New Birmingham to Manchester link proposed- post NPR

[bigmanaiq]

Following the cancellation of phase 2 of HS2, the government will tomorrow announce a new plan for a new Birmingham to Manchester link, but only after NPR has been built. Whether this will actually happen is something I remain skeptical on.

The government is set to announce its intention to build a new rail link between Birmingham and Manchester, the BBC understands.

Previous plans for the HS2 high-speed rail line had included a line between the two cities, but that part of the project was scrapped by Rishi Sunak's government.

On Wednesday, the government is also expected to confirm proposals for new and improved rail links across the North of England in a scheme known as Northern Powerhouse Rail (NPR).

Little detail about a new Birmingham to Manchester route is anticipated, other than the intention to build it after NPR is completed, meaning it may not happen for decades.”

New Birmingham-Manchester rail link to be proposed

Previous plans for a high-speed rail line between the cities were scrapped by Rishi Sunak's government.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Chris125]

Following the cancellation of phase 2 of HS2, the government will tomorrow announce a new plan for a new Birmingham to Manchester link, but only after NPR has been built. Whether this will actually happen is something I remain skeptical on

New Birmingham-Manchester rail link to be proposed

Previous plans for a high-speed rail line between the cities were scrapped by Rishi Sunak's government.

www.bbc.co.uk

It's inevitable, the question is simply how and when - hopefully this means keeping the legal powers for 2a, which will make it quicker and easier than starting from scratch.

 

[nr758123]

Following the cancellation of phase 2 of HS2, the government will tomorrow announce a new plan for a new Birmingham to Manchester link, but only after NPR has been built.

"Only after NPR is built" is code for "never".

 

[bigmanaiq]

"Only after NPR is built" is code for "never".

Willing to bet money they'll just announce NPR separately and announce this as that Birmingham-Manchester Airport LNWR keep insisting happen!

 

[YorkshireBear]

Probably can be linked back into the HS2 Phase 2A thread in speculative, because this definitely confirms nothing.

In other news, I will have Jam on Toast for breakfast tomorrow, so at least I will get some Jam tomorrow.

 

[Farigiraf]

Would be thrilled to see it happen, but currently any major rail project has a very good chance of being fully canned in 2029.

Given the amount of work to improve the Transpennine route lately, NPR would mostly be a way to serve Bradford and increase capacity, rather than providing a new high-speed route. Therefore I think the Liverpool-Manchester or HS2 Phase 2 should take priority, the former allowing two busy interurban railways to largely metroise, the latter allowing the one HSL that's already being built to realise its potential. Not that NPR doesn't have its place in the ideal high speed rail network, but if we wait for that to happen first then this announcement is, as other posters have put it, effectively worthless.

 

[Eladkram]

Can’t even get the Oxford - Cambridge line finished!

 

[Retorus]

Half of us'll be dead before it happens.

 

[aron2smith]

I really hope this country learns from this fiasco, would've been much cheaper to just stick to the original plan! Not good from a planning or logistical side of things and makes Britain look like a laughing stock. It definitely needs to be built but lessons must be learnt on future infrastructure delivery, as we need a ton of new infrastructure. A long term vision would help!

 

[a_c_skinner]

I suppose the simple logical appeal of build it to Crewe soon to get value from HS2 isn't "on"?

What is left of NPR? A Liverpool - Manchester line blowing most of the time savings on a detour via the airport? The rest seems simply transpennine upgrade with little new.

 

[Oxfordblues]

Half of us'll be dead before it happens.

I'm 73. My grandchildren might see it!

 

[wanderingriver]

If this gets built, hope they run a full route from Manchester to London along this route and along HS2. At this point though who bloody knows

 

[Andyh82]

What’s the point of announcing stuff that won’t happen for decades. How many changes of government and spending reviews will there be before then.

 

[Mikey C]

Can’t even get the Oxford - Cambridge line finished!

Can't even get the Bicester to Bletchley section open...

 

[MerlinRail 804]

Half of us'll be dead before it happens.

I’m 15 and I sometimes doubt if I’ll ever live to see it!

 

[Russel]

Yet more public money being wasted on announcing a project that will probably never happen, the only thing we can be sure of is millions will be spend on surveys and consultations.

I'd love to be proved wrong here though!

 

[GordonT]

What’s the point of announcing stuff that won’t happen for decades.

Political leaders of the incumbent party in power assume that announcing what are arguably pie in the sky projects will somehow increase their number of votes in the (English local authority) elections in May?

 

[JonathanH]

Political leaders of the incumbent party in power assume that announcing what are arguably pie in the sky projects will somehow increase their number of votes in the (English local authority) elections in May?

I don't think it is that. There are probably as many votes in cancelling major infrastructure projects, particularly ones that don't happen in the lifetime of a voter, as there are in saying they will happen in the next 50 years.

 

[bigmanaiq]

I really don’t see the point of it. Extra god knows how much of a billion to cancel it then probably stick to the alignment they we’re going to use in the first place. Farcical

 

[Worldwide]

What route is it likey to take?

 

[Northerngirl]

Until im sat on am 895 in a tunnel Until Manchester Airport I don't believe a word of what they say, how many times has this been announced now

 

[quantinghome]

Half of us'll be dead before it happens.

I appreciate the frustration with how long we take to build things, but isn't it actually a good sign if we're willing to start building things that our children will benefit from, even if we ourselves do not?

 

[a_c_skinner]

What’s the point of announcing stuff that won’t happen for decades. How many changes of government and spending reviews will there be before then.

Votes. For free. Doesn't matter if there are few. Labour have worked out the route is not through their heartlands.

 

[bigmanaiq]

What route is it likey to take?

All will be revealed tomorrow. I suspect the original HS2 one

 

[GRALISTAIR]

What’s the point of announcing stuff that won’t happen for decades. How many changes of government and spending reviews will there be before then.

That is what politicians do. Nevertheless, I look forward to the announcement with interest.

 

[Sir Felix Pole]

'Manchester Evening News' has the details now:-

NPR / HS2

Now, after years of false starts city leaders believe something has finally shifted. A new Liverpool-Manchester line will go ahead, along with a major step forward towards an underground Piccadilly station and the possible revival of a new Manchester-Birmingham route. It is a victory years in the making.


The announcement is part of a wider £1.1bn commitment to funding transport infrastructure across the north.


The plan for the Liverpool-Manchester route promises to cut journey times between the North West’s two biggest cities to as little as 35 minutes and increase the number and frequency of trains - something Andy Burnham says could turn Piccadilly Station into the ‘King’s Cross of the North’. Every bit as significant is the agreement of the government to consider running the lines into the station underground rather than overground.


The Manchester Evening News has long campaigned for a new Liverpool-Manchester route, along with an underground Piccadilly station and more routes south. This announcement offers up the potential that all three of those proposals could now be delivered.

However, the deal almost never happened.



The MEN understands that as late as last weekend civil servants were pushing for the train line into Piccadilly Station to be above ground, but City Council leader Bev Craig and Mayor Andy Burnham, supported by other Manchester leaders, refused to accept this.

 

[Fedupnorthern]

But what about the black hole? We are broke remember.

 

[LNW-GW Joint]

The BBC web site has some more detailed information about the NPR announcement.

Reeves vows rail plan will go ahead, despite cynicism

The scheme will be delivered in phases, starting with upgrades to lines between Leeds, York, Bradford and Sheffield.

www.bbc.co.uk

The government has set out its vision for major rail improvements across the north of England, which it says will transform the region and boost the UK economy, more than a decade after such a project was first proposed.
The multibillion pound scheme, known as Northern Powerhouse Rail (NPR), aims to deliver faster journeys and more frequent trains across the North through a combination of upgraded and new lines, and improvements to stations.
An initial £1.1bn has been earmarked for design and preparation. Construction is not expected to start until after 2030.
It will be delivered in phases, starting with upgrades to lines between Leeds, York, Bradford and Sheffield, the government said.
The second phase will be the building of a new route between Liverpool and Manchester, and the third will improve connections between Manchester and cities in Yorkshire, according to the outline of the plan.
The government said the "transformation" of travel in the North would shorten commutes and encourage investment across the region, adding up to £40bn to the British economy.

A notional provision of £45 billion is part of the funding envelope, but only the initial £1.1 billion is committed in this parliament.
A new Birmingham-Manchester line will follow all that, well into the 2040s.

 

[Andyh82]

The amount of times governments of various colours have announced things called ‘Northern Powerhouse Rail’ must be quite a high number by now.

Why don’t they just say they will invest 1.1bn in a clearly defined project rather than saying it’s part of a 45bn project that isn’t funded?

 

[Nottingham59]

DfT has posted about Northern Powerhouse Rail on X

We’re setting a new growth plan that will boost living standards across the North.

At the heart is Northern Powerhouse Rail, which will:
✅ reduce journey times, increase frequency and reliability
✅ connect people with better jobs
✅ improve access to new homes

New skilled jobs will be the immediate benefit of the project, supported by a £570m fund to invest in training and skills.

Stronger transport links between our major cities will help local communities thrive and harness the untapped potential of the region.

https://x.com/transportgovuk

Probably off topic, as it seems likely that they will do Liverpool-Manchester first. And quite right too.