Delay Repay claims rejected

[Royston Vasey]

I've had a delay repay claim to WMR bounce back (rather than rejected) because "the journey details you have provided are incomplete. We need to see all legs of your journey entered on your claim under journey details, as stated on your ticket."
After double checking everything, my best guess is that the missing leg is a tube journey from London Liverpool St to London Euston. I have tried adding this to the system, but without success because WMR's system to enter journey details does not allow for tube journeys to be added. The submission system also does not appear to have a "free text" box anywhere for me to explain.

Does anybody have any suggestion on how to proceed?

I had this this week and spent all morning this morning trying to amend the details in the claim. I had had an extremely non-specific rejection email and the claim wouldn't then resubmit after I amended what I thought might have been the problem. The "Next Step" button (required to overwrite any details or images) wasn't working, so I couldn't replace any details or images. It may have been one missing ticket (swallowed by barrier) or the tickets weren't cut up.

The WMR claim system is so appallingly un-user friendly, you wonder if it's deliberate. It sends you back to correct errors that aren't there, has no free text entry, doesn't cope well with images/details being changed. There's no appeal process as such, you just have to guess what they're after and resubmit and hope. It's really not good enough to be made to guess what their problem is, they clearly just hope you'll go away.

I tried to resubmit a fresh version of the same claim, one attempt didn't recognise one of the tickets (I had put a date in a month out, my bad) and wouldn't submit properly, I got an email asking for more info, that I couldn't provide because as above, the form doesn't work.

I then submitted another exact same claim, correctly, which was rejected automatically as I had already made a claim on those tickets (true but it has already been rejected, so not as if I was double claiming)

So, do what I did, submit a complaint using their customer service contact form and choose "delay repay process". Explain the situation and that the form is not working, describe your journey and claim, include the booking reference and your original DR reference and hope they have a bit more flexibility. You have one upload for supporting info on this contact form - I put my original itinerary email, my ticket images and screenshots of their cancelled trains from the NR app into a PowerPoint and saved as pdf.

They must get a lot of appeals through their contact form, because the autoreply states:

Delay Repay appeals

If you have contacted us to appeal a Delay Repay decision, we’ll get back to you as soon as we can, but at busy times, it may take up to 20 working days to respond. If you haven’t already done so, please reply to this email with the full Delay Repay reference to help us investigate fully - and ideally a contact number, too.

 

[AdamWW]

I had this this week and spent all morning this morning trying to amend the details in the claim. I had had an extremely non-specific rejection email and the claim wouldn't then resubmit after I amended what I thought might have been the problem. The "Next Step" button (required to overwrite any details or images) wasn't working, so I couldn't replace any details or images. It may have been one missing ticket (swallowed by barrier) or the tickets weren't cut up.

The WMR claim system is so appallingly un-user friendly, you wonder if it's deliberate. It sends you back to correct errors that aren't there, has no free text entry, doesn't cope well with images/details being changed. There's no appeal process as such, you just have to guess what they're after and resubmit and hope. It's really not good enough to be made to guess what their problem is, they clearly just hope you'll go away.

I tried to resubmit a fresh version of the same claim, one attempt didn't recognise one of the tickets (I had put a date in a month out, my bad) and wouldn't submit properly, I got an email asking for more info, that I couldn't provide because as above, the form doesn't work.

I then submitted another exact same claim, correctly, which was rejected automatically as I had already made a claim on those tickets (true but it has already been rejected, so not as if I was double claiming)

I was going to suggest the answer is to get customer services to deal with it. But I see you got there first.

 

[trainophile]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Update: email from WMR today, and sure enough they have "forwarded" (i.e. returned) my claim to Northern. I'm giving up on this one now, on the scale of things it's not worth the hassle for £8. Some you win, some you lose.

In slightly brighter news, I've had an email from Northern today saying they now agree my claim and are paying up my £7.83. Pity it had to be after a game of pass the parcel, causing hassle for both the claimer and the operator whose fault it wasn't.

 

[alex94]

I had had an extremely non-specific rejection email

Exactly my experience too.

So, do what I did, submit a complaint using their customer service contact form and choose "delay repay process". Explain the situation and that the form is not working, describe your journey and claim, include the booking reference and your original DR reference and hope they have a bit more flexibility. You have one upload for supporting info on this contact form - I put my original itinerary email, my ticket images and screenshots of their cancelled trains from the NR app into a PowerPoint and saved as pdf.

Will give this a try - thanks!

 

[Jamiescott1]

Just had 2 rejections from GWR. Reason given "we rejected your claim as it doesn't meet the criteria in our current policy".
Delayed journeys were
14/05 06:06 marlow to Paddington.
13/05 16:50 Paddington to marlow.
Both delayed by longer than 30 minutes. Have appealed

They were my 21st and 22nd delay repay requests this calendar year

 

[pokemonsuper9]

Posting here because I bet I'll have an update in a few days.

Looks like Northern have made it so the ticket number reference now must be in the ##XXXXXXXXX format, despite the only documentation for S-tickets being the email.
I just opened the app and generated a token to put in there, I guess if it was exipred by that point I'd just write "THEREISNONE" since I think that would fit their filters.

 

[alex94]

I've had a delay repay claim to WMR bounce back (rather than rejected) because "the journey details you have provided are incomplete. We need to see all legs of your journey entered on your claim under journey details, as stated on your ticket."
After double checking everything, my best guess is that the missing leg is a tube journey from London Liverpool St to London Euston. I have tried adding this to the system, but without success because WMR's system to enter journey details does not allow for tube journeys to be added. The submission system also does not appear to have a "free text" box anywhere for me to explain.

Does anybody have any suggestion on how to proceed?

This was resolved after an email to customer services - it turned out that my ticket details (and not the journey details as stated in the email) were incomplete: I had split tickets, one of which was retained by the ticket gates upon exiting one of the intermediate stations, which meant I could only present the booking confirmation.

Interestingly, customer service suggest to immediately contact them when submitting a claim with a missing ticket, as only then a human will look at the claim. Given that it took approx. a week for the initial claim being rejected, I'm surprised to hear that this had been done without a human looking over it (why a delay if everthing is automated?)

 

[ainsworth74]

Sigh...

And around we go again with Northern refusing to pay out on s-tickets because: "We’re sorry but we are unable to process your claim with the ticket details you have provided, this is because you have uploaded an expense receipt rather than the ticket used for travel." this requirement is, of course, impossible to comply with because their implementation of s-tickets does not generate a pdf either for travel or delay repay purposes so the only evidence you can upload is the booking confirmation.

Appeal registered and a fifth complaint lodged with Northern for their ongoing failure to process these claims correctly. I wonder how much money they've "saved" by rejected s-ticket claims from passengers? Reckon it must be a reasonable sum.

 

[SuspectUsual]

Sigh...

And around we go again with Northern refusing to pay out on s-tickets because: "We’re sorry but we are unable to process your claim with the ticket details you have provided, this is because you have uploaded an expense receipt rather than the ticket used for travel." this requirement is, of course, impossible to comply with because their implementation of s-tickets does not generate a pdf either for travel or delay repay purposes so the only evidence you can upload is the booking confirmation.

Appeal registered and a fifth complaint lodged with Northern for their ongoing failure to process these claims correctly. I wonder how much money they've "saved" by rejected s-ticket claims from passengers? Reckon it must be a reasonable sum.

Ask him on Twitter he seems pretty active and engaging there

 

[800Travel]

Ask him on Twitter he seems pretty active and engaging there

Sigh...

And around we go again with Northern refusing to pay out on s-tickets because: "We’re sorry but we are unable to process your claim with the ticket details you have provided, this is because you have uploaded an expense receipt rather than the ticket used for travel." this requirement is, of course, impossible to comply with because their implementation of s-tickets does not generate a pdf either for travel or delay repay purposes so the only evidence you can upload is the booking confirmation.

Appeal registered and a fifth complaint lodged with Northern for their ongoing failure to process these claims correctly. I wonder how much money they've "saved" by rejected s-ticket claims from passengers? Reckon it must be a reasonable sum.

Yeah this would be my suggestion too. I’ve seen a few times where he has commented on posts someone (including staff) has raised with northern assist, where he has personally contacted the relevant team or is asking for more info to pass on. Seems to be very on the ball

 

[superalbs]

Got an excellent claim going on at the moment, whereby SWR are claiming that my ticket was invalid. They have now sent the restriction text to me two times, and have now paraphrased the same information a third time, each one confirming that my ticket was valid. I am truly speechless.

 

[bakerstreet]

Got an excellent claim going on at the moment, whereby SWR are claiming that my ticket was invalid. They have now sent the restriction text to me two times, and have now paraphrased the same information a third time, each one confirming that my ticket was valid. I am truly speechless.

Out of interest, if you don’t wish to share the code, how complex is it? what do you think is confusing them?

 

[superalbs]

Out of interest, if you don’t wish to share the code, how complex is it? what do you think is confusing them?

I have no idea. They keep mentioning the restrictions for a totally different ticket too, despite having admitted that I don't have such a ticket.

It surely cannot be confusion, this has to be intended?

 

[Fawkes Cat]

It surely cannot be confusion, this has to be intended?

No. Probably confusion. And a natural tendency by SWR staff to assume that their colleagues are right so anyone challenging the decision is wrong.

For the avoidance of doubt, I am not saying that this is right and what should happen: just that it's natural that it does happen.

 

[Michael B]

Just a +1 from me regards the WMR delay repay. I travelled Dawlish to Liverpool on Sunday 30th March and we got as far as Runcorn and there was a power cut which affected all services for the rest of the day. Long story short, I arrived Liverpool Moorfields 3 hours late. I submitted an on-line claim which responded that I needed to show evidence of a spoiled return ticket. I was unable to upload this so I contacted WMR customer service who told me there was an IT fault and it would be fixed. It was but then the website decided that I needed to add details of all my journeys (it didn't initially ask for this) however as this was after a month I couldn't add any further details! So another e-mail to WMR customer services. Three months now and still waiting.

On the other hand, I submitted a delay repay claim to GWR 7 days ago - it was approved yesterday

 

[Pep and co]

Hi everyone.
I recently did my first all line rover and had a great time out and about the network. Apart from my last day (Friday 20 June)I was lucky enough to avoid any serious delays.
On the Friday I had 2 delays that would entitle me to delay repay, one with GWR who paid out promptly and one with X-Country who are asking for more details about my start and finish rather than just my delayed leg on their train.
Can anyone give me some advice as how to proceed with my claim.

Many Thanks in advance for any help

 

[AlterEgo]

Hi everyone.
I recently did my first all line rover and had a great time out and about the network. Apart from my last day (Friday 20 June)I was lucky enough to avoid any serious delays.
On the Friday I had 2 delays that would entitle me to delay repay, one with GWR who paid out promptly and one with X-Country who are asking for more details about my start and finish rather than just my delayed leg on their train.
Can anyone give me some advice as how to proceed with my claim.

Many Thanks in advance for any help

What was the exact journey you were making which you are claiming for with CrossCountry?

 

[Pep and co]

What was the exact journey you were making which you are claiming for with CrossCountry?

I was on the 16:15 from Reading to Birmingham New Street on 20 June. Arrived 31 late.

 

[AlterEgo]

I was on the 16:15 from Reading to Birmingham New Street on 20 June. Arrived 31 late.

Was that the full journey you made by train that day? XC may have details of your GWR claim from the same day. What claim did you put in with GWR?

 

[Pep and co]

Was that the full journey you made by train that day? XC may have details of your GWR claim from the same day. What claim did you put in with GWR?

I travelled on the 13:18 Cardiff to Reading. Delayed by 22 mins. As I was on an ALR my travelling was quite random. Birmingham to Shrewsbury to Cardiff to Reading before my last leg to Birmingham

 

[AlterEgo]

I think in the circumstances you're entitled to class the XC leg as a separate journey then, and simply go back and say "this was the full journey I made".

 

[Pep and co]

I think in the circumstances you're entitled to class the XC leg as a separate journey then, and simply go back and say "this was the full journey I made".

Thanks for your advice

 

[ServerHoster]

On the 3rd of July I travelled from Sandbach to Carlisle, taking these trains:
07:23 Sandbach - Manchester Piccadilly 08:28
08:50 Manchester Piccadilly - Lancaster 10:02
10:14 Lancaster - Carlisle 13:41

I had a Northern Only Day Ranger which is £10.00, as this ticket isn't valid before 08:45 I also bought an extra Advance Single from Sandbach to Manchester Piccadilly for £4.30.

We wanted to get the Cumbrian Coast train because I was travelling with some friends who hadn't been on that route before (and we had a Northern Only ticket so we had no other option anyway).

The 10:14 from Lancaster was initially estimated to be delayed by 7 mins due to waiting for train crew to turn up. They eventually turned up before leaving 14 mins late. We got further delayed throughout the journey and arrived at Carlisle about 25 mins late. I submitted a Delay Repay claim with my full journey info, attaching all my tickets.

Well, this claim was quickly rejected because

We’re sorry but we have been unable to process your claim, the journey you have claimed for does not match the ticket information you have provided us. This maybe because you have only entered the leg of your journey where you suffered disruption.

Unfortunately to assess your claim and to ensure the appropriate compensation and delay calculation is achieved we need the full end to end journey detail that match the ticket you have provided us.

Even though it quite clearly does match! I appealed the claim simply stating that I did indeed provide the correct information, and got another rejection.

The intended leg from 07:23 SANDBACH left on time, scheduled to arrive at MANCHESTER PICCADILLY at 08:28, actually arrived 08:29.

The intended leg from 08:50 MANCHESTER PICCADILLY left at 08:51, scheduled to arrive at LANCASTER at 10:02, actually arrived 10:01.

The intended leg from 10:14 LANCASTER, scheduled to arrive at CARLISLE at 13:41 could not be taken because the intended journey was retimetabled.

The alternative leg from 10:22 LANCASTER left at 10:24, scheduled to arrive at CARLISLE at 11:18, arrived on time.

Total journey delay: No delay - your intended arrival time was 13:41 and the calculated arrival time for your journey was 11:18.

So they wanted me to get the 10:22 TPE service, which would not have been valid on my Northern Only ticket? I know they have a new ticket acceptance arrangement with each other, but this only applied when the train is cancelled, not delayed! And certainly not for a minor delay of 7 mins which was initially predicted.

So now I have exhausted all the possibilities of appealing on their automated system, which now means another email to customer services... yippee...

 

[pokemonsuper9]

Yeah this is a perennial issue which I've made multiple complaints about to Northern. Each complaint seems to cause the situation to improve for a little while before they start rejecting the claims wrongly again (as you note, their own sodding form clearly says a booking confirmation is sufficient). An appeal without changing anything usually works. But this has been going on for several years. No sign of a permanent fix.

Come back to note that ever since I started using the ticket ID (even if it's a different season token from the one used for the journey), they've all been reviewed much faster (~3 days instead of 2 weeks) and accepted first try.
Although I'm not getting as many delay repay opportunities compared to what I used to so I don't have the chance to test it as much.

 

[trainophile]

And so it goes on… WMR again . Journey from Morecambe to Lancaster to Lime Street to BHM New Street to Hereford on 12th September. Tickets held were MCM-LAN Off Peak Singles, LAN-LIV TPE Advances on the 10:22, LIV-HFD (via BHM) WMR Advances on the 12:33. All paper CCST.

All went fine until Lime Street, where the 12:33 was cancelled at quite short notice, causing us to have to get the 13:12, and arriving at BHM just as our scheduled 14:50 to HFD pulled out, meaning we had to wait for the 15:50 and making us exactly an hour late getting to our final destination.

Been playing some crazy game with their DR robot (I refuse to believe a human being would be so intransigent) ever since. Firstly it was laborious uploading the three sets of photos but I submitted my claim believing I had successfully done so.

Only to receive a rejection as they “did not receive photos of all the tickets”. On revisiting the form I found that only the Morecambe to Lancaster tickets (there were two of us so I took each photo of two tickets) were shown.

My mistake I thought, and then tried to no avail to upload the other two photos. Every time I pressed “view ticket” it reverted to the MCM-LAN image (and yes I was selecting “ticket 2”, “ticket 3“ etc.).

I then took to X/Twitter, where I must say their team are exceptional in helpfulness and speedy responses. I asked for an email address so I could send them the ticket photos, and did this.

I had no acknowledgement, so re-sent the email after a few days asking them to acknowledge receipt. Another four days of nothing. Last Sunday I got back on X, where another lovely helpful person apologised and offered to submit my photos for me, which they duly did. As I found out today they had also enter the relevant ticket numbers*.

I then had an automated email as per their usual response, saying they were looking into my claim and would respond within 10 days.

This morning they have rejected it as:

“We have not been able to approve your claim as the ticket you have provided was not valid for your stated journey. This could be due to one of the following reasons:

- We did not receive a copy of all your ticket(s) for the journey entered

- The ticket(s) you have provided are not valid for the selected journey

- The ticket(s) you provided were not valid for selected date/time of journey”

*All I can see is a mis-type in one of the ticket reference numbers, one digit has been entered as 8 instead of 0, easily done as the tickets print with a diagonal through the zero for some reason. I have corrected that on the form and tried to re-submit. However the Next Step button is now not responding so I’m thwarted once again.

I’ll be back on X later today, it’s only £33 but I’m determined not to abandon this after so much effort.

WMR get your act together. X team fantastic, DR team/software appalling. You’d think after so many complaints they would address their issues.

 

[Haywain]

Firstly it was laborious uploading the three sets of photos but I submitted my claim believing I had successfully d

Why not take one photo of all of the tickets?

 

[trainophile]

Why not take one photo of all of the tickets?I

That’s what I did eventually and that’s what I sent to X (who it appears then sliced it up and inserted them individually), but initially I thought that as they word the form indicating that you should attach them individually, that’s what I did.

My problem was that on revisiting the rejected claim form, it would then not let me remove the first image in order to replace it with another one. I was (I thought) uploading a replacement photo, only to find it was still stuck on the first one.

 

[AdamWW]

the tickets print with a diagonal through the zero for some reason

A convention from the early days of computing to clearly distinguish between zeros and capital "O"s.

Not seen much these days, and presumably not really necessary since fonts both on screen and printed tend to be somewhat higher resolution than they once were.

 

[styles]

A convention from the early days of computing to clearly distinguish between zeros and capital "O"s.

Not seen much these days, and presumably not really necessary since fonts both on screen and printed tend to be somewhat higher resolution than they once were.

I personally think it's still worthwhile, as many people struggle with long sightedness especially as they get older. It makes it far less ambiguous.

The worst one has to be I vs l. Not an issue when printed in all capitals of course.

 

[Gonzoiku]

I personally think it's still worthwhile, as many people struggle with long sightedness especially as they get older. It makes it far less ambiguous.

The worst one has to be I vs l. Not an issue when printed in all capitals of course.

Agreed, and if we are on to typography - old school journalists would use portable typewriters with no 1 or 0 keys, to save space, and would use l and o to substitute. Old habits etc, but it niggles me no end to see, in print, l99o in place of 1990.

GZ