UK switching to electric vehicles discussion

[GLC]

I was quoted £9k to fit a new engine to my EV after 8 years. Flogged it to WBAC and bought another instead

 

[Bletchleyite]

I was quoted £9k to fit a new engine to my EV after 8 years. Flogged it to WBAC and bought another instead

Do you mean electric motor? EVs don't have engines. If it had an engine it wasn't an EV.

 

[GLC]

it's one of those EVs with an engine in it

 

[Bletchleyite]

it's one of those EVs with an engine in it

A hybrid? I suppose these are sometimes called PHEVs but I see that as a bit of a gimmick

Maybe we should call them bi-modes

 

[GLC]

It's a range extender BMW i3, so the engine never turns the wheels, it acts purely as a generator for the motor/battery. Which means it's eligible for all the EV grants, it just isn't a zero emission EV.

 

[Ted633]

In the last few years I’ve had the following go on my (now) 6 yearish old diesel with average miles

Glow plugs
Control relay for emissions monitoring
aircon evaporator
exhaust gas recirculation unit
Boot seals on the gearbox
Brake discs all round

Thats a toral of £4k.

And apparently none of these are uncommon.

Of course the aircon and brakes could go in an EV, but the others couldn‘t. And I‘d expect the brake discs to be used somewhat less in an EV.

Thats really not great for a 6 year old car IMO, especially having to change all the discs!
But maybe I was lucky with my previous car

Bought on 34,000 in 2012 until it died in 2023 on 216,000

Non-Routine costs (majority of work undertaken by myself, so saves on labour):
EGR Valve (£120)
Front Anti-Roll bar links (£20 each)
Rear Suspension Arm & spring (+ 4 wheel alignment / tracking - £400)
Front & rear pads were changed once (£40 per pair, discs were original to the end)
Fuel Injector x 1 (£120)

A 2nd injector failed 6 months after the first. So really, at that point i needed to replace all the remaining ones. Along with the timing belt being well overdue and the alternator making a very funny noise, it was at this point i called time and scrapped it.

Shows how much different cars vary in reliability and repair costs. I’d expect EVs to be similar to be honest, with some being ultra-reliable and others being an absolute pain.

 

[styles]

Thats really not great for a 6 year old car IMO, especially having to change all the discs!
But maybe I was lucky with my previous car

Well that really depends on how many miles the vehicles have done, rather than how old they are (for the most part).

Shows how much different cars vary in reliability and repair costs. I’d expect EVs to be similar to be honest, with some being ultra-reliable and others being an absolute pain.

And also in how they're driven. Drivers who plan ahead and ease off the gas rather than using the brakes will have discs and pads which last longer. Glow plugs will last longer for someone using their diesel for long journeys starting in Cambridge than somebody using theirs for the same number of miles but more short journeys starting in Aviemore. Etc.

In fact, I think I've known a few people who have bought diesels not realising they're not ideal for short commutes in built-up areas. Inevitably the DPFs become an issue. On the diesel I bought two years ago (nearly 12 years old), the DPF light was on when I bought it. Some DPF cleaner fluid and an Italian tune-up, and then predominantly being used for quite long 60mph+ journeys for 2 years and it hasn't come back on since.

 

[Mawkie]

Of course the aircon and brakes could go in an EV, but the others couldn‘t. And I‘d expect the brake discs to be used somewhat less in an EV.

Given the strength of Tesla's regenerative braking system, the friction brakes are rarely used. So whilst pads and discs are not being replaced for very long periods, the lack of use can lead to other problems such as seizure of components or rusting of discs. Tesla have a 'burnishing the brakes' section in their manual to ameliorate this.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 14 Nov 2025 ==

Thats really not great for a 6 year old car IMO, especially having to change all the discs!
But maybe I was lucky with my previous car

Bought on 34,000 in 2012 until it died in 2023 on 216,000

Non-Routine costs (majority of work undertaken by myself, so saves on labour):
EGR Valve (£120)
Front Anti-Roll bar links (£20 each)
Rear Suspension Arm & spring (+ 4 wheel alignment / tracking - £400)
Front & rear pads were changed once (£40 per pair, discs were original to the end)
Fuel Injector x 1 (£120)

A 2nd injector failed 6 months after the first. So really, at that point i needed to replace all the remaining ones. Along with the timing belt being well overdue and the alternator making a very funny noise, it was at this point i called time and scrapped it.

I would say you were very lucky.

More modern cars have so many sensors and internal management systems that it's often difficult or impossible to replace parts yourself.

I knew the days of the home mechanic were numbered when I discovered it wasn't possible to replace the 12v battery on my previous car without "getting it coded to the car", for which I needed software I didn't have access to.

 

[geoffk]

Fuel duty going up by a staged increase while rail fares freeze seems to be the first nod away from the car lobby in a long time (if ever). Obviously pay per mile for electric cars will be seen as a problem, though personally I think this should have been applied to all vehicles to replace fuel duty.

How will the electric vehicle charge be calculated? Will EV drivers have to submit a mileage return every year? Or perhaps a black box will be fitted. So far, I've not found anything which sets out the method to be used.

 

[jfollows]

How will the electric vehicle charge be calculated? Will EV drivers have to submit a mileage return every year? Or perhaps a black box will be fitted. So far, I've not found anything which sets out the method to be used.

A guess: https://www.independent.co.uk/cars/...-mile-rachel-reeves-budget-2025-b2869615.html

There’s no confirmation yet on how the new EV Excise Duty scheme will work, but it’s likely to rely on us recording and submitting our own mileage to the DVLA rather than any form of digital scheme that would make charging seamless.

What’s being proposed?​

Under the plan, BEV drivers would be asked to estimate their annual mileage and pay an upfront levy of 3p per mile, called Electric Vehicle Excise Duty, in addition to the current Vehicle Excise Duty which currently stands at £10 for the first year and £195 thereafter.

Using that figure, the Treasury estimates the average EV driver – travelling some 8,900 miles a year – could pay around £279 a year from 2028.


Crucially, the system is intended to avoid real-time tracking of vehicles. Instead, the idea is that drivers estimate how far they will drive and pay the 3p/mile in advance. If they drive fewer miles the balance rolls over; if they exceed the estimate they pay more.

Anything involving real time tracking seems doomed to failure to me. Obviously people might lie.

 

[Class73Electro]

A guess: https://www.independent.co.uk/cars/...-mile-rachel-reeves-budget-2025-b2869615.html


Anything involving real time tracking seems doomed to failure to me. Obviously people might lie.

Well I'm sure that's going to go well...

 

[Topological]

Perhaps we could employ 18-21 year olds to follow each EV and record mileage. That will address multiple concerns.

Logic dictates services and MOTs as tax points. If someone wants to drive their car so little it never needs servicing, then they don't really need to pay tax.

However, like so many taxes, benefits and other policies, there are bound to be inefficiencies with this one too.

 

[Kite159]

How will the electric vehicle charge be calculated? Will EV drivers have to submit a mileage return every year? Or perhaps a black box will be fitted. So far, I've not found anything which sets out the method to be used.

Or how it will take into account any mileage driven away from UK roads, ie if someone takes their car abroad for a driving holiday in Europe.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Roads is a difficult one, but it is only domestic electricity for charging EVs that does not have a point of sale.

Which is how most EV charging takes place as it's the cheapest and most convenient way. Thus for EVs some form of road pricing is the only way, and I think it's quite right that drivers should contribute to the cost of roads because without drivers you'd not need roads, you'd just need 2 metre wide cycle paths built to a far lower standard.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Nov 2025 ==

Or how it will take into account any mileage driven away from UK roads, ie if someone takes their car abroad for a driving holiday in Europe.

Very easy to submit your mileage on exit and on return. A simple bureaucratic procedure at a ferry port.

 

[Topological]

Or how it will take into account any mileage driven away from UK roads, ie if someone takes their car abroad for a driving holiday in Europe.

Although I have an EV, I cannot be too upset with it being 3p per mile the vehicle does. It probably balances with the vehicles paying tax in other countries using the UK roads.

I do have a problem with taxing EVs while we want people to switch to using them. But I can understand that the government needs to appease the internal combustion lobby and EV users do get an easier ride on tax.

 

[Harpo]

Anything involving real time tracking seems doomed to failure to me. Obviously people might lie.

Perhaps a black box OTMR style that also legally monitors driving standards compliance. Two birds, one stone.

 

[HSTEd]

I personally think it would have been best to introduce the road use charge on all vehicles and cut fuel duty by a concomitant amount.

I assume self report with validation at MOTs is the way it will go, but given the government I would not exclude an orwellian panopticon.

 

[gabrielhj07]

Perhaps a black box OTMR style that also legally monitors driving standards compliance. Two birds, one stone.

Good heavens what a terrible idea.

I assume you’ve not had the pleasure of insurance black boxes penalising drivers for (among other things) harsh braking while avoiding a collision or excessive cornering forces (using a roundabout)?

 

[Topological]

Good heavens what a terrible idea.

I assume you’ve not had the pleasure of insurance black boxes penalising drivers for (among other things) harsh braking while avoiding a collision or excessive cornering forces (using a roundabout)?

It appears cars record a lot anyway.

This case from Wales highlights just what cars can know: BBC Article on Identifying Driver Behaviour

"Because the airbags in the Polo deployed, we knew that probably that car's stored some data about what happened in the five seconds leading up to that collision," Sgt Raine said.

The team used a specialist retrieval system to access the airbag control module – where a snapshot of electronic data, triggered by the crash, revealed speeds, accelerator position, steering wheel angle and brake pedal application.

"It's data that links directly to what the person is doing to the controls of the car. And it tells us exactly what their manner of driving was prior to the collision," Sgt Raine said.

It is only a matter of keeping that recording going longer and you have a lot more than insurance boxes offer.

 

[gabrielhj07]

Post-crash maybe, but what business does the govt have accessing this data in the manner suggested?

 

[Harpo]

Good heavens what a terrible idea.

I assume you’ve not had the pleasure of insurance black boxes penalising drivers for (among other things) harsh braking while avoiding a collision or excessive cornering forces (using a roundabout)?

No worries for anyone who drives legally and reasonably. If it results in increased risk cost for poorer drivers that’s good news for those suffering increased premiums due to others.

 

[Richard Scott]

I do have a problem with taxing EVs while we want people to switch to using them. But I can understand that the government needs to appease the internal combustion lobby and EV users do get an easier ride on tax.

No, we don't, you might and some others may but I don't want an EV. I have nowhere to charge it at home or work.

 

[jon0844]

How will the electric vehicle charge be calculated? Will EV drivers have to submit a mileage return every year? Or perhaps a black box will be fitted. So far, I've not found anything which sets out the method to be used.

Personally, I think it's going to be hard to manage and there will be many people finding ways to reverse or hack the mileages. If there needs to be extra hardware fitted to the vehicle, that's going to be expensive. If it relies on reading the car mileage, what about people driving on private land, abroad etc? It seems like a very messy and complicated idea.

I would have simply seen to increase the current VED to be for electric vehicles, and based either on motor efficiency (average), battery size, vehicle weight or a combination thereof. You could then encourage people to buy smaller, lighter, efficient EVs and not massive SUVs with huge batteries to give long range but doing only 2-3 miles per kWh (and maybe even less). In the future, surely this will be an important metric as all cars will eventually be electric, or hybrid.

Plus, surely the Government should have brought the scheme in for all cars so as not to put people off buying an electric car. Even though those doing an average of 4-5,000 miles per year aren't going to be paying that much - the optics aren't good. Also, Labour should be saying how they're going to find ways to allow EV owners who can't charge at home alternatives like on-street charging that can be billed back to someone's home account, allowing them to enjoy standard rate (or even discounted) unit costs. You could limit how many 'miles of charging' each household could do (to prevent fraud by charging other cars) and all sorts of things, and wouldn't it have been smarter to talk about this at the same time so people could still see a benefit of switching?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Nov 2025 ==

I do have a problem with taxing EVs while we want people to switch to using them. But I can understand that the government needs to appease the internal combustion lobby and EV users do get an easier ride on tax.

If they introduced it for ALL cars, it wouldn't be fuelling the online anti-EV brigade that have already been using this as ammunition to attack EVs for weeks when the rumours first surfaced. It seems like a lot of hassle (especially the weird way they intend to collect it) that is doing harm to EV sales because the optics look terrible - even if the average EV owner won't be paying that much.

Labour needs to work out how to 'spin' things because they manage to make things look worse than they are, and make things so easy for the media to then attack Labour as a result.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Nov 2025 ==

Post-crash maybe, but what business does the govt have accessing this data in the manner suggested?

In the USA, I think it was GM that was secretly sharing data with insurance companies on driving habits as recorded by the onboard systems and I wouldn't be surprised if others aren't doing it too.

 

[JamesT]

Personally, I think it's going to be hard to manage and there will be many people finding ways to reverse or hack the mileages. If there needs to be extra hardware fitted to the vehicle, that's going to be expensive. If it relies on reading the car mileage, what about people driving on private land, abroad etc? It seems like a very messy and complicated idea.

I would have simply seen to increase the current VED to be for electric vehicles, and based either on motor efficiency (average), battery size, vehicle weight or a combination thereof. You could then encourage people to buy smaller, lighter, efficient EVs and not massive SUVs with huge batteries to give long range but doing only 2-3 miles per kWh (and maybe even less). In the future, surely this will be an important metric as all cars will eventually be electric, or hybrid.

Plus, surely the Government should have brought the scheme in for all cars so as not to put people off buying an electric car. Even though those doing an average of 4-5,000 miles per year aren't going to be paying that much - the optics aren't good. Also, Labour should be saying how they're going to find ways to allow EV owners who can't charge at home alternatives like on-street charging that can be billed back to someone's home account, allowing them to enjoy standard rate (or even discounted) unit costs. You could limit how many 'miles of charging' each household could do (to prevent fraud by charging other cars) and all sorts of things, and wouldn't it have been smarter to talk about this at the same time so people could still see a benefit of switching?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Nov 2025 ==



If they introduced it for ALL cars, it wouldn't be fuelling the online anti-EV brigade that have already been using this as ammunition to attack EVs for weeks when the rumours first surfaced. It seems like a lot of hassle (especially the weird way they intend to collect it) that is doing harm to EV sales because the optics look terrible - even if the average EV owner won't be paying that much.

Labour needs to work out how to 'spin' things because they manage to make things look worse than they are, and make things so easy for the media to then attack Labour as a result.

I don't think they care about driving on private land or abroad. Reading the mileage every year and using a flat rate per mile is the simplest way to implement this.

The offsetting for many EV drivers will presumably be the removal of various levies from the electricity bill, reducing the cost of charging.

 

[adc82140]

There will be no black boxes. Mileage will be recorded at MOT stations and submitted to the government for invoicing. What happens in the first 3 years I don't know. I'm irked by this, I drive a plug in hybrid, and do about 6000 miles a year in France. Apparently I'll still owe UK Gov for this, even though I'm not using UK roads, but paying French tolls.

Never mind the fact that I rarely plug it in, so the battery charge is from petrol I've already paid duty on. It's double taxation.

 

[gabrielhj07]

No worries for anyone who drives legally and reasonably. If it results in increased risk cost for poorer drivers that’s good news for those suffering increased premiums due to others.

Who decides ‘reasonably’? If I drop the anchors and avoid a crash in doing so, will I be penalised for agressive braking?

In the USA, I think it was GM that was secretly sharing data with insurance companies on driving habits as recorded by the onboard systems and I wouldn't be surprised if others aren't doing it too.

Only if your cars are young enough to be riddled with computers!

There will be no black boxes. Mileage will be recorded at MOT stations and submitted to the government for invoicing. What happens in the first 3 years I don't know. I'm irked by this, I drive a plug in hybrid, and do about 6000 miles a year in France. Apparently I'll still owe UK Gov for this, even though I'm not using UK roads, but paying French tolls.

Never mind the fact that I rarely plug it in, so the battery charge is from petrol I've already paid duty on. It's double taxation.

Is this official?

 

[Bletchleyite]

Never mind the fact that I rarely plug it in, so the battery charge is from petrol I've already paid duty on. It's double taxation.

That's driving desirable behavioural change. It would be better if you did plug it in, as that would reduce emissions in urban areas for short journeys, so hopefully this situation will change your behaviour so you do.

 

[JamesT]

That's driving desirable behavioural change. It would be better if you did plug it in, as that would reduce emissions in urban areas for short journeys, so hopefully this situation will change your behaviour so you do.

I also note that PHEVs have a lower rate of 1.5p/mile, to account for some mileage being on taxed fuel.

 

[weeklycommuter]

Fuel duty going up by a staged increase while rail fares freeze seems to be the first nod away from the car lobby in a long time (if ever). Obviously pay per mile for electric cars will be seen as a problem, though personally I think this should have been applied to all vehicles to replace fuel duty.

The details of the staged increase in fuel duty and the rail fares freeze are in the following paragraphs of the Budget Report.

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6926eb102a37784b16ecf525/E03444720_Budget_2025_Web_Accessible.pdf

4.4 Fuel duty: 2026-27 main rates – The government will extend the temporary 5p fuel duty cut for a further five months, with the cut being reversed in three stages: 1p on 1 September 2026, 2p on 1 December 2026 and 2p on 1 March 2027. This will return rates to pre-March 2022 levels. The planned inflation increase for 2026-27 will not take place, with the government uprating fuel duty rates by Retail Prices Index (RPI) from April 2027.

4.7 Rail fares freeze – The government is freezing all regulated rail fares in England for one year starting from March 2026. This means passengers will not see any changes in the price of season tickets, peak return fares for commuters and off‑peak returns between major cities until March 2027.

 

[Cdd89]

The EV mileage charge is the worst thing from this announcement. I know someone who was on the fence about buying an EV (i.e. resistant, but running out of excuses, since they have a driveway and never do >200mi r/t). They're now determined not to buy one. Yes, they would still save money relative to a petrol car, but you're dealing with stubbornness and the tax being separately visible, not pure logic. It should have been deferred until we were further along the transition.