Delay Repay - Elizabeth Line to National Rail

[strickers]

Hi Folks

Would appreciate some advice, we were at Heathrow yesterday, sat on the 0820 Elizabeth Line, this would have got us to Farringdon comfortable for an 0941 National Rail ticket.

There was a broken down train and most services that morning were cancelled from T5. We jumped across to the Heathrow Express but missed our train from Farringdon by a few minutes. We finally got to destination 150 minutes late.

Have I any recourse here for Delay Repay when taking into account this wasn't one ticket?

 

[3rd rail land]

Can you explain what you mean by 'this wasn't one ticket'? Generally if you can get a journey planner to give the itinerary you intended to use then you'll have a valid delay repay claim if you hit unforeseen delays making you late enough.

If you use split tickets or contactless/PAYG for part of the journey this won't invalidate any delay repay claim. Oh and just to make it clear, because I am not totally sure from your post if you are aware, Elizabeth Line is National Rail.

 

[strickers]

Elizabeth Line is underground, so usual Oyster tap on and tap off. My National Rail ticket was Farringdon-Lincoln.

 

[redreni]

Elizabeth Line is underground

No it isn't.

 

[strickers]

Forgive me for being naive then, by the sounds of it I can initiate delay repay of the National Rail ticket against Elizabeth Line?

 

[redreni]

Forgive me for being naive then, by the sounds of it I can initiate delay repay of the National Rail ticket against Elizabeth Line?

Yes, although you haven't given enough information for us to be able to advise on whether you have a valid claim.

If the delay was 150 minutes, I imagine there must have been further delays after your missed connection at Farringdon? If the Elizabeth Line was the first operator to cause a material delay and the overall delay was over an hour, however, then on the face of it you have a valid claim under the NRCoT in my opinion.

TfL may take the view that if you use Contactless at Heathrow T5 and then use Heathrow Express, that's nothing to do with them at all, and/or that if you use Contactless on the Elizabeth Line core section then you are travelling under the TfL Conditions of Carriage rather than under the NRCoT. I don't imagine they will be falling over themselves to pay out. You need to be very clear about which timetabled National Rail services you intended to use (including the Elizabeth Line train from T5 to Farringdon), make sure they formed a valid itinerary, what tickets you held and for which parts of the journey you used PAYG. And stress you were making a through National Rail journey.

 

[strickers]

@redreni

Thanks, I was planning on omitting the Heathrow Express element from the claim as it confuses the issue.

My planned journey was HWV-ZFD, Elizabeth Line, Contactless, 0820-0859.
ZFD-SVG-LCN 0941-1013, 1028-1200

We caught a train from ZFD at 0956 which arrived in SVG at 1032, the next direct service to LCN was 1227 arriving 1402. We could have left SVG at 1127 but this would have arrived at 1347 and wasn't direct and not worth it for 15 mins.

In the end though we were delayed further with a train hitting a person on the line, fortunately this happened while we were at PBO and we could switch to the 1320 direct to LCN on EMR arriving at 1435. I fully accept that this latter incident is outside anyone's control, in a best case situation our arrival time at LCN would have been 1347 which is 107 minutes.

I will put in the text that I was making a valid journey under NRCoT and claim the National Rail ticket cost, I'll take the Heathrow Express cost on the chin.

 

[redreni]

@redreni

Thanks, I was planning on omitting the Heathrow Express element from the claim as it confuses the issue.

My planned journey was HWV-ZFD, Elizabeth Line, Contactless, 0820-0859.
ZFD-SVG-LCN 0941-1013, 1028-1200

We caught a train from ZFD at 0956 which arrived in SVG at 1032, the next direct service to LCN was 1227 arriving 1402. We could have left SVG at 1127 but this would have arrived at 1347 and wasn't direct and not worth it for 15 mins.

[...]

I will put in the text that I was making a valid journey under NRCoT and claim the National Rail ticket cost, I'll take the Heathrow Express cost on the chin.

Well, hang on, if you're claiming for the whole journey then you need to provide tickets covering the whole journey (which would include, in this case, your Contactless records which you can get from the TfL website or app). I don't think they're obliged to pay if the tickets you submit don't cover the whole journey you are claiming for.

 

[strickers]

OK, so I need the Heathrow Express ticket then?

 

[redreni]

OK, so I need the Heathrow Express ticket then?

Whatever tickets you used, and/or Contactless records for any part of the journey where you used Contactless.

 

[strickers]

Great, thanks. I'll download those and use them too.

 

[Starmill]

Sounds like Transport for London customer services eventually relented on this for you and paid out, albeit as a "goodwill gesture"? Always useful to know outcomes for anyone who finds these threads by Google search etc. in the future. Well done.

For anyone wondering, the National Rail Conditions of Travel sets out a minimum in compensation which applies to delays of an hour or longer, and TfL have to follow this for delays caused by late London Overground or Elizabeth line services, same as Merseyrail do for Merseyrail services, even if they'd prefer to not give compensation in these circumstances.

 

[strickers]

I was planning on updating when the cash hit my bank account! But yes, it looks promising, kept pushing back and stating my position.