Major Incident at Huntingdon (01/11/2025)

[Tester]

Even with a flashing aspect, approach locking would apply. It's possible, but unlikely, that this signal has comprehensive approach locking in which case the route could be re-set as long as the train hadn't seen the first signal that would change aspect by doing so. Otherwise there would be a 2min delay after cancelling the route via the through line before a route could be set into the platform. In this situation the signaller might cancel the route even after the train had passed the first signal that would change aspect, knowing the driver was aware already reducing speed.

It's also possible that the signaller hadn't set either route when they became aware of the incident, in which case they could just set the platform route instead of the through line.

Either way I agree that all involved should be commended on reacting immediately to bring the train to a suitable place where help was available and the incident could be resolved so quickly.

I would be surprised to find that it doesn't.

 

[MarkyT]

I would be surprised to find that it doesn't.

I agree that signal is highly likely to have comprehensive approach locking on such a busy, important railway. Huntingdon has a 1977 GEC GS geographical interlocking according to the British Power Signalling Register, with control migrated from Peterborough PSB to York ROC in 2023.

 

[Hadders]

But the normal service as advertised is running. No need to put passengers off at a time when they need to be reassured.

LNER are being sensible with their messaging. A decent service is running but there could be all sorts of issues we don’t know about. For example:

- Are any crew out of hours as a result of yesterday’s disruption?
- Are any of the staff working the impacted train due to be working today? If they are, then I suspect they won’t be working today. Are replacement staff readily available and in the right place, given planned engineering work?
- Was the train impacted due to be operating today? If so, is a spare available and available given the engineering work?
- Does the up slow line being out of use today at Huntingdon mean fewer trains have to run?

 

[357]

REC call would be used in my opinion, as it is for threat to life.

I most certainly wouldn't because I don't need other trains stopped.

I'm curious what first alerted the driver... Passcom, guard, or emergency call relayed via signaller?

Someone mentioned lessons being learnt, and one comes to mind... Current guidance from most TOCs is to only holdover a passcom to prevent stopping in an unsuitable location.

Passcoms need manually resetting, which might not be possible with a knife wielding maniac running about.

You then need to operate EBS to get moving again etc...

Perhaps better to automatically holdover whilst manually braking until you know what the problem is. This way you maintain full control.

Just a thought.

I have no idea what you're talking about in regard to EBS to get the train moving again. Not on any train I've ever driven. I've always used the override until I can stop in a platform.

 

[Surreytraveller]

REC call would be used in my opinion, as it is for threat to life.

People on the train need medical attention. A REC would delay that attention getting to them. A REC is for when you want to stop all trains in an area. This was not that scenario.

 

[Strathclyder]

Woke up to this horrible news this morning. A nightmare scenerio for all onboard to have to suddenly face. The train crew, signaller and emergency services are to be commended for a swift, well-coordinated response to a dangerous, rapidly unfolding situation. Could've been so much worse otherwise.

My thoughts are with those still in hospital and for them to make as quick and painless a recovery as possible, to say nothing of what their familes, friends and colleagues must be going through right now. They are who really matter at the moment, not the scrotes responsible for this depravity nor the innumerable bad actors both online and off seeking to exploit and/or twist the truth of this henious act for personal and/or political gain. The former will hopefully have several dozen bible-sized books thrown at them, the latter are beneath the contempt they so richly deserve and should be called out for what they are appropriately.

Jumping from a train in the dark, possibly in panic, and running around - again in panic - does not seem like a safe plan in any scenario.

Then, you allow the offenders to potentially flee (or inflict more harm) and cause a manhunt that potentially means they're never found and can repeat their acts somewhere else.

Containing the train is the only logical option, even if more people come to harm. The alternative is far worse and in some incidents you have to make a hard decision.

Quite so. There's no good options in situations like this. I really don't envy those who have to make these decisions. In this case, as difficult a choice as it no doubt was, I do think the right call was made for stopping at a station given the location of where awareness of the incident was first gained and the proxmity of Huntingdon station to that location, both of which enabled the emergency services to respond quickly and effectively to neutralize the threat.

 

[Steve Harris]

LNER are being sensible with their messaging. A decent service is running but there could be all sorts of issues we don’t know about. For example:

- Are any crew out of hours as a result of yesterday’s disruption?
- Are any of the staff working the impacted train due to be working today? If they are, then I suspect they won’t be working today. Are replacement staff readily available and in the right place, given planned engineering work?
- Was the train impacted due to be operating today? If so, is a spare available and available given the engineering work?
- Does the up slow line being out of use today at Huntingdon mean fewer trains have to run?

I very much doubt that having the Up Slow out of use today will have a great impact (as only the hourly Thameslink Peterborough - Kings Cross service is planned to use it). Tomorrow is a different kettle of fish though as the service pattern is half hourly (off peak) and I do know that some LNER services are usually right on the Thameslink services tail at Huntingdon in the Up direction.

I did read on the Thameslink disruption page that they expect disruption and the station will remain closed until close of service tomorrow night.

https://www.thameslinkrailway.com/s...570880000#INC199D6044D1C54A899B203BB0BBAE0966

The emergency services are continuing to deal with a major incident between Hitchin and Peterborough. Whilst they carry out their work some lines are still closed.

Great Northern and Thameslink services will not call at Huntingdon.

LNER services between London Kings Cross and Peterborough may be cancelled, revised or delayed.

Disruption is expected until the end of the day on Monday 3 November.

Huntingdon Station will remain closed until the end of the day tomorrow, Monday 3 November.

 

[D1537]

LNER are being sensible with their messaging. A decent service is running but there could be all sorts of issues we don’t know about. For example:

- Are any crew out of hours as a result of yesterday’s disruption?
- Are any of the staff working the impacted train due to be working today? If they are, then I suspect they won’t be working today. Are replacement staff readily available and in the right place, given planned engineering work?
- Was the train impacted due to be operating today? If so, is a spare available and available given the engineering work?
- Does the up slow line being out of use today at Huntingdon mean fewer trains have to run?

I was supposed to be on the 0933 to Lincoln this morning, which was cancelled; LNERs messaging was very good, and we eventually got the 0903 to Harrogate instead, which was very busy and had no functioning reservations (not sure why) but nearly everyone seemed to get a seat, certainly where we were.

There were a number of people who had been to the Rugby Union at Twickenham on Saturday evening, and also Leeds fans who had been to Brighton - all of them that we spoke to in the queue at KGX had been booked on the 2030 to Leeds and were told to get hotel rooms in London last night which would be recompensed by LNER.

 

[BrummieBobby]

The driver and signaller need to absolutely be recognised for their response to this. They did (in my opinion) the right thing by platforming the train at Huntingdon rather than stopping it in the middle between Peterborough and Huntingdon. With these types of incidents, it is way safer to be platformed in a safe location than not to be, and also enables the emergency response to be quicker.

Absolutely; excellent effort by the driver and signaller to get this organised under extreme pressure.

It seems that, from a railway and emergency services point of view, the response to this incident has been exemplary.

 

[AlterEgo]

Individual flights are also much easier to describe ("the BA123 flight from Delhi to London" vs "the 1A23 LNER train which originated from Doncaster even though it usually comes from Edinburgh but not this weekend due to engineering works, made multiple station stops at multiple times, and was headed to London, was involved in an incident and has come to a stop at a station it wasn't scheduled to call at. No, not the LNER that departed at 1702 and had 4 station stops, it's the one that departed at 1712 and has 6 station stops. No, not the 1A23 from Manchester to Blackpool this afternoon, or the 1A23 from Brighton to Portsmouth this evening, or the 1A23 from Doncaster to London this morning...")

Nobody uses headcodes. The train was the 1825 from Doncaster. Do you expect the media to call it anything different?

 

[Crossover]

Thoughts with those involved, especially the crew and driver who must have been under a great deal of stress, but performed amazingly under the circumstances. Probably saved countless lives.

Sorry if it has been asked already:
1. Where is the train likely to be moved to (Doncaster?)?
2. What is likely to happen to it (deep clean and return to service, or interior furnishings stripped and replaced)?

Obviously as the train is only a few years old it’s not going to be written off.

Finally, I hope there will be counselling available for any staff member who needs it.

My immediate thought would be Doncaster as one of the main IEP depots but could also be London. I’d presume a deep clean at a minimum and potentially strip down if some carriages if needed. Absolutely zero chance of such an incident writing off a train IMO (even an older train)

The problem is that will immediately stop any trains which may be ahead, potentially causing a significant delay in you getting where you want to be. It's not always the best option.

My thought would be a REC call would stop everything, including you. As such, you’d have a developing incident in the middle of nowhere and it would take a lot longer to get help (police primarily) to deal with the incident and also leave your passengers running around the tracks to escape the madmen, rather than being able to decamp into the relative safety of a station and locality beyond

Shows that Realtime Trains etc. are still niche websites not widely known to the non-enthusiast public. Also presumably broadcasters are not willing to trust "non official" websites.

Do media have protocol to follow that some things have to be confirmed officially?

BBC is reporting that passengers made calls to report the incident, so the police on the ground may have know as soon as or before the driver. So it's possible they initiated the diversion into the platform at Huntingdon and the driver was contacted to advise that was what was happening, rather than this being initiated by the driver. The police would also have had to mobilise all available emergency service to Huntingdon, to arrive before the train if possible.

I would be surprised if the police or BTP could act that quickly, if at all from what we see reported on here. This feels like the excellent work of the crew/signallers etc

A couple of other salient points from the press conference: The police say the two suspects were arrested within 8 minutes of the first call, and both are British born.

So much in the way of horrible hatred comments across social media. Ive now stopped even reading anybody else’s opinion as so many are just so politically motivated. It really is showing the downside of modern life where vicious remarks can be voiced to the world in an instant.

Social media was awash last night with the inevitable comments. It reminds me of an incident (can’t remember which) recently where police were very quick to point out the perps were white British to presumably cull the rumour mill

Sorry if this has not been mentioned. After leaving Peterborough this train would have been routed on the down fast which doesn't have platforms at Huntingdon, how was the train routed to the down slow in such a short space of time. Was the train travelling at 125mph and then emergency brake at Huntingdon?

It has been mentioned there were about 8 berths between the incident and Huntingdon. It was a very quick response to get the train platformed in such a short space of time but a train can brake normally within 3 berths (consider the normal signal sequence for a four aspect railway) so there wouldn’t have been any emergency braking involved - just a normal response to a station call really

 

[norbitonflyer]

I am quite interested in learning about the timeline. From the police, we know the 999 calls came in around 19:39 and the police arrived around 19:50. RTT says the train rolled into Huntingdon at 19:44. Altogether, they suggest an incredibly tight sequence of events which makes the actions of everyone involved – driver, signaller, police, passengers – all the more remarkable.

Looking at the timings - the train is shown on RTT as arriving at hubntingdon only three of four minutes after it would have passed through at full speed in the normal course of events - it suggests that the route was set for the platform line before the train reached the first signal that would have been approach locked by a change of route. Whether that change was at the request of the driver or the emergency services (as a response to a 999 call) it shows very prompt action by all concerned.

Another train had left the platform only four minutes previously, by which time the incident train had already passed Conington, but the incident must have been reported and acted upon by then as the incident train would, in the normal course of events, be passing through the station on the fast lines at that moment.

 

[Crossover]

Absolutely; excellent effort by the driver and signaller to get this organised under extreme pressure.

It seems that, from a railway and emergency services point of view, the response to this incident has been exemplary.

I would agree with this and credit where it is due. We don’t know the exact things have happened but reading between the lines it doesn’t feel like the railway ‘system’ could have done much more and the response seems to have been pretty much ‘textbook’. It may be fortunate too that the incident was on newer stock as I think had this been a 225, a passcom would have immediate dumped the brakes as is my understanding

 

[norbitonflyer]

It has been mentioned there were about 8 berths between the incident and Huntingdon. It was a very quick response to get the train platformed in such a short space of time but a train can brake normally within 3 berths (consider the normal signal sequence for a four aspect railway) so there wouldn’t have been any emergency braking involved - just a normal response to a station call really

That seems to fit with reporst that arrests were made within eight minutes of the emergency call. The train is shown to have arrived at 1944, so the call was made after 1936, when RTT tells us it was passing Conington, which is indeed about eight berths from Huntingdon.

No matter when the alert was raised, I would have expected the driver to be aiming to get to the next station as quickly as possible (unless specifically asked to time his arrival to coincide with the emergency services) so would not have reduced speed until he needed to on approach to the divergence.

 

[357]

I would be surprised if the police or BTP could act that quickly, if at all from what we see reported on here. This feels like the excellent work of the crew/signallers etc

Generally whenever I've been involved in any major incident with large police response, the local police deal with it and then BTP arrive once the hard work has been done to take statements and take photos.

 

[trainophile]

Sorry have skipped a few pages so probably already discussed, but does Huntingdon station have barriers? Hearing about everyone rushing to get out of the station and away from the danger, I wondered whether they had to force barriers or whether someone had opened them, if indeed they exist.

 

[MikeWh]

Assuming the route was already set for the Up Fast

The previous train only arrived at HUN at 1938, departed at 1939.75, so it's possible the route was never set to the fast through line.

 

[jfowkes]

Sorry have skipped a few pages so probably already discussed, but does Huntingdon station have barriers? Hearing about everyone rushing to get out of the station and away from the danger, I wondered whether they had to force barriers or whether someone had opened them, if indeed they exist.

Yes, Huntingdon has barriers. I don't use the station that often, but they aren't always in use. Sometimes when getting in late they have been open.

 

[Laughable]

BBC now reporting on News channel that it was driver that asked for train to be diverted to Huntingdon.

(~14:11 on the live feed)

As it happened: Man, 32, treated as only suspect in train stabbing as staff member in life-threatening condition, police say

British Transport Police say the "heroic" man who tried to stop the attack remains in hospital. Five others have been discharged.

www.bbc.co.uk

The driver "managed to contact the control centre at Network Rail and get the train diverted onto the slow line", Calder says.

 

[Annetts key]

BBC now reporting on News channel that it was driver that asked for train to be diverted to Huntingdon.

(~14:11 on the live feed)

Yeah, that makes the most sense given how quickly the decision was made.

 

[Steve Harris]

LNER trains do not stop at Huntingdon. I suspect that the presentation of timings is an artefact of how the data is presented following cancellation of the train at an unscheduled stop.

As others have said it was not scheduled to stop at Huntingdon (Note that code UM is used*). If it was scheduled to stop you would get UM followed by US*

UM = Up Main
US = Up Slow (the line the train currently resides on).

 

[sharpener]

The previous train only arrived at HUN at 1938, departed at 1939.75, so it's possible the route was never set to the fast through line.

Wouldn't automatic route setting put the points back to normal as soon as the previous train had cleared the platform berth? Or doesn't it work like that?

 

[MarkWi72]

Apparently, a Leeds - KX was behind 1Y90, which apparently passed Huntingdon at 19.45 1/2. This makes the decision more remarkable, even if the road was already set to SL platform.

 

[Steve Harris]

The previous train only arrived at HUN at 1938, departed at 1939.75, so it's possible the route was never set to the fast through line.

I would speculate that the driver got lucky and contacted the signaller just before they would have set the route for the Up Fast (going on timings on RTT). Perhaps we will find out in due course as information comes into the public domain or perhaps we will never know.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 2 Nov 2025 ==

Wouldn't automatic route setting put the points back to normal as soon as the previous train had cleared the platform berth? Or doesn't it work like that?

I don't think it works like that. I was watching signal maps last night and the points from the UF to US at St Neots didn't change back until the route was set for the next train.
If the route isn't set signalmaps shows that the points haven't moved.

 

[DarloRich]

Irc Cambridgeshire Constabulary HQ is next to Huntingdon station. A convenient bit of help, hopefully, in responding to the incident so quickly

 

[norbitonflyer]

The previous train only arrived at HUN at 1938, departed at 1939.75, so it's possible the route was never set to the fast through line.

Quite possibly - RTT has the train passsing Conington at 1938. And if the "eight minutes from alarm to arrest" is correct, the emergency services were not called until 1936 at the very earliest (since the arrests could not have been made before the train arrived at 1944)

 

[Steve Harris]

Apparently, a Leeds - KX was behind 1Y90, which apparently passed Huntingdon at 19.45 1/2. This makes the decision more remarkable, even if the road was already set to SL platform.

But it didn't pass through at that time. According to RTT it passed at 20.05 !! (And it was actually from Harrogate)!
As previously stated up thread, trains were stopped in the area then cautioned through, so yes there was at least 2 services behind 1Y90 last night that managed to sneak through* southbound between the time 1Y90 stopped and a total line block was imposed. As i said, this has already been mentioned upthread.

*Some northbound services also made it through before the total line block was implemented.

 

[Robin Edwards]

Irc Cambridgeshire Constabulary HQ is next to Huntingdon station. A convenient bit of help, hopefully, in responding to the incident so quickly

Also if utilised, Hinchinbrooke Hospital is right next to Huntingdon Station. The news reporters were outside Addenbrookes in Cambridge so whether Hinchinbrooke was used is unclear.

 

[stuartl]

Thoughts with those involved, especially the crew and driver who must have been under a great deal of stress, but performed amazingly under the circumstances. Probably saved countless lives.

Sorry if it has been asked already:
1. Where is the train likely to be moved to (Doncaster?)?
2. What is likely to happen to it (deep clean and return to service, or interior furnishings stripped and replaced)?

Obviously as the train is only a few years old it’s not going to be written off.

Finally, I hope there will be counselling available for any staff member who needs it.

I seem to remember seeing an article about cleaning companies that specialise in cleaning up crime scenes. Maybe LNER will call one of these in to help.

 

[NSEWonderer]

This video seems to have used a rewind tool, I believe Vaildata to try and break down the train's journey, starting from when it arrived at Peterborough. Even shows train movement after it came to a stop at Huntingdon come 19:44. Last two trains to have to do wrong direction moves on the down being 9J58 and 1H08.