham to be Mayor. Manchester needs a vision (it has one) and it needs to not get in the way of itself achieving that vision (it will never vote Reform).

Manchester has become an economic tanker, it is not going to turn based upon the name in the mayors office. Manchester will continue to grow and attract investment. Nobu et al. are not redefining the skyline because they like Andy Burnham.

You can actually make a reasonable argument for it being in Manchester's interests for Burnham to be PM.
 
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The following statement is a valid reason for not giving Andy Burnham permission to stand as the Labour candidate in the by-election.

But Labour said the party had decided to deny Burnham permission to stand to "avoid an unnecessary mayoral election, which would use substantial amounts of taxpayers' money and resources that are better spent tackling the cost-of-living crisis".
 

PGAT

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Some would, some would not.

I have large interest in Manchester, but cannot see how it requires Burnham to be Mayor. Manchester needs a vision (it has one) and it needs to not get in the way of itself achieving that vision (it will never vote Reform).

Manchester has become an economic tanker, it is not going to turn based upon the name in the mayors office. Manchester will continue to grow and attract investment. Nobu et al. are not redefining the skyline because they like Andy Burnham.

You can actually make a reasonable argument for it being in Manchester's interests for Burnham to be PM.
I would say regardless of the implications for Manchester it is quite poor optics on Burnham being a chancer with his career rather than being motivated by the greater good for the city.

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The following statement is a valid reason for not giving Andy Burnham permission to stand as the Labour candidate in the by-election.
Absolute rubbish. It’s clear that the actual reason is the NEC is filled with Starmer allies who aren’t going to allow someone to come in and threaten his leadership.
 

Topological

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I would say regardless of the implications for Manchester it is quite poor optics on Burnham being a chancer with his career rather than being motivated by the greater good for the city.

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Absolute rubbish. It’s clear that the actual reason is the NEC is filled with Starmer allies who aren’t going to allow someone to come in and threaten his leadership.
On the optics, if anyone thinks Burnham is anything other than a political chancer motivated by himself then there is something wrong with their thinking. The whole point of elected mayors is that they are politicians. Yes Burnham is from the area, but the whole Bee Network is all about putting himself out there. We had GMPTE long before bees.
 

Kite159

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It is clear as day now that Labour have surrendered this seat to the Greens
More to Reform, who make a bit more sense than the Greens and their 'do what I say not what I do' attitude. Although both options are as appealing as eating poo or drinking vomit.
 

Topological

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More to Reform, who make a bit more sense than the Greens and their 'do what I say not what I do' attitude. Although both options are as appealing as eating poo or drinking vomit.
Agreed on the last part. However, neither party will win the seat. Labour will hold with a reduced majority. The nature of the seat is such that part would go Green and part would go Reform, rather than there being a clear winner.

The only possible alternative would be if Galloway stood as the "not Labour" candidate. However, it looks like he will not be standing now it is not a vanity contest.
 

nr758123

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Agreed on the last part. However, neither party will win the seat. Labour will hold with a reduced majority. The nature of the seat is such that part would go Green and part would go Reform, rather than there being a clear winner.
The two halves of the seat are very different.

Brand Burnham would have been more popular than Brand UK Labour. Brand Tameside Labour, for reasons far too complex and long-standing to describe here, is about as toxic as toxic gets.

I can see the Greens doing well in the Gorton/Levenshulme part of the constituency, Reform doing well in Denton, and possibly whatever "stop Reform" vote there is in Denton going to the Greens.
 

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