London North Eastern Railway (LNER) First Class service

[mr williams]

Interesting thanks, I assumed that it would have been at privatization but just wanted to be sure.

IIRC Virgin kept the restaurants on breakfast for a while but lunch/dinner, as stated, was an almost instant casualty.

 

[lyesbkz]

Assuming this is not a commute of less than 70mins then you need to complain about this.

No it was around 95 mins, I have emailed their Customer Relations department so will see how they respond.

 

[premier01]

What? Better to Virgin's?

The "Mid-Morning" breakfast is definitely better than Virgin's. The "Great English Breakfast" also seems to be better. (Well, it would be difficult to make it any worse! :roll I still have high opinions of Virgin though because I always go for the delicious smoked salmon and scrambled eggs.

I travel on VT quite a lot and although not tried EC breakfast yet-this long discussion suggests it's very good-I find the VT breakfast to be excellent!

I travelled from Preston to London this morning-tea or coffee served within 2 mins-the coffee was good

then some grapefruit juice

then 2 pieces of hot toast served with butter and marmalade!

orders taken for hot food-more coffee served

Great British breakfast served-don't like black pudding but bacon full of flavour, thick cut although not fatty, the best bacon I've had for months, excellent sausage, well prepared fried egg, hot rosti potatoes and a juicy tomato-what more could u want-ok well fried bread and beans-yes had the too messy discussion but I like them with breakfast-but other than that an excellent breakfast.

Then offered extra breakfast items after about 15 mins!

Then another 3 servings of hot drinks-and journey time is only 2 hours 12 mins!
So if I was to try EC would that be better-if so must try it soon

 

[philjo]

One thing that east coast seem to forget as well is that many of thier customers it makes little difference if they pay for the meal or have it included in the ticket price. Most companies allow a £25 meal as part of the expensis policy if you are travelling and not expected to arrive home after 2000. So most people on the Edinburgh and Newcastle route may not have paid themselves, their employers may be happy (or maybe not as the need to buy and expense food in the evening)

This is true to an extent. Our daily expenses allowance is £15 if away for more than 10 hours & you will be returning home after 7pm (it is £10 if returning home before 7pm) This previously paid for a main course in the EC restaurant, I did this when coming back from a meeting in York in April.
We are not allowed 1st class travel any more (even when I have shown that a 1st advance is cheaper than standard on the same train!) so what I used to pay EC for food would now go to M&S (or eat early before the train or late when I get home) etc as you can't buy any meals from the standard cafe bar !

 

[Blindtraveler]

vT's coffee is better

 

[EltonRoad]

I travel on VT quite a lot and although not tried EC breakfast yet-this long discussion suggests it's very good-I find the VT breakfast to be excellent!

I travelled from Preston to London this morning-tea or coffee served within 2 mins-the coffee was good

then some grapefruit juice

then 2 pieces of hot toast served with butter and marmalade!

orders taken for hot food-more coffee served

Great British breakfast served-don't like black pudding but bacon full of flavour, thick cut although not fatty, the best bacon I've had for months, excellent sausage, well prepared fried egg, hot rosti potatoes and a juicy tomato-what more could u want-ok well fried bread and beans-yes had the too messy discussion but I like them with breakfast-but other than that an excellent breakfast.

Then offered extra breakfast items after about 15 mins!

Then another 3 servings of hot drinks-and journey time is only 2 hours 12 mins!
So if I was to try EC would that be better-if so must try it soon

I travelled on Virgin yesterday from Penrith 1621 to Euston on one of the Edinburgh Pendo's that went via Brum, so was interested to see what the food offering was.

Two servings of light bites (pre packed sandwiches or salad + cakes + fruit) up to Wolverhampton, then a hot meal after Coventry - gammon + new potatoes + cake + a beer + coffee.

All in all very good value indeed for £41.50 single. What more could you want?

Have yet to try EC, sounds like they should do what Virgin do ie hot food on all trains departing between 5 and 7. Light bites isn't enough.

 

[38Cto15E]

Tuesday 2nd August 1200hrs Highland Chieftain Kings Cross-Inverness

A very busy train with many passengers going to Edinburgh, for the Festival no doubt.
Tea and Coffee straight after departure, drinks before Hitchin, food before Huntingdon.
This menu had Beetroot Risotto as the only hot meal, so I had 5, only joking, no hot meal for me on the 8 hour journey.
The service was very good, the crew is an amalgam of London, Newcastle, Edinburgh and Inverness.
The service came around after departure, York, Newcastle, Edinburgh and Perth (twice)
The Inverness crew were particularly good, this is maybe because First does not have too many passengers over the Highland main line.
After Perth I went for the Salad dish which had become Wednesdays salad of Tuna salad nicoise, very nice with some good pourings of white wine.
Overall I had more than enough to eat and drink but not really a main meal.

Thursday 4th August 0952 hrs Aberdeen-London Kings Cross
Even though it is after 0930 this train is shown in the timetable as having the breakfast service to Dundee, again for me no great British breakfast, the girl told me that is only available on the earlier train (0752), but didn't somone mention that the HSTs had problems storing breakfasts overnight?
Between Aberdeen and Edinburgh there were only 2 staff serving First, I think they need at least 3.
On boarding, no newspapers or menus to go with the absent full brekkie, when the food trolley came around I ordered a Bacon buttie and asked for toast and marmalade.
This was an Oliver Twist moment, even though the menu shops you can have both, I was told that I could only have one.
I did not make a scene just waited until after Dundee for my toast and marmalade.
Some mis-guided person asked for a second cup of coffee, "Not until after Dundee!!!!" came the reply.
The breakfast menu illustrates the full breakfast, and orange juice and a coffee, from my experience of the Inverness and Aberdeen trains , no chance of getting all 3 together.
After Edinburgh the train filled up but with plenty of staff there was an excellent service en route to London.
After Newcastle I asked for the Quiche but there was none left, so again no hot meal just the always faithfull Tuna Salad Nicoise.
On arrival I felt that I had had enough food and drink but not a proper meal on the 7 hour journey.
A quick ps, I caught a Virgin Trains Voyager to Nuneaton, coffee after departure, the lady came around with scrap paper asking what passengers wanted, no menus, hot was Risotto (this follows me around, I had a tasteless not very well presented Beef sandwich, washed down with a G&T.
No complaints because my tickets were £25 ew Scotland and £14.50 for a peak time First Euston-Nuneaton, even if I did have to pay a Fiver to get back to Leicester.

 

[StrollerEd]

OK, time to give EC another try from Edinburgh/LKX same day return FC:

What morning trains are good for breakfast - 8am is preferred train otherwise

What return trains are good for food of any kind - was thinking of either 5pm or 6pm, but I see that there is a 5.30pm change at York train .. altho its a switch to XC
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Hasn't this gone on long enough?
Isn't it time for something a bit stronger to make the point?
A bit of national press publicity perhaps?
Unfortunately I'm not in a position to be able take part or to do anything about it but I'd have thought that the press would be interested to see, photograph and report on a group of first class passengers turning up at Kings Cross for an early evening service carrying various take away meals; pizza, Chinese, fish & chips, whatever.
Just a thought.

I'm planning a return from KX soon and wondered the same

 

[Blindtraveler]

wel the 17:00 KGX is an evening meal service, but perhaps your deliberately after the all day offer to see if its improved? Not sure about morning.

 

[ainsworth74]

All departures until the 08:30 will offer the full english (the 09:30 might but I'm not positive) after that until about 11:00 it will be a lighter version. Northbound the 17:00, 18:00, 18:30 and 19:00 offer the evening meal.

You can find annotated timetables (for weekdays) here (southbound) and here (northbound).

 

[DaveNewcastle]

OK, time to give EC another try from Edinburgh/LKX same day return FC:
. . . .
What return trains are good for food of any kind - was thinking of either 5pm or 6pm,

How about the 19:00 (used to terminate at Newcastle, but now at Edinburgh.

. . .
Isn't it time for something a bit stronger to make the point?
A bit of national press publicity perhaps?
. . .
Just a thought.

I'm planning a return from KX soon and wondered the same

Count me in!
I don't have any more 'appearances' in London booked in August (a quiet month for work) but it could be a laugh. But rather than turn up at the door with a pizza etc., wouldn't it be good a photo opp to 'bring our own chef' in full whites carrying a turine of soup as we carry our own soup owls and bread rolls on board?

 

[philjo]

Out of interest, what is the hot dish (if it materialises) being served on the all day menu next Monday? I will be on the 14:52 from Aberdeen to Stevenage (having had lunch in Aberdeen first!). Will be going north on the Chieftain on Saturday. (on the £25 FC flat fare)

 

[YorkshireRider]

Goats cheese and red onion tart

 

[HST Power]

I going from Newcastle to London Kings Cross next Monday in First Class, travelling on a 9:30am service. What sort of food can I expect?

 

[ainsworth74]

I going from Newcastle to London Kings Cross next Monday in First Class, travelling on a 9:30am service. What sort of food can I expect?

Too late for a full breakfast so it will be things like bacon sarnies, toast, I think croissants, and I think there is a smoked salmon dish as well.

 

[EltonRoad]

According to this week's Railway Herald:

---

There has been a 29% increase in the number of EC First Class journeys in the 4 weeks up to 23 July, compared to the same period last year.

First Class journey numbers are up by 24% since May; the new complimentary offer came in on 22 May.

First Class journeys increased by just 3% in the entire year from April 2010 to March 2011.

---

Is this good news? Not much incentive to change ...

 

[Greenback]

The publicity generated by the new first class offer plus the £25 offer will probably have something to do with the increase.

 

[Skimble19]

According to this week's Railway Herald:

---

There has been a 29% increase in the number of EC First Class journeys in the 4 weeks up to 23 July, compared to the same period last year.

First Class journey numbers are up by 24% since May; the new complimentary offer came in on 22 May.

First Class journeys increased by just 3% in the entire year from April 2010 to March 2011.

---

Is this good news? Not much incentive to change ...

It's very good news.. This isn't going to be scrapped, people need to get over that. However, it will be refined, which is all it needs.. Personally, I think a couple of "simple" things like Burgers and Chips should be added - maybe they will eventually... who knows.

 

[blackfive460]

It's very good news..

It could be very, very good news if the increase isn't sustained and the next quarter shows an equal drop due to new FC passengers, having tried it deciding never again plus those of us now choosing standard.

This isn't going to be scrapped, people need to get over that.

I agree, corporate bodies making unpopular changes will rarely admit to being wrong.

However, it will be refined, which is all it needs.. Personally, I think a couple of "simple" things like Burgers and Chips should be added - maybe they will eventually... who knows.

The obvious one would be an all day breakfast as it's something that is already done, just extend the hours it's available until say 2 o'clock.

 

[bnm]

I agree, corporate bodies making unpopular changes will rarely admit to being wrong.

You'll find corporate bodies are quick to admit they are wrong when the bottom line starts being affected.

New Coke anyone? Or a free holiday from Hoover? Some cr*p jewellery from Ratners?

That said, East Coast is not a corporate body but a state owned train company. I personally think they'll stick with the current set-up, hopefully ironing out the teething problems, until the keys are handed to a new franchise operator in December 2013.

 

[Greenback]

It's the bottom line that matters. I've always said that if the first class revenue doesn't improve, then the catering offer will be amended, but probably not in the way that most people would like!

I think the important thing here is whether revenue has increased as much as the journeys. If this is a temporary thing with people taking advantage of the very cheap tickets and wanting to try the new service for themselves, it's going to take a while before EC will know what the longer term trends are.

 

[cuccir]

Yes, I don't see how a meaningful comparison can be made during the initial launch or the £25 ticket period. The real 'acid test' for this service will be from September to Christmas, when the offers and summer holidays are over - so fewer passengers who might fancy the occasional treat - and a truer test of first class's 'core business'

 

[StrollerEd]

I've been bought the Scottish Exec package for a same weekday return from Edinburgh departing 08:00 with return journey from London Kings Cross at 18:00.

Recall earlier discussion from other business travellers that this is a long day - leave house at 07:30 with prospect of return at 23:00 - a workday total of 15.5 hours, so I require feeding even if I stuff myself at lunch.


Elaine (if you or colleagues are listening) this is a ball breaker for future custom as FC passenger with EC given that I have good access to London City Airport (London riots excepted which affect all routes into London).

I will report back.

 

[rmt-driver]

Can someone tell me where is the best part of FC to sit in to get the most free booze/food

The end nearest the guards van, or the end nearest the kitchen/buffet?

 

[DaveNewcastle]

Usually, I'd say that the best service is nearest the kitchen.

Actually, I'm sure the staff treat everyone equally, however, as most of the Advance Tickets come with Reservations in coach 'M' (nearest the DVT) then the service is going to be much less personal and with less space for you to spread out back there, also, as most (but not all) crews start serving frm the kitchen end, then if there are shortages or a very busy service, you might find the options have diminished by the time they get to 'M'.

 

[rmt-driver]

Usually, I'd say that the best service is nearest the kitchen.

Actually, I'm sure the staff treat everyone equally, however, as most of the Advance Tickets come with Reservations in coach 'M' (nearest the DVT) then the service is going to be much less personal and with less space for you to spread out back there, also, as most (but not all) crews start serving frm the kitchen end, then if there are shortages or a very busy service, you might find the options have diminished by the time they get to 'M'.

That is what I thought. I have changed my ticket reservation preferances to be seated in the quiet couch or middle FC coach.. THank you
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
It will be my first time on a midweek since they changed. My other journey only being a weekend FC return trip (since the changes).

So my main concern is I just want some decent grub (NOT a sandwich) and about 4 glasses of wine and a couple of GnT's.. My journey is Kings X to Donny, out at about 2pm returning at about 3pm (not the same day obviously)..... will I be disappointed?

 

[gordonthemoron]

probably

 

[bengolding]

So my main concern is I just want some decent grub (NOT a sandwich) and about 4 glasses of wine and a couple of GnT's.. My journey is Kings X to Donny, out at about 2pm returning at about 3pm (not the same day obviously)..... will I be disappointed?

On my few recent EC journeys, the staff generally say only one alcoholic drink per trolley run is permitted. Virgin tend to be more generous largely as loadings in First are lower. I find EC staff also pour drinks for you, e.g. G&Ts to prevent customers taking them with them.

 

[DaveNewcastle]

All the more reason for you to sit in the (relatively empty) coach 'K', so that you can easily walk next door to the Buffet counter (where you can queue and pay like all the STD class pax) 'cos you certainly won't be happy with the First Class offering !

 

[Greenback]

So my main concern is I just want some decent grub (NOT a sandwich) and about 4 glasses of wine and a couple of GnT's.. My journey is Kings X to Donny, out at about 2pm returning at about 3pm (not the same day obviously)..... will I be disappointed?

probably

Definitely! I don't think there is any decent grub at 2 or 3pm