London Buses Discussion

[DGP]

It might be rail replacement service but buses look smart

Hmm... rail replacement or rail preplacement?

 

[SYorksKent]

For the last fortnight or so there seems to have been an issue with live tracking of 227 Crystal Palace/Bromley North. Service seems to be running roughly normally but both live arrivals online and displays at bus stops mostly show no buses at all expected. Other routes don't seem to be affected. An issue with transponders on the buses themselves perhaps? Anyone any idea what's going on?

 

[PGAT]

For the last fortnight or so there seems to have been an issue with live tracking of 227 Crystal Palace/Bromley North. Service seems to be running roughly normally but both live arrivals online and displays at bus stops mostly show no buses at all expected. Other routes don't seem to be affected. An issue with transponders on the buses themselves perhaps? Anyone any idea what's going on?

The route moved into the new Sydenham Garage and other routes operating from there have been suffering similar tracking issues

 

[700007]

The issues relating to tracking at Sydenham garage is to do with a 'corrupted' schedule upload on TfLs side of things. The buses can 'log on' to the route but can't log trip details and without this, the iBus system has no idea what trips these buses are doing or where they are meant to be and at what time. Subsequently as a result, these buses then don't flag up on Countdown hence the general public can't see where these buses are.

 

[Intro298]

For the last fortnight or so there seems to have been an issue with live tracking of 227 Crystal Palace/Bromley North. Service seems to be running roughly normally but both live arrivals online and displays at bus stops mostly show no buses at all expected. Other routes don't seem to be affected. An issue with transponders on the buses themselves perhaps? Anyone any idea what's going on?

It won’t be anywhere near as useful as the usual tracking since most buses are missing, but some of the service is still showing up on bustimes.org.

Routes 126, 162, 352 and 354 are also affected, as they also operate from the new Sydenham garage [SM].

 

[Simon75]

Has Sydenham garage replaced another one, or is just a new one ?

 

[Busoccultation]

Has Sydenham garage replaced another one, or is just a new one ?

Just a new garage to increase garage capacity in the wider South East London area especially with the electrification of buses.

 

[stevieinselby]

It'll be successful. Hard to fail when you have towers with thousands of new homes beside pretty much every stop.

The real test will be how many journeys it has added to the network rather than passengers who have switched from other services. Hopefully the numbers will tell a good story!

 

[Mikey C]

A slightly strange incident between a 3 and a taxi today. A video on the BBC website, so higher profile than is it had just been posted on social media

London bus crashes into taxi and dental clinic near Westminster

Dashcam video shows the moment a double decker bus ploughs into a taxi and building in Westminster.

www.bbc.co.uk

Dashcam footage has emerged of a bus crash in central London.

The video, sent to the BBC, appears to show a Number 3 double decker bus turning right into a road near Westminster and immediately hitting a black taxi waiting at the junction.

The taxi is then seen being pushed onto the pavement as the bus careers into a dental clinic on the corner of Marsham Street and Great Peter Street.

 

[MotCO]

A slightly strange incident between a 3 and a taxi today. A video on the BBC website, so higher profile than is it had just been posted on social media

London bus crashes into taxi and dental clinic near Westminster

Dashcam video shows the moment a double decker bus ploughs into a taxi and building in Westminster.

www.bbc.co.uk

Could the steering have jammed?

 

[Thirteen]

The New Routemaster buses are really prone to crashing.

I did notice the other week that the 57 and 131 are using a mix of diesel buses and BYD electric buses, I'm guessing the charging issue at Merton Garage isn't fully resolved yet.

 

[Snow1964]

Couple of routes have changed operator today.

144 is now GoAhead who are using 9-10 year old MHV and WHV class buses (until yesterday was Arriva)

224 is now Metroline, who are using 13-14 year old DEL class that were acquired when they took over some First garages about 12 years ago (until yesterday route was operated by First who had bought/acquired RATP), so First have now lost this route again.

 

[317 forever]

Couple of routes have changed operator today.

144 is now GoAhead who are using 9-10 year old MHV and WHV class buses (until yesterday was Arriva)

224 is now Metroline, who are using 13-14 year old DEL class that were acquired when they took over some First garages about 12 years ago (until yesterday route was operated by First who had bought/acquired RATP), so First have now lost this route again.

So, route 224 has gone First - Metroline - RATP - First - Metroline!

 

[Thirteen]

The consultation for the SL15 is here and it looks like a good route with some crossover with other Superloop services like the SL4 although Eltham seems an odd place to connect to from Clapham Junction.

 

[PGAT]

The consultation for the SL15 is here and it looks like a good route with some crossover with other Superloop services like the SL4 although Eltham seems an odd place to connect to from Clapham Junction.

haveyoursay.tfl.gov.uk/sl15-superloop

Proposals

The SL15 would run between Clapham Junction and Eltham stations, via Tulse Hill and Catford, and would primarily follow the A205 South Circular Road.

The SL15 would operate as an express bus service. It would serve a limited number of key bus stops, including eight rail interchanges, local town centres and other busy locations along its proposed route. As part of the Superloop family the SL15 service would be frequent, simple, inclusive and reliable.

At Clapham Junction, the route would start and end at Falcon Road. In Eltham, it would start and end at Eltham Station after serving the High Street.

Low bridge

Due to the low railway bridge on Thurlow Park Road, double-deck vehicles would not be suitable for the SL15. Therefore, subject to the outcome of consultation, the SL15 would operate with single-deck buses, featuring the usual Superloop accessibility provisions and on-board facilities such as USB charging points and travel information.

Proposed timings and bus stops

We propose the SL15 bus route would run:

Seven days a week

Operating between approximately 05:00 and 00:30

Every 12 minutes during Monday to Saturday daytimes

Every 15 minutes all evenings, on Sundays, and on early morning weekdays

The SL15 is not proposed to operate through the night.

Times shown are indicative for consultation purposes. Timetables would only be developed following consultation, and once a decision as to how to proceed is reached

What else we would like you to know

The SL15 would be an addition to the south London bus network, operating alongside other local bus routes across its proposed route. This would increase the number and frequency of buses in the area and may create more room on-board for customers of other routes such as the P13, 160 and 185.

Bus stops and stands

Subject to the outcome of consultation, we would review bus stop and stand arrangements to help accommodate new route SL15 where it starts and ends, and to manage bus driver facilities.

At Clapham Junction, and subject to agreement with the London Borough of Wandsworth, we would review bus stopping arrangements around Clapham Junction station. This may result in changes to local bus stops for routes C3, 35, 39, 49, 170, 295, 319, and 344. We are also considering introducing a new set-down bus stop on Falcon Road (for alighting passengers off terminating routes), beneath the railway bridge.

At Eltham Station, subject to agreement with the Royal Borough of Greenwich we would consider converting a disused coach stop to a new SL15 pick up point.

Further information about these potential changes and how they may affect customers can be found the ‘How it impacts you’ section. The potential Clapham Junction bus stop changes are described in detail in the initial Equalities Impact Assessment document, found in the ‘Maps and more information’ section.

 

[DGP]

The consultation for the SL15 is here and it looks like a good route with some crossover with other Superloop services like the SL4 although Eltham seems an odd place to connect to from Clapham Junction.

I presume the idea is provide a number of overlapping links not currently provided rather than expecting it to be used as a direct link between Clapham Junction and Eltham but Eltham seems odd to me given that neighbouring Kidbrooke is undergoing a massive transformation which could be boosted by the provision of additional bus services.

 

[MotCO]

haveyoursay.tfl.gov.uk/sl15-superloop

Unfortunately, it will be single deck due to a low railway bridge - maybe it should be a bendy bus!

Following the South Circular may not mean that it will be a very fast route. Also, given it crosses over the peak-hours only SL6, I thought it could make use of those buses which otherwise spend most of the day laid up, but not if the route is single-decked.

 

[Bishopstone]

haveyoursay.tfl.gov.uk/sl15-superloop

Launching with single deck buses would be unfortunate, and a decision that’s already been reversed on the SL5.

That said, I’m not overly familiar with the Dulwich area. How much of a diversion would the nearest double decker-compliant routing entail? (Or, to ask the same question another way, what traffic objectives would be missed, in avoiding the low bridge?)

 

[PGAT]

Unfortunately, it will be single deck due to a low railway bridge - maybe it should be a bendy bus!

Following the South Circular may not mean that it will be a very fast route. Also, given it crosses over the peak-hours only SL6, I thought it could make use of those buses which otherwise spend most of the day laid up, but not if the route is single-decked.

It would still need its own buses for peak times when the SL6 is running.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Oct 2025 ==

Launching with single deck buses would be unfortunate, and a decision that’s already been reversed on the SL5.

That said, I’m not overly familiar with the Dulwich area. How much of a diversion would the nearest double decker-compliant routing entail? (Or, to ask the same question another way, what traffic objectives would be missed, in avoiding the low bridge?)

The route could easily divert via Lancaster Avenue (I believe the 3 goes there on diversions?) with minimal time penalty and no change to the stops and I intend to suggest this to them

 

[stevieinselby]

That said, I’m not overly familiar with the Dulwich area. How much of a diversion would the nearest double decker-compliant routing entail? (Or, to ask the same question another way, what traffic objectives would be missed, in avoiding the low bridge?)

The bridge is at Tulse Hill on A205. Buses could divert via Lancaster Avenue, which is a wide suburban street and has traffic lights that would make it easy for buses turning right onto A215 heading westbound (but it's just a give way turning right onto A205 eastbound). The diversion wouldn't miss any proposed stops, but according to current traffic levels on Google Maps would add 2–3 minutes to the running time.

 

[Edvid]

Courtesy of an Arriva procurement manager, here's a picture of one of the Croydon-bound B12s (link).

A great 4 days at BYD there HQ in Shenzhen China meeting senior BYD MD and senior people getting a great insight into the depth of BYD, battery technology and safety. new vehicle developments l,… | Richard Yoxall

A great 4 days at BYD there HQ in Shenzhen China meeting senior BYD MD and senior people getting a great insight into the depth of BYD, battery technology and safety. new vehicle developments l, product plans over the next 2 years and beyond and the after sales support Also a visit to...

www.linkedin.com

That said, it would have been more accurate to say These aren't the first single decks BYD have built for the UK market

 

[Mikey C]

TfL have confirmed today that the 310 bus route will continue permanently. The consultation report contains more details, certain changes are being looked into

Following a detailed review of the consultation responses, we are planning the following changes to the route:
A large number of responses wanted us to operate route 310 later into the evening. We are looking into the costs for this, with a view to introducing a new timetable in August 2026. We will update customers once we have the final timetable.
We are also planning to extend the service to serve Rookwood Road in Stamford Hill as many people suggested this in the consultation. We are investigating how to provide the infrastructure to enable this
We are also considering a re-routeing of the service to serve Holloway Road Nag’s Head rather than Stroud Green Road, subject to further consultation. The date for the new consultation is not yet confirmed, but when it is we will publicise it widely within the community.

Documents | Bus route 310 | Have Your Say Transport for London

We consulted on new bus route 310 between 1 September 2024 and 4 May 2025. We started consultation in-line with the new route operating, to give people the opportunity to respond throughout a majority of the initial one-year contract. We closed the consultation in May

haveyoursay.tfl.gov.uk

Bus route 310

We consulted on new bus route 310 between 1 September 2024 and 4 May 2025. We started consultation in-line with the new route operating, to give people the opportunity to respond throughout a majority of the initial one-year contract. We closed the consultation in May

haveyoursay.tfl.gov.uk

 

[Chiltern006]

Courtesy of an Arriva procurement manager, here's a picture of one of the Croydon-bound B12s (link).

A great 4 days at BYD there HQ in Shenzhen China meeting senior BYD MD and senior people getting a great insight into the depth of BYD, battery technology and safety. new vehicle developments l,… | Richard Yoxall

A great 4 days at BYD there HQ in Shenzhen China meeting senior BYD MD and senior people getting a great insight into the depth of BYD, battery technology and safety. new vehicle developments l, product plans over the next 2 years and beyond and the after sales support Also a visit to...

www.linkedin.com

That said, it would have been more accurate to say These aren't the first single decks BYD have built for the UK market

oh.

The design is definitely a choice.

 

[Edvid]

Well well, it looks like the Telling family are returning to the London Buses fold!

(Falcon Buses will operate the 467 from next year)

Falcon Buses | The Bus Forum

Well, I think this thread will now be relevant in this section of the forum!

tangytango.proboards.com

 

[Mark L]

The bridge is at Tulse Hill on A205. Buses could divert via Lancaster Avenue, which is a wide suburban street and has traffic lights that would make it easy for buses turning right onto A215 heading westbound (but it's just a give way turning right onto A205 eastbound). The diversion wouldn't miss any proposed stops, but according to current traffic levels on Google Maps would add 2–3 minutes to the running time.

My hunch is that the route will go via Lancaster Avenue and TfL will use this to show that the consultation process works.

 

[Timmyd]

My hunch is that the route will go via Lancaster Avenue and TfL will use this to show that the consultation process works.

Very local resident here. I think they’d have a tall order persuading the residents to accept a regular bus service down there. It used to have a regular flow of empty buses when Norwood ran the 176 and there was a song and dance about that. It would also slow down the new route by I’d say 5 mins, Norwood Road north towards Tulse Hill can be very slow. Norwood Road to Lancaster would be a tight turn too. I reckon it’ll go ahead with SDs but I can see the demand for this being strong towards Clapham Junction where links from this area are limited. Eltham I agree with others is a less attractive destination, I’d have thought Lewisham or Bromley would be make more sense.

 

[busesrusuk]

oh.

The design is definitely a choice.

The BYD single decker is already in service with UNO Bus - seen earlier:

Uno Bus 405 Oct25

UH De Haviland Campus Hatfield, Oct 2025

www.flickr.com

 

[Thirteen]

The BYD single decker is already in service with UNO Bus - seen earlier:

Uno Bus 405 Oct25

UH De Haviland Campus Hatfield, Oct 2025

www.flickr.com

It's not great on the outside but maybe it'll look better in red.

 

[londonbridge]

Due to SGN works in Stafford Road, until further notice routes 154 and 157 are on diversion towards Morden only, via Plough Lane, Croydon Road and Manor Road. 154 missing stops from Wilsons School to Stafford Road/Woodcote Road, and 157 missing stops from Plough Lane to Wallington Station. Dunno why they have to close the road, why cant they just have temporary traffic lights and single alternate line traffic?

 

[Snow1964]

Quite a big batch of tender results announced yesterday.

Routes : 16, 104, 146, 208, 227, 300, 301, 336, P13
All except 227 getting new electric buses.

Route 16 is currently operated by LT (new bus for London, Boris Bus). This might be first tender award replacing them where they have been used for years (although those previously used on Superloop SL3 until its electric buses were ready are still parked up). Some of the fleet has also been moved around as routes and frequencies have been changed.

LOTS Home Page

www.lots.org.uk