LNER - last minute reservations on MK4 sets

[357]

Afternoon all,

Currently on the 13:15 LDS - KGX in my usual space in coach C. 91 and Mk 4 set. All seats in the coach showing "Available".

A few minutes before departure a polite lady comes to me and tells me she has a reservation for the seat I have occupied. I thought this strange, asked to check her ticket and sure enough she has reserved a "unreservable" seat.

I've just tried myself on the LNER website and have reserved a seat in this coach from Wakefield to London.

All screens above seats still show available.

I use these services about 3-4 times a week on average - and while Azuma's have a slightly different system with "may be reserved later" (orange) and "Available" (green). In my experience, the loco hauled sets were always left completely unreserved.

Is this a new change or has there been an error somewhere in the booking system?

 

[Wallsendmag]

Which seat were you sat in?

 

[357]

Which seat were you sat in?

C45. Table towards the middle.

Just noticed at Wakefield various seat displays updating while standing in the platform - it seems the MK4 sets now have the same arrangement as an Azuma where only half of coach C is kept unreserved.

Possibly preparation for shortening the sets in December? Irritating that I've not seen any publicity for this change and the displays can't show "May be reserved later"

 

[Wallsendmag]

Looks like it's available to reserve as you say, have to say i don't understand why people don't reserve seats on LNER when it is so easy.

 

[35B]

It is - but a pet frustration of mine is that reservations aren't released when someone changes their plan.

 

[357]

Looks like it's available to reserve as you say, have to say i don't understand why people don't reserve seats on LNER when it is so easy.

When I'm traveling pass for work there's always the risk I'll end up on another train or doing something else entirely!

 

[NER1621]

i don't understand why people don't reserve seats on LNER when it is so easy.

Because everytime I’ve done it “on the day” as advertised, the reservation has not been displayed on the train when it arrived. Conversely, when I buy a ticket from the LNER app to travel between Darlington and Durham, Newcastle or York it insists on giving me a reservation which I have no intention of using (I sit in the carriage that’s most convenient for my exit, and usually find a pair of unoccupied seats) but which I can’t cancel, and which therefore affects the advertised availability of seats for longer through journeys.

LNER’s fake compulsory reservation system isn’t “simple” - it’s not fit for purpose.

 

[Flying Snail]

Looks like it's available to reserve as you say, have to say i don't understand why people don't reserve seats on LNER when it is so easy.

And I don't understand why management of certain TOCs are obsessed with forcing reservations down everyone's throats to the point they have installed this conflict generating garbage and are intentionally publishing lies about mandatory reservations across national and international booking systems.

 

[sheff1]

have to say i don't understand why people don't reserve seats on LNER when it is so easy.

It isn’t. The last few times I tried to reserve a seat, when I selected the one I wanted and clicked to confirm a message came up saying we are unable to reserve the seat due to technical issues. Since then I haven’t bothered to try and have always found a seat anyway, many times one which is shown as reserved from xxx to xxx but is unoccupied.

Previously I did seemingly reserve a seat but when I boarded the display showed “available”and understandably the person sitting there wasn’t inclined to move. When I raised the matter with the guard they said the system didn’t update in real time and agreed that was naff.

 

[ainsworth74]

Not sure I've ever had a reservation made at short notice actually appear on the train. It's a reasonable enough idea in theory but really doesn't seem to work in practice.

 

[MrJeeves]

It is - but a pet frustration of mine is that reservations aren't released when someone changes their plan.

The solution to this is charging for reservations, and refunding if you cancel the reservation at least N hours before scheduled departure.

But of course that isn't how the rail industry works here, and such a proposal would get discussed to death in Speculative Discussion.

 

[Wallsendmag]

Not sure I've ever had a reservation made at short notice actually appear on the train. It's a reasonable enough idea in theory but really doesn't seem to work in practice.

New version of the Azuma reservation software refreshes the reservations before each stop, not sure how this works on the IC225s

 

[35B]

The solution to this is charging for reservations, and refunding if you cancel the reservation at least N hours before scheduled departure.

But of course that isn't how the rail industry works here, and such a proposal would get discussed to death in Speculative Discussion.

I’m not even going that far - just that when I do enter a valid reference for a pre-existing reservation, that isn’t released.

 

[TUC]

I had a seat reservation from Leeds to Kings Cross the other day, only to find a completely different reservation as far as Peterborough showing on the display. Why does the LNER system keep making these errors, time and again?

 

[Nym]

New version of the Azuma reservation software refreshes the reservations before each stop, not sure how this works on the IC225s

So you could be sat in an available seat that suddenly will be reserved out from under you. Nice...

 

[Wallsendmag]

So you could be sat in an available seat that suddenly will be reserved out from under you. Nice...

Well the "can be booked later" on the reservation is a sort of indication.

 

[yorksrob]

Looks like it's available to reserve as you say, have to say i don't understand why people don't reserve seats on LNER when it is so easy.


View attachment 190109

Excuses excuses.

 

[Darandio]

Well the "can be booked later" on the reservation is a sort of indication.

An indication that it's an utterly stupid system to have.

 

[AlterEgo]

Reserving seats from under the backside of customers already sat there is utterly asinine. One of the most antisocial ideas on the railway.

 

[Flying Snail]

Well the "can be booked later" on the reservation is a sort of indication.

Treating people without reservations like dirt, people who have bought and paid (often VERY expensive open tickets) for their travel and deserve a lot better than being faced with the possibility of being confronted by some aggressive tosser with entitlement because they have got a free reservation for their entire journey.

 

[Kite159]

Treating people without reservations like dirt, people who have bought and paid (often VERY expensive open tickets) for their travel and deserve a lot better than being faced with the possibility of being confronted by some aggressive tosser with entitlement because they have got a free reservation for their entire journey.

And that aggressive person is only travelling one stop but demands their seat even though there are plenty of other seats available for their one stop journey from Durham to Newcastle.

 

[357]

Well the "can be booked later" on the reservation is a sort of indication.

That isn't shown on the MK4 sets, hence this thread existing.

 

[Tom]

Reserving seats from under the backside of customers already sat there is utterly asinine. One of the most antisocial ideas on the railway.

Totally agreed. Nothing makes someone more warm and fuzzy inside than being turfed out of their seat that was free for their journey at the point in time they sat down in it. Really encourages people to come back and take the train again.

 

[Adam Williams]

What happened to the seat occupancy tech that was supposedly going to be present on the Pendos? It shouldn't be beyond the wit of man to connect that up to RARS and prevent reservations being made on seats people are sitting in.

The solution to this is charging for reservations, and refunding if you cancel the reservation at least N hours before scheduled departure.

Disagree, strongly. Very few retailers make it possible for passengers to cancel unneeded reservations in the first place - so I don't think we need to jump to punitive fees to try and encourage "good behaviour" when people can't even be good today because people haven't bothered providing the facility. Oh, and the mandatory reservations nonsense just leads to these unnecessary bookings being made left, right and centre on walk-up tickets - so the TOCs have a great deal of responsibility for the current mess, too. Not that they'll ever admit that.

 

[yorksrob]

Yes, turfing people out of their seats mid-journey is despicable. Yet the Establishment seem wedded to the idea.

 

[Falcon1200]

An indication that it's an utterly stupid system to have.

Reserving seats from under the backside of customers already sat there is utterly asinine.

Indeed, the 'May be reserved' indicator might as well say 'reserved', because passengers are reluctant to occupy a seat only to be booted out of it later. The only thing that would change that is making Guards/Senior Conductors/Train Managers able to reserve, instantly, the seat when it becomes taken.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Indeed, the 'May be reserved' indicator might as well say 'reserved', because passengers are reluctant to occupy a seat only to be booted out of it later. The only thing that would change that is making Guards/Senior Conductors/Train Managers able to reserve, instantly, the seat when it becomes taken.

The Pendolino has a system fitted to do this but in my observation it doesn't work.

 

[Falcon1200]

he Pendolino has a system fitted to do this but in my observation it doesn't work.

Indeed; Travelling with my sister from Glasgow to Euston in August, she took a seat shown Available only for it to suddenly become Reserved at Preston!

 

[SuspectUsual]

and the mandatory reservations nonsense just leads to these unnecessary bookings being made left, right and centre on walk-up tickets

But how can this be prevented?

I don’t think it can, without some hideously expensive IT solution

Limit to one reservation per ticket? Doesn’t work because of multi-leg journeys

One reservation per journey leg per ticket? Possibly, but I imagine it’s hugely complex and made more so by journeys with multiple potential change points and overlapping routes

How do you manage people travelling on concessionary passes who need to reserve a seat

Etc etc etc

The only solution is to find a way to stop people wanting to behave like this……

 

[Bletchleyite]

The way to stop unnecessary reservations is to stop making them mandatory. We have been there before; when it first launched Trainline gave you a reservation with every ticket if it could, and so there were loads that weren't used. It was changed to make them optional (you had to check a box to say you wanted one) and the nonsense largely went away. Then LNER and Avanti started misusing the compulsory flag and the problem naturally restarted.