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First West of England (Bristol, Bath & The West)

markymark2000

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The issue of changing not in the Centre is because, I believe, the issue of vehicles being parked up
Would it not therefore be better to terminate more services at Broadmead? Even if they still start at The Centre, it would scrap this silly situation where you can be sat around for ages waiting for a driver swap 1 stop before the terminus? It's not exactly unusual for buses in major cities to terminate in a slightly different location to where they start.
 
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freetoview33

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Would it not therefore be better to terminate more services at Broadmead? Even if they still start at The Centre, it would scrap this silly situation where you can be sat around for ages waiting for a driver swap 1 stop before the terminus? It's not exactly unusual for buses in major cities to terminate in a slightly different location to where they start.
Broadmead won't exist next year!
 

The exile

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Would it not therefore be better to terminate more services at Broadmead? Even if they still start at The Centre, it would scrap this silly situation where you can be sat around for ages waiting for a driver swap 1 stop before the terminus? It's not exactly unusual for buses in major cities to terminate in a slightly different location to where they start.
It wouldn't actually change anything for the better (except for those people currently "caught out" by the driver change) - if you're travelling through to the Centre (particularly if you're then walking a bit further) you currently might have to wait a bit before your bus takes you there. If the bus terminated at Broadmead, you'd either have further to walk (and the walk is not particularly pleasant) or have to get (and potentially pay for) a second bus. Far better to arrange things so that drivers are already waiting when the bus they're taking over arrives!
 

markymark2000

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It wouldn't actually change anything for the better (except for those people currently "caught out" by the driver change) - if you're travelling through to the Centre (particularly if you're then walking a bit further) you currently might have to wait a bit before your bus takes you there. If the bus terminated at Broadmead, you'd either have further to walk (and the walk is not particularly pleasant) or have to get (and potentially pay for) a second bus. Far better to arrange things so that drivers are already waiting when the bus they're taking over arrives!
How far ahead of time should the second driver arrive though? Most routes are loosely timed to give enough leeway incase the motorway is busy. If the motorway is clear though and the bus gets in 12 minutes early, you can't expect drivers to sit at the stop 10 minutes before the scheduled departure time just in case.

And yes, it's not ideal having passengers walk the extra from Broadmead to The Centre, but it's better than half of the time sitting around at The Centre not having a clue what is going on or knowing how long they will be sat waiting. Especially when most of the drivers dump the bus and wander off without a single interaction with passengers. I'm sure most passengers would you rather a predictable walk, than an unpredictable sitting around 10 minutes (maybe more if the relieving driver is late for whatever reason) a single stop from the routes terminus?

It'd be no different to how Liverpool was where buses terminated on Water Street, had their layover and ran dead to James Street to start the next trip for example.
 

The exile

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Which comes back to the issue of services arriving over 10 minutes early for a driver change on Monday/Friday as the timetables accommodate mid-week traffic.
Assuming the Broadmead stops are timing points then the buses would still have to wait - driver change or no. Time to recognise the “new normal” with different timetables on Monday & Friday perhaps (without detriment to those who still have to travel)
 

Marcus Fryer

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Assuming the Broadmead stops are timing points then the buses would still have to wait - driver change or no. Time to recognise the “new normal” with different timetables on Monday & Friday perhaps (without detriment to those who still have to travel)
Another alternative would be to make Broadmead ‘set down only’ for buses terminating at the Centre (m3, m4, T1, Y1 and Y2), so if they are running early (and after changing drivers if required) they could continue without ‘waiting for time’.
 

The exile

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Another alternative would be to make Broadmead ‘set down only’ for buses terminating at the Centre (m3, m4, T1, Y1 and Y2), so if they are running early (and after changing drivers if required) they could continue without ‘waiting for time’.
Good idea!
 

markymark2000

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Assuming the Broadmead stops are timing points then the buses would still have to wait - driver change or no.
Routes Y1/Y2, T1, M3 and M4 (the ones which use the motorway but terminate at The Centre), do not have Broadmead as a timing point.

Another alternative would be to make Broadmead ‘set down only’ for buses terminating at the Centre (m3, m4, T1, Y1 and Y2), so if they are running early (and after changing drivers if required) they could continue without ‘waiting for time’.
Wouldn't make any difference because it's not a timing point. Any relieving driver can already just continue the trip when they get to the bus. However, this doesn't solve the problem that there is reportedly insufficient space at The Centre for all of the layovers. The only way to satisfy driver changes at Broadmead, passengers not sitting around for a significant amount of time 1 stop before the termini, and also not put more strain on The Centre for parking, is to move the terminus to Broadmead, or make the routes cross city with layover/scheduled recovery time at Broadmead (as per M1)
 

The exile

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Routes Y1/Y2, T1, M3 and M4 (the ones which use the motorway but terminate at The Centre), do not have Broadmead as a timing point.


Wouldn't make any difference because it's not a timing point. Any relieving driver can already just continue the trip when they get to the bus. However, this doesn't solve the problem that there is reportedly insufficient space at The Centre for all of the layovers. The only way to satisfy driver changes at Broadmead, passengers not sitting around for a significant amount of time 1 stop before the termini, and also not put more strain on The Centre for parking, is to move the terminus to Broadmead, or make the routes cross city with layover/scheduled recovery time at Broadmead (as per M1)
Of these, the long wait one stop before the terminus is the least of the evils- it just needs to be communicated to passengers so that they know what’s what.
 

-Colly405-

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Routes Y1/Y2, T1, M3 and M4 (the ones which use the motorway but terminate at The Centre), do not have Broadmead as a timing point.


Wouldn't make any difference because it's not a timing point. Any relieving driver can already just continue the trip when they get to the bus. However, this doesn't solve the problem that there is reportedly insufficient space at The Centre for all of the layovers. The only way to satisfy driver changes at Broadmead, passengers not sitting around for a significant amount of time 1 stop before the termini, and also not put more strain on The Centre for parking, is to move the terminus to Broadmead, or make the routes cross city with layover/scheduled recovery time at Broadmead (as per M1)
Or move the driver changeover to Lewins Mead (first stop outbound) like on some m1 journeys
Of these, the long wait one stop before the terminus is the least of the evils- it just needs to be communicated to passengers so that they know what’s what.
Even if communicated well, expecting passengers to sit in a dark (saloon lights off) cold (engine & heating off) bus for over 10 minutes is not customer friendly...

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

For those interested, the plans for the improvement works on Bradley Stoke Way originally showed that the stop known as 'Webbs Wood Roundabout' used by the T1 (and Stagecoach's 71) was being permanently closed to allow the road layout changes. Driving past earlier, there appears to be a new set of bus stop kerbing and pavement changes there so I am presuming the stop will reopen in due course once the road has, and is not now permanently closed.

For clarity, the "Webbs Wood" (sic) stops are the metrobus ones before the roundabout heading northbound and southbound. The northbound non-metrobus one *after* the roundabout (opposite the southbound metrobus Webbs Wood one) is "Webbs Wood Roundabout".
 
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nick291

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Or move the driver changeover to Lewins Mead (first stop outbound) like on some m1 journeys
I am fairly certain they used to do this for the T1/Y1/Y2 last year when I had to use it for regular commuting. Don't know why it's changed, could be something to do with the timetable/route changes on the Y1/Y2/Y6
 

nick291

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Listening to music on spotify & an ad from First West of England popped up advertising the 36. Great concept of advertising, however as someone whose been on the 36 in god knows how many iterations it's had now, it wouldn't be the first route that would come to mind to advertise. I would advertise routes such as the 1/2/75/76 for Bristol Services or the X1/X39/376 for country area services.
 

Citistar

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Listening to music on spotify & an ad from First West of England popped up advertising the 36. Great concept of advertising, however as someone whose been on the 36 in god knows how many iterations it's had now, it wouldn't be the first route that would come to mind to advertise. I would advertise routes such as the 1/2/75/76 for Bristol Services or the X1/X39/376 for country area services.
It is indeed an odd choice. That'll almost certainly be Bristol City Council or the Combined Authority paying for that. I wonder if there will also be adverts for similarly CAZ-supported 16 and 37?
 

nick291

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It is indeed an odd choice. That'll almost certainly be Bristol City Council or the Combined Authority paying for that. I wonder if there will also be adverts for similarly CAZ-supported 16 and 37?
The advert logos were WESTbus if that helps.
 

father_jack

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TheGrandWazoo

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Nice to see the "£2 singles" cap until December 2024 still advertised on both bus stops in Tweentown by the roundabout yesterday.
I think there's a few of those from the Somerset Bus Partnership...

**********************

I'm used to First WoE having image problems but they're not so bad e.g. amending the Bath City buses that moved to Bath by removing the appropriate vinyls. However, spotted 39443 the other day...


You might not be able to really see it but the loss of half the Citylines fleetnames is because they've pot-rivetted a patch on top of the panel. What a bodge job!!!
 

devonexpress

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I think there's a few of those from the Somerset Bus Partnership...

**********************

I'm used to First WoE having image problems but they're not so bad e.g. amending the Bath City buses that moved to Bath by removing the appropriate vinyls. However, spotted 39443 the other day...


You might not be able to really see it but the loss of half the Citylines fleetnames is because they've pot-rivetted a patch on top of the panel. What a bodge job!!!
I would imagine it was to get the bus back in service as soon as possible and they will do a proper repair when it goes in for repaint to lime green WESTbus?
 

-Colly405-

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Following this week's purchase by First of Bath Bus Company, as of tomorrow the AirDecker A4 looks to be falling in line with First WoE ticketing.

 

WelshBluebird

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Interesting that at least for now they are keeping the local journeys part of it though. Wonder how long that will last for!
 

Benjwri

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Interesting that at least for now they are keeping the local journeys part of it though. Wonder how long that will last for!
I think they'd come hard pressed not to. It's always been billed as a local bus as well as an airport one, they'd be cutting the only real direct bus between Bath and Keynsham, they'd certainly be flack from the council and residents.
 

markymark2000

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I think they'd come hard pressed not to. It's always been billed as a local bus as well as an airport one, they'd be cutting the only real direct bus between Bath and Keynsham, they'd certainly be flack from the council and residents.
Could this change perhaps lead to removing a few of the 39 journeys and instead converting them to x39s? I note a few of the 39 trips run at the same time as the 522 between Bristol and Keynsham (and vice versa) and the A4 would then cover links between Keynsham and Bath (and vice versa).
 

Citistar

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Could this change perhaps lead to removing a few of the 39 journeys and instead converting them to x39s? I note a few of the 39 trips run at the same time as the 522 between Bristol and Keynsham (and vice versa) and the A4 would then cover links between Keynsham and Bath (and vice versa).
I think the first priority should be to return the Keynsham - Bath service to a reasonable level. Hourly is not adequate.
 

The exile

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I think the first priority should be to return the Keynsham - Bath service to a reasonable level. Hourly is not adequate.
I suppose the problem there is that any bus service put on to do that would effectively have to draw all its custom from the stops between Keynsham “centre” and the A4. Central Keynsham - Central Bath already has a 2tph (train) service and once you’re back on the A4 there’s all theX39s.
 

t rex

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Went over to bath today on a4 from Keynsham and back again. Was a nice healthy load onway to bath and a full load back to Keynsham. We stopped at most stops in bath, saltford,Keynsham and dropped off and picked up new passengers that were travelling locally but was a healthy load going to bristol airport aswell.
Noticed the airdeckers now have first fleet numbers on and even have fran on the stop announcements
Also the open-tops now have first fleet numbers applied
 

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Citistar

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I suppose the problem there is that any bus service put on to do that would effectively have to draw all its custom from the stops between Keynsham “centre” and the A4. Central Keynsham - Central Bath already has a 2tph (train) service and once you’re back on the A4 there’s all theX39s.
All perfectly fair, but there has to be some scope to improve the links between the two, perhaps whilst strengthening some other links out of Keynsham which are pretty poor in certain directions. I suspect now that the A4 is part of the First network and ticketing ecosystem, it's value as an orbital route across South Bristol will only increase. While the 36 takes almost an hour to get from Brislington to Highridge Green, the A4 does it in less than 20 for most of the day. Perhaps the route in/out of Bath could be looked at too with a split made between Upper and Lower Bristol Roads (assuming the Twerton Arch twitch can be overcome).
 

nick291

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All perfectly fair, but there has to be some scope to improve the links between the two, perhaps whilst strengthening some other links out of Keynsham which are pretty poor in certain directions. I suspect now that the A4 is part of the First network and ticketing ecosystem, it's value as an orbital route across South Bristol will only increase. While the 36 takes almost an hour to get from Brislington to Highridge Green, the A4 does it in less than 20 for most of the day. Perhaps the route in/out of Bath could be looked at too with a split made between Upper and Lower Bristol Roads (assuming the Twerton Arch twitch can be overcome).
Saw an ad saying the A4 is under the first banner on my bus to work this morning and mentioned how all first tickets are valid but not to Bristol Airport as that's a separate fare/ticketing system.
 

-Colly405-

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The roadworks closing the ring road westbound, Bradley Stoke way and Great Meadow Rbt are causing absolute chaos to M1 tonight.

I was on one earlier that went Willow Brook, Brook Way, Stoke Gifford (not Parkway), MOD Rbt, Ring Road (eastbound), Harry Stoke, Parkway North, Parkway, MOD Rbt (again), Cheswick, UWE...

They've been doing u-turns at The Worthys and at Baileys Court too.

Mayhem!
 

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