Trivia: Platforms you cannot freely 'roam'

[zwk500]

It’s insane after all the years network rail have not tried to get the curved end of platform 7 realigned and straightened so it could be back in use

Is it just the curve, I thought the signal protection arrangements were also sub-standard for passenger use?

 

[redflame 100]

That just about puts the whole thing in a nutshell (whichever side of the fence you sit on). All of the other things you mention are surely a chicken-and-egg situation. Why spend money putting passenger friendly things there if passengers aren’t let on to the platform until the last minute?

If the platforms where open to passenger use with all the infrastructure in place there would be no problem allowing the tablnkinging of trains which only take 5 minutes or so.The comment you made is ridiculous as only trains with low tank issues would be tanked ..which is maybe 2 or 3 incoming services a day.
It's a network rail issue and it ain't Northerns fault that NR won't spend the money.

 

[BurtonM]

I recall P3/4 at New Cross Gate (the fast lines) being completely inaccessible (admittedly this is 15-20 years ago). Is this still the case?

 

[rmHawk765]

I recall P3/4 at New Cross Gate (the fast lines) being completely inaccessible (admittedly this is 15-20 years ago). Is this still the case?

Can't confirm this but almost certainly so, as over 20 years we've only gotten way more arrangements like this at suburban stations.

 

[Islineclear3_1]

Not sure if this one has been mentioned but surprisingly: Deal (Kent) - especially the platform towards Ramsgate. Despite the platform accommodating 8 carriages, you cannot just freely roam down beyond the 4-car stop before a pole mounted platform camera catches you and a loud announcement about a security alert and the police will be called is tannoyed right across the station and into Sainsburys car park for everyone to hear. I had the misfortune and embarrassment of this and the staff member rushed out from the ticket office and shouted at me to walk back down the platform. Being (mainly) a 1 tph outside of the peaks, and in perfect legitimate territory (on the platform, which has a fence at the end) I quizzed her about this and she mentioned about a lot of suicides. Really? Most trains stop at Deal; through ECS trains don't go very fast and when I enquired further, she told me about the regular suicides and to look it up. Naturally I looked it up and found nothing.

 

[Elecman]

Is it just the curve, I thought the signal protection arrangements were also sub-standard for passenger use?

Correct

 

[tfw756rider]

I've just remembered - on my 222 and 700 riding day (I had photographed my outward 222 at Nottingham, where I got on it, and where the staff have always just let me do my thing, just like in Wales and its bordering areas of England) I used Bedford station for the first time.

After I had just got on my outward 700 at Bedford after photographing it, the dispatcher was concerned that I was taking photos without letting him know first, but he was nice about it (just area and policy reasons I guess) and I apologised, and he appreciated that I took what he said on board (and then he dispatched my 700 and I was on my way to Luton Airport Parkway on my surprisingly comfortable ironing board).

After getting off my return 700 back at Bedford, when I walked past the front of my return 222 (my train back as far as Nottingham), the guard asked me where I was going, and I said "just in front of the train to take a photo of it", and then he was fine with it. Obviously just the way it is there, and probably for good reason. And I'd much rather that than "OI!"

A few months later, on my 360 riding day, I did 222 Nottingham-Kettering and 360 Kettering-Bedford (and the reverse). No problems at Nottingham or Kettering as expected, and none at Bedford either, because I had remembered to make sure that the staff there were aware of what I was doing.

 

[TT-ONR-NRN]

I've just remembered - on my 222 and 700 riding day (I had photographed my outward 222 at Nottingham, where I got on it, and where the staff have always just let me do my thing, just like in Wales and its bordering areas of England) I used Bedford station for the first time.

After I had just got on my outward 700 at Bedford after photographing it, the dispatcher was concerned that I was taking photos without letting him know first, but he was nice about it (just area and policy reasons I guess) and I apologised, and he appreciated that I took what he said on board (and then he dispatched my 700 and I was on my way to Luton Airport Parkway on my surprisingly comfortable ironing board).

After getting off my return 700 back at Bedford, when I walked past the front of my return 222 (my train back as far as Nottingham), the guard asked me where I was going, and I said "just in front of the train to take a photo of it", and then he was fine with it. Obviously just the way it is there, and probably for good reason. And I'd much rather that than "OI!"

A few months later, on my 360 riding day, I did 222 Nottingham-Kettering and 360 Kettering-Bedford (and the reverse). No problems at Nottingham or Kettering as expected, and none at Bedford either, because I had remembered to make sure that the staff there were aware of what I was doing.

If you ever get an “OI” from a member of staff, please write a strongly worded complaint to the TOC, ideally with their name…

 

[tfw756rider]

If you ever get an “OI” from a member of staff, please write a strongly worded complaint to the TOC, ideally with their name…

Oh yes, of course I would. I just meant that I appreciated that the staff just asked me the questions normally, rather than communicating with me in a more difficult way.

 

[E B]

A thought popped into my head recently, considering that there are some stations/platforms which you cannot freely 'roam'. In the majority of stations in this country, once, in many cases, you have got through the barriers, you are free to walk around the station freely and get onto all platforms, no-one will really question you wandering a station. The majority of rural stations you can just walk onto at any time, and no-one will stop you.

But: there are some stations which you are only allowed onto platforms if a train is ready for boarding, and you are catching that train. You cannot freely roam these stations, and if you did you would be asked to leave.

A couple of examples I can think of:
-London St Pancras EMR: you can only enter the platforms once a train is ready for boarding, and you can only get to that platform when it is. Access to these platforms is heavily restricted.
-Blackpool North: similarly, you are held until a train is boarding

And on the other end of the scale:
-Peartree (near Derby): access to this 'halt' is only allowed via locked gates which are opened for passengers who use the provided intercom, when a train will soon arrive.

So, what examples can you think of, of platforms like this?

P.S. this doesn't include platforms which are locked at night.

St Pancras Eurostar (but that has probably already been mentioned)

 

[bramling]

If you ever get an “OI” from a member of staff, please write a strongly worded complaint to the TOC, ideally with their name…

I wouldn't bother complaining, but an obnoxious approach is fair game to be met with a prickly response. Alternatively, if the staff don't know how to approach people correctly, then just ignore them - which will then neatly prepare the eventual discussion to be about *their* lack of social skills, rather than what you are doing.

 

[redflame 100]

Be interesting to see how Blackpool North station handles the Railway 200 inspiration train which is due to be at the station from the 4th-7th November and what arrangements they make for barrier/platform access.

It's already in hand and the work to make getting onto the platform for this event has been completed.
The work included new paint,removal of half the Bicycle shed for easier access,tarmac and new concrete on foot path and using the entrance /exit which gave access to the the bike storage.

 

[Dr Hoo]

It's already in hand and the work to make getting onto the platform for this event has been completed.
The work included new paint,removal of half the Bicycle shed for easier access,tarmac and new concrete on foot path and using the entrance /exit which gave access to the the bike storage.

Welcome to the Forums.

“Round the back of a bike shed in Blackpool during November.”

Hmm. Is this the most ‘exotic’ stop the the Rail 200 Inspiration Train has, I wonder.

 

[MichaelTrains]

The two worst that I have encountered are Blackpool North and Skegness.

 

[E B]

Be interesting to see how Blackpool North station handles the Railway 200 inspiration train which is due to be at the station from the 4th-7th November and what arrangements they make for barrier/platform access.

At Moor Street there was a separate entrance (through a physical gate) or they let you through the barrier.

 

[321362]

On Sundays the country end of Walthamstow Central up platform (and presumably the town end of the down platform) is taped off as all the trains are 4 cars and the platform can accommodate 8

 

[josh-j]

Not sure if this one has been mentioned but surprisingly: Deal (Kent) - especially the platform towards Ramsgate. Despite the platform accommodating 8 carriages, you cannot just freely roam down beyond the 4-car stop before a pole mounted platform camera catches you and a loud announcement about a security alert and the police will be called is tannoyed right across the station and into Sainsburys car park for everyone to hear. I had the misfortune and embarrassment of this and the staff member rushed out from the ticket office and shouted at me to walk back down the platform. Being (mainly) a 1 tph outside of the peaks, and in perfect legitimate territory (on the platform, which has a fence at the end) I quizzed her about this and she mentioned about a lot of suicides. Really? Most trains stop at Deal; through ECS trains don't go very fast and when I enquired further, she told me about the regular suicides and to look it up. Naturally I looked it up and found nothing.

You have to wonder whether this kind of generally unfeeling, automatically hostile approach to people just walking around might actually lead to increased risk of suicide overall.

 

[styles]

You have to wonder whether this kind of generally unfeeling, automatically hostile approach to people just walking around might actually lead to increased risk of suicide overall.

Especially if there's no obvious signage or barrier to suggest people shouldn't pass that point. I think the UK is getting slowly more hostile to everyday activities - I understand why body worn cameras are increasingly common, but it does just paint an air of mild hostility. Receipts required to leave supermarkets, landowners near Derwent patrolling hills on quads and removing wild campers, aggressive behaviour towards customer facing staff, etc.

I've heard recently that staff at Chester are quite precious about the end of their platforms, which can cause some less than friendly interactions for spotters.

While I'm waiting for a train I often find myself just walking the full length of the platform and back. I do wonder if anybody is ever watching and thinking I'm a suicide risk. In any case, if I thought someone was suicidal, my approach wouldn't be to shout 'Oi' at them!

 

[duffield]

...

While I'm waiting for a train I often find myself just walking the full length of the platform and back. I do wonder if anybody is ever watching and thinking I'm a suicide risk. In any case, if I thought someone was suicidal, my approach wouldn't be to shout 'Oi' at them!

This is my normal behaviour too, I get enough sitting down on the train and walking the full length of the platform and back gives some sort of exercise and passes the time. But I do make a point of keeping moving purposefully and staying well away from the platform edge, and of course not passing any relevant "do not pass this point" signs. I don't want to alarm any well-meaning staff.

I've never had any hassle (or even interest) yet but I would really be quite annoyed to be shouted at for this totally innocent activity. I'll make a mental note that Chester is hostile in that way.

Receipts required to leave supermarkets,...

I've never heard of this happening in the UK (in the US, yes) but I don't see how that could possibly work with receipts being optional pretty much everywhere; I rarely bother with them.

 

[Class73Electro]

I've never heard of this happening in the UK (in the US, yes) but I don't see how that could possibly work with receipts being optional pretty much everywhere; I rarely bother with them.

The local Lidl here requires them for the self-service machine area.

 

[styles]

This is my normal behaviour too, I get enough sitting down on the train and walking the full length of the platform and back gives some sort of exercise and passes the time. But I do make a point of keeping moving purposefully and staying well away from the platform edge, and of course not passing any relevant "do not pass this point" signs. I don't want to alarm any well-meaning staff.

I've never had any hassle (or even interest) yet but I would really be quite annoyed to be shouted at for this totally innocent activity. I'll make a mental note that Chester is hostile in that way.

I don't have first hand experience of any issues at Chester, or anywhere else for that matter, just second hand, so perhaps a pinch of salt in order. I also suspect that CCTV operators generally recognise other signs like not having a bag or crying or looking a bit spaced out etc etc to determine whether somebody may be at risk (of suicide, or even a drugs or medical episode).

I've never heard of this happening in the UK (in the US, yes) but I don't see how that could possibly work with receipts being optional pretty much everywhere; I rarely bother with them.

Tesco, Sainsbury's, Lidl, Aldi, Morrisons all have this at some location. It's not very widespread, but is becoming more common in certain parts of London.

Wholesalers like Costco have had it for a while.

I've even heard that some non-grocery retailers like IKEA and Primark have it in places, but I've never seen that myself.

I just choose not to shop at these places. Maybe it'll become the norm at some point and I'll have to succumb to it, but I'm don't really like the experience so I stopped using those Tesco Express shops near my old work in London.

 

[Bletchleyite]

I just choose not to shop at these places. Maybe it'll become the norm at some point and I'll have to succumb to it, but I'm don't really like the experience so I stopped using those Tesco Express shops near my old work in London.

I don't see why anyone has a problem with a simple means of reducing theft (which in the end honest people pay for through their shopping costs), it's no different from ticket gates, and like ticket gates it prevents me from somehow accidentally failing to pay (e.g. a card transaction declining but me not realising). It's weird how this seems to be being lumped into all the conspirababble by so many yet ticket gates never are.

 

[styles]

I don't see why anyone has a problem with a simple means of reducing theft, it's no different from ticket gates, and like ticket gates it prevents me from somehow accidentally failing to pay (e.g. a card transaction declining but me not realising).

My first interaction with this system was when they'd introduced manual receipt checks on exit but hadn't changed the self service checkout software to always issue a receipt. Naturally I choose no receipt, then I had a security guard asking for it. They had to then ask what checkout I'd used, go back and check it etc. I actually just refunded my items because then experience was awful.

I remain unconvinced that it's even an effective security measure. If I scan a block of Stilton as a potato, the barrier or security guard aren't going to check every item on the receipt; they're merely checking that I have a receipt. This is perhaps the reason that the rollout of such systems has stalled, because the retailers have realised it doesn't work, and instead just inconveniences shoppers, costs money, and contributes to the air of low level hostility.

 

[saismee]

Especially if there's no obvious signage or barrier to suggest people shouldn't pass that point. I think the UK is getting slowly more hostile to everyday activities - I understand why body worn cameras are increasingly common, but it does just paint an air of mild hostility. Receipts required to leave supermarkets, landowners near Derwent patrolling hills on quads and removing wild campers, aggressive behaviour towards customer facing staff, etc.

Body-worn cameras reduce the chance of ASB by around 50% even when they aren't turned on. People know that they are higher quality and record audio, so turning them on often causes people to suddenly switch up. It's an unfortunate truth that frontline staff get a lot of abuse, but it seems to be on the decline again thankfully.

I've heard recently that staff at Chester are quite precious about the end of their platforms, which can cause some less than friendly interactions for spotters.

While I'm waiting for a train I often find myself just walking the full length of the platform and back. I do wonder if anybody is ever watching and thinking I'm a suicide risk. In any case, if I thought someone was suicidal, my approach wouldn't be to shout 'Oi' at them!

I think it tends to be most places that staff are protective of the ends of the platforms. The gates to XYZ are often placed there, and it's far away so they can't stop you as quickly if you start doing something suspicious. It is also where trains will enter the platform at the highest speeds while also usually being narrower, so they want to avoid an incident.

I also pace a lot and I used to do at the end of the platform in large circles. I have had at least 3 occasions where platform staff have checked up on me, but it's all been polite and out of genuine concern. I definitely come across as anxious or vulnerable, but I'm honestly just waiting for a train and can't stay still! Funnily enough, I now work with all of the people that have checked up on me, though I guarantee they won't remember any of those situations.

 

[Travelmonkey]

Persistent vandalism and antisocial behaviour.

It's also a blind curve with fast XC trains passing through. Before the gates it was a bit of a suicide hot spot.

 

[styles]

Body-worn cameras reduce the chance of ASB by around 50% even when they aren't turned on. People know that they are higher quality and record audio, so turning them on often causes people to suddenly switch up. It's an unfortunate truth that frontline staff get a lot of abuse, but it seems to be on the decline again thankfully.

Oh I don't disagree on the impact of BWV. I just think it also contributes to the low level hostility feeling.

I think it tends to be most places that staff are protective of the ends of the platforms. The gates to XYZ are often placed there, and it's far away so they can't stop you as quickly if you start doing something suspicious. It is also where trains will enter the platform at the highest speeds while also usually being narrower, so they want to avoid an incident.

I also pace a lot and I used to do at the end of the platform in large circles. I have had at least 3 occasions where platform staff have checked up on me, but it's all been polite and out of genuine concern. I definitely come across as anxious or vulnerable, but I'm honestly just waiting for a train and can't stay still! Funnily enough, I now work with all of the people that have checked up on me, though I guarantee they won't remember any of those situations.

Yes I should say, I would have zero issues with a member of staff checking in on my welfare if in was near the end of a platform. I don't think 'Oi' is suitable though, and in all honesty if I were suicidal I think it would do very little, if anything, to convince my to talk to somebody rather than carry through with my intentions. I'm not trained in suicide prevention but I think I'd prefer just outright asking if they're ok etc.

If somebody does respond that they're a spotter and they've got a camera and tripod out then probably leave them be

I do now wonder if with my time off I could do some suicide prevention training course. Seems like one of those things I'd likely never use but if I did, it could be literally life changing. Might look it up a bit. If anyone has any suggestions on courses etc happy to hear them.

 

[Travelmonkey]

Prehaps for another topic but for many the railway is used for suicide. I know i have had thoughts in the past (even found a hole in a rail fence but luckily snapped myself out when I realised what I was doing) it's always key to be catious especially at stations with a large number of passing trains non stop or electrified lines. Most 4 track mainlines seem to have some kind of sperating gate keeping the slows and fasts separated to only be opened when needed.

 

[Bletchleyite]

My first interaction with this system was when they'd introduced manual receipt checks on exit but hadn't changed the self service checkout software to always issue a receipt. Naturally I choose no receipt, then I had a security guard asking for it. They had to then ask what checkout I'd used, go back and check it etc. I actually just refunded my items because then experience was awful.

Something being badly implemented doesn't make it a bad idea, though. I dislike the atmosphere on Manchester Victoria station in part because of how the gateline is designed - it is too prominent and creates an oppressive atmosphere. That doesn't mean I dislike gatelines, quite the opposite, I think they have many benefits, I'd just change how that one is laid out and designed.

 

[styles]

Prehaps for another topic but for many the railway is used for suicide. I know i have had thoughts in the past (even found a hole in a rail fence but luckily snapped myself out when I realised what I was doing) it's always key to be catious especially at stations with a large number of passing trains non stop or electrified lines. Most 4 track mainlines seem to have some kind of sperating gate keeping the slows and fasts separated to only be opened when needed.

Spoiler: TW: suicide

Yes I have also taken the train to somewhere with the intention of ending my life. I was thankfully picked up by police, and also sectioned.

In hindsight the thing which I wish was better was just the public's interaction. I spent a long time on a train, crying, heading towards a frequently used suicide location, and nobody even spoke to me.

I don't expect every member of the public to get involved, but I would have thought that the guard you checked my ticket or the staff at the destination station or at least one of the passengers might have asked how I was doing.

The government does publish guidance on preventing suicide, and part of that is about physical access, but in their own guidance it's less than a quarter of the 'process' for assessing and mitigating suicide. A fence wouldn't have prevented me on that day, but somebody asking how I was doing absolutely would've prevented me ending up in police custody for nearly half a day. It's only second hand accounts but if staff are genuinely saying 'oi' to people who are stood near the end of platforms then I think the station operator should reconsider their strategy on this issue and provide proper support and training to staff on suicide prevention and interventions.

 

[E B]

Nottingham is a weird one - you cab roam the platforms fine, but a member of staff will always ask you as to why you are at the station, creating a slightly unpleasant feeling. And if you switch platforms then you will be asked again.