Did any WCML IC trains call at Bletchley or Northampton before Milton Keynes Central opened?

[AY1975]

Did any West Coast Main Line InterCity trains ever call at Bletchley or Northampton before Milton Keynes Central station opened in 1982? Or were they all non-stop from at least Watford Junction to Rugby until that time?

In some ways it would surely have made sense to have at least a few IC trains calling at either Bletchley or Northampton (particularly Bletchley as trains avoiding Northampton and running via Weedon also pass through there), as either of them but especially Bletchley could have served as a distribution centre for the same sort of area that Milton Keynes Central did (and still does) once it opened.

 

[jfollows]

Yes, they called at Bletchley. Table 65 from 1974 will show calls, eg 1G11 00:10 Euston-Wolverhampton, 1H04 06:55 SX Euston-Manchester, 1F14 08:15 Euston-Liverpool, 1P18 09:00 Euston-Carlisle, 1P02 10:15 SO Euston-Blackpool, so not many.
Up services 1A02 00:30 Liverpool-Euston, 1A68 11:38 SO Blackpool-Euston, 1A63 16:04 Liverpool-Euston, 1A64 16:13 Manchester-Euston, 1A72 15:42 Carlisle-Euston
Plus an Inverness/Perth sleeper.

 

[A S Leib]

Bletchley did in the ~1960s, although I don't have the timetable with me so I can't check the year or how frequent a service it had.

 

[Magdalia]

1965 was the last year before electrification. The WTT has these SX:

1L18 0655 Euston-Windermere Bletchley and Northampton
1G61 0845 Euston-Birmingham Northampton
1L37 1125 Euston-Workington Bletchley and Northampton
1G70 1630 Euston-Birmingham Northampton
1G72 1855 Euston-Birmingham Bletchley and Northampton
1K56 2350 Euston-Crewe Bletchley and Northampton

1M49 0030 Liverpool-Marylebone Northampton and Bletchley
1M14 2200 Stranraer-Euston Bletchley
1B03 0730 Birmingham-Euston Bletchley
1A08 0815 Liverpool-Euston Bletchley
1A25 0905 Llandudno-Euston Northampton and Bletchley
1A33 0839 Carlisle-Euston Northampton and Bletchley
1A42 1255 Bangor-Euston Bletchley
1B24 1700 Birmingham-Euston Northampton
1A60 1711 Blackpool-Euston Northampton

 

[Bletchleyite]

1M49 0030 Liverpool-Marylebone Northampton and Bletchley

What route did that take? Was the flat crossing at Bletchley onto the Aylesbury line still in place at that point, as it wouldn't have been able to run over the flyover and call at Bletchley prior to the recent construction of the upper level station.

 

[hexagon789]

Did any West Coast Main Line InterCity trains ever call at Bletchley or Northampton before Milton Keynes Central station opened in 1982? Or were they all non-stop from at least Watford Junction to Rugby until that time?

In some ways it would surely have made sense to have at least a few IC trains calling at either Bletchley or Northampton (particularly Bletchley as trains avoiding Northampton and running via Weedon also pass through there), as either of them but especially Bletchley could have served as a distribution centre for the same sort of area that Milton Keynes Central did (and still does) once it opened.

In 1980 at Bletchley there was:

Northbound
0655 Euston to Manchester
0845 Euston to Glasgow
0850 Euston to Liverpool
0855 Euston to Manchester
0900 Euston to Blackpool North
1015 Euston to Stranraer
1100 Euston to Holyhead
2145 SO Euston to Inverness sleeper
2235 SX Euston to Perth sleeper

Southbound
0030 Liverpool to Euston sleeper
2220 Glasgow to Euston sleeper (with 1930 portion off Perth/Inverness on Saturdays)
0810 Glasgow to Euston
1535 Manchester to Euston
1605 Liverpool to Euston
1400 Glasgow to Euston via Kilmarnock
1820 Blackpool North to Euston

 

[A S Leib]

The Wikipedia article for the Northampton – Market Harborough line says that for a few years after 1969, the line was used by one sleeper train per night; where did it go to, and did it call at Northampton?

 

[jfollows]

What route did that take? Was the flat crossing at Bletchley onto the Aylesbury line still in place at that point, as it wouldn't have been able to run over the flyover and call at Bletchley prior to the recent construction of the upper level station.

Yes, the flat crossing lasted into electrification. I have it on my post-electrification track plan. Including a S-W chord line also, under Bletchley PSB control. Removed in April 1970 my notes say.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 30 Oct 2025 ==

The Wikipedia article for the Northampton – Market Harborough line says that for a few years after 1969, the line was used by one sleeper train per night; where did it go to, and did it call at Northampton?

Glasgow via S&C and, yes, it called at Northampton.

Thames-Clyde Express in the 1970's

Thanks for both of those bits of info. Shame about the Sunday service I must say. I did it both ways a few years back. I forgot to mention the up SuO service, 1E20, the 15.19 ex Carlisle DOES still go to Notthingham still. But it's all shacks over the S&C (despite its Class 1 designation). And...

www.railforums.co.uk

Essentially the sleeper was diverted from Saint Pancras to Euston.

 

[Bevan Price]

Bletchley also provided connections between WCML stations and the lines to Oxford and Bedford/Cambridge.

 

[norbitonflyer]

I certainly recall getting a loco-hauled train from Bletchley to Euston in about 1977. Whether it was strictkly an Inter City service I don't recall, but i think its only stop was at Watford Junction.

 

[Taunton]

Bletchley also provided connections between WCML stations and the lines to Oxford and Bedford/Cambridge.

Until the line closed, to Bletchley from Oxford, and from Cambridge was a main route for mails from both heading north, all the way up to Glasgow, and for some passengers, which was a more important flow on the line than any academics travelling end to end.

 

[0161]

I'm pretty sure Bletchley was even on Intercity rail maps ahead of MKC's opening, as the city was without it's "own" station for a number of years.

 

[DarloRich]

Were the loco hauled Northampton cobbler services Intercity or NSE? They stopped at Bletchley.

I'm pretty sure Bletchley was even on Intercity rail maps ahead of MKC's opening, as the city was without it's "own" station for a number of years.

MKC opened in May 1982 - according to the old area hands it took quite a while to get a deal done to actually build a station as BR were essentially skint and weren't interested

Did any West Coast Main Line InterCity trains ever call at Bletchley or Northampton before Milton Keynes Central station opened in 1982?

They did - there are still older people in the local area bemoaning that they moved the IC services to MKC!

Bletchley could have served as a distribution centre for the same sort of area that Milton Keynes Central did (and still does) once it opened.

Postal traffic stayed at Bletchley for a considerable time after MKC opened. The main sorting office for MK was at Bletchley although this may now have changed.

 

[43096]

Were the loco hauled Northampton cobbler services Intercity or NSE? They stopped at Bletchley.

NSE

 

[DarloRich]

NSE

thanks - well before my time in this area!

 

[Magdalia]

Until the line closed, to Bletchley from Oxford, and from Cambridge was a main route for mails from both heading north, all the way up to Glasgow, and for some passengers, which was a more important flow on the line than any academics travelling end to end.

The Cambridge-Oxford passenger service lasted until the end of 1967, after electrification was completed.

The LNWR built the route as 2 separate branches from Bletchley, and it was operated that way for most of its life. In 1961 there was one through train Oxford-Cambridge and none going the other way.

Between 1962 and closure there were more through trains, ironically because the WCML was much less busy during the electrification period, meaning that it was much easier to get paths from one side to the other on the level.

It would be interesting to know what WCML trains called at Bletchley prior to 1962.

Until the line closed, to Bletchley from Oxford, and from Cambridge was a main route for mails from both

As far as I can tell the parcels trains between Bletchley and Cambridge finished in 1966, as did most of the freight. Mail went via Peterborough East to Rugby: the Peterborough-Crewe and return TPOs that ran until the 1980s, connecting in and out of the West Coast postals, were descendants of Peterborough East-Rugby TPOs.

 

[RailWonderer]

In 1980 at Bletchley there was:

Northbound
0655 Euston to Manchester
0845 Euston to Glasgow
0850 Euston to Liverpool
0855 Euston to Manchester
0900 Euston to Blackpool North
1015 Euston to Stranraer
1100 Euston to Holyhead
2145 SO Euston to Inverness sleeper
2235 SX Euston to Perth sleeper

What's more amazing is how the south east had a direct train to Stranraer.

 

[BeijingDave]

What's more amazing is how the south east had a direct train to Stranraer.

Boat train for Northern Ireland, probably much more used than it would be nowadays with cheap flights etc.

 

[jfollows]

It would be interesting to know what WCML trains called at Bletchley prior to 1962.

Is 17/12/58 to 14/6/59 of interest? I can summarise later if so.

 

[BeijingDave]

I'm pretty sure Bletchley was even on Intercity rail maps ahead of MKC's opening, as the city was without it's "own" station for a number of years.

It was, and IIRC on the National Rail map as a big dot, bold text 'major station' for a while (like Northampton, Rugby etc).

 

[hexagon789]

What's more amazing is how the south east had a direct train to Stranraer.

Boat train for Northern Ireland, probably much more used than it would be nowadays with cheap flights etc.

The day service began in 1980 and lasted until around 1990 or so, it was effectively an extension of one of the Euston/Carlisle semi-fasts from memory.

The sleeper, known colloquially as 'The Paddy', had a much longer history and I believe survived a further two years after the day train was withdrawn.

 

[Magdalia]

Is 17/12/58 to 14/6/59 of interest? I can summarise later if so.

Yes please, though no rush!

 

[Cheshire Scot]

Essentially the sleeper was diverted from Saint Pancras to Euston.

Then later truncated at Nottingham. Once this had happened the down train again started from St Pancras (21.30) with the sleepers attached at Nottingham. The seated coaches had worked up from Nott'm to St P on one of the semi-fasts during the day

 

[jfollows]

Yes please, though no rush!

17/11/58 to 14/6/59: Bletchley class "A" services

DOWN
00:54 Bletchley to Crewe (23:52 from Euston) 01:23 MO / 01:27 MX from Northampton
07:41 SO / 07:51 SX to Windermere (06:30 / 06:45 from Euston) 08:20 SO / 08:30 SX Northampton
11:50 to Blackpool Central (10:40 from Euston) via Weedon
12:58 to Crewe (11:50 from Euston) 13:28 Northampton
16:00 to Birmingham starts Bletchley 16:35 Northampton
18:22 SX / 18:35 SO to Rugby (17:10 SX / 17:23 SO from Euston 18:56 SX / 19:18 SO Northampton
19:54 to Birmingham (18:55 from Euston) 20:26 Northampton
20:29 to Perth SX, Inverness SO (19:20 from Euston) via Weedon
20:37 to Stranraer FO & SX-Q via Weedon
Q - runs when required

UP
04:07 to Euston (18:50 SX & Sun from Glasgow) via Weedon
05:01 MX / 05:06 MO to Euston (00:05 from Liverpool) 04:21 MX / 04:26 MO Norrthampton
07D11 MX to Euston (22:00 from Stranraer) 8 minutes later when required to set down Sleeping Car passengers at Nuneaton, Station Master Crewe to advise Driver and Guard, via Weedon
08:42 to Euston (08:00 from Northampton)
09:09 to Euston (06:40 from Wolverhampton) via Weedon
10:35 SX to Euston (10:00 from Northampton)
11:20 SO-Q to Euston (06:30 from Llandudno) via Weedon
11:21 SX to Euston (08:05 from Liverpool) via Weedon
11:36 SO to Euston (08:15 from Liverpool) via Weedon
15:26 to Euston (08:30 from Carlisle) via Weedon
21:50 to Euston (19:40 from Birmingham) (21:08 from Northampton)

Northampton only (not calling at Bletchley)

DOWN
10:16 to Wolverhampton (08:50 from Euston)
17:52 SX / 17:57 SO to Wolverhampton (16:27 from Euston)
22:48 to Birmingham SX / Wolverhampton SO (21:20 from Euston)

UP
02:01 MO to Euston (00:15 from Birmingham)
03:45 MX / 03:53 MO to Euston (23:58 from Manchester)
11:21 to Euston (09:30 from Wolverhampton)
18:23 to Euston (17:00 SX from Birmingham / 16:00 SO from Wolverhampton)
21:56 to Euston (17:05 from Blackpool Central)

 

[08221]

We used to get the Perth express back to Bletchley from Euston in the 1970s when my dad had taken me to evening games at Chelsea.

 

[Metroman62]

From about 1975 to 1978 I often travelled Saturday mornings from Coventry to Berkhamsted. I caught the 7:10 IC service from Coventry which stopped at Bletchley. It overtook the stopping service just north of Wolverton so I could change for that service. One morning despite the guard announcing we were stopping at Bletchley we shot through non stop, not stopping until Euston. Quite a few passengers vented their feelings at the driver at Euston! I seem to remember the station signs at one point said Bletchley and underneath "for Milton Keynes"

 

[Magdalia]

17/11/58 to 14/6/59: Bletchley class "A" services

Thanks. I was interested in the Cambridge<->WCML connections at Bletchley.

I think that the 09:23SX/09:30SO from Cambridge would have connected into 11:50 to Blackpool Central (10:40 from Euston).
I think that the 18;18 from Cambridge would have connected into 20:29 to Perth SX, Inverness SO (19:20 from Euston).
I think that there was a connection out of 09:09 to Euston (06:40 from Wolverhampton) for 10:00 to Cambridge.
I think that there was a connection out of 11:21SX/11:36SO to Euston (08:05SX/08:15SO from Liverpool) for 1218 to Cambridge.
I think that there was a connection out of 15:26 to Euston (08:30 from Carlisle) for 14:30 Oxford-Cambridge.

 

[jfollows]

Thanks. I was interested in the Cambridge<->WCML connections at Bletchley.

I think that the 09:23SX/09:30SO from Cambridge would have connected into 11:50 to Blackpool Central (10:40 from Euston).
I think that the 18;18 from Cambridge would have connected into 20:29 to Perth SX, Inverness SO (19:20 from Euston).
I think that there was a connection out of 09:09 to Euston (06:40 from Wolverhampton) for 10:00 to Cambridge.
I think that there was a connection out of 11:21SX/11:36SO to Euston (08:05SX/08:15SO from Liverpool) for 1218 to Cambridge.
I think that there was a connection out of 15:26 to Euston (08:30 from Carlisle) for 14:30 Oxford-Cambridge.

09:23 SX / 09:30 SO Cambridge arrived 10:56 SX / 11:12 SO
18:18 Cambridge arrived 19:53, advertised arrival 19:58 (corrected)
14:30 Oxford-Cambridge departed 15:55

I think you have all these anyway, but if there's anything else from the WTT I have please let me know.

 

[Sun Chariot]

Were the loco hauled Northampton cobbler services Intercity or NSE? They stopped at Bletchley.

Network Southeast had peak hour paths that ran non-stop between Leighton Buzzard and Euston. Between LB and Northampton, they were more sedate.
I still recall my lively ride in a Mk1 SK, on the evening peak Euston to Northampton. A class 85 up front. 29 minutes to Leighton Buzzard for the 40.25 miles.

 

[jfollows]

Network Southeast had peak hour paths that ran non-stop between Leighton Buzzard and Euston. Between LB and Northampton, they were more sedate.
I still recall my lively ride in a Mk1 SK, on the evening peak Euston to Northampton. A class 85 up front. 29 minutes to Leighton Buzzard for the 40.25 miles.

They were allowed to exceed 315 tonnes with a class 81-85 whereas normally they’d have been limited to this to stick to the E455 timings. I used them to visit Northampton in the 1980s but was not a regular user.

There are historic threads covering these services.

304s/310s & 312s

I would question that the MBS of the Liverpool sets (016-035) had compartments. They had the wider windows between the doors, which are incompatible with a compartment arrangement. They also retained the original type seats, unlike sets 001-015 which had new seats (from memory, the suburban...

www.railforums.co.uk

Northampton historical services

I moved to MK abut 12 years ago ( where has that gone?) not that long after the WCML modification had been completed. The south WCML service has always seemed pretty decent to me so it has been interesting to read how poor it was even a few years ago. I know the commuter zone has moved more...

www.railforums.co.uk