Closing train doors from the back cab of a 166

[choochooplane]

Hi all. To what extent of misconduct would you say closing doors on a 166 from the rear cab, as a guard, would be? All BIL lights are off, PTI is clear, and the entire length of the train and platform is visible due to the straightness/curviture of the platform. Asking for a friend... Thanks.

 

[dodecahedron67]

Surely it depends on your company's policy on dispatching from a back cab on that specific stock?

 

[LowLevel]

Hi all. To what extent of misconduct would you say closing doors on a 166 from the rear cab, as a guard, would be? All BIL lights are off, PTI is clear, and the entire length of the train and platform is visible due to the straightness/curviture of the platform. Asking for a friend... Thanks.

None as far as I know, they've been dispatched from the rear cab by guards since they were introduced, in fact for much of their life you could only dispatch them from a cab as they had no saloon door controls until retrofitted to allow local door operation at short platforms.

 

[paulwestwood]

We can use any available door controls to dispatch a Turbo whilst in service, only issue is if there is a late runner and you have pressed the door close button, we cannot reopen the doors, and we are not allowed to let anyone in through the cab.

 

[greenline712]

We can use any available door controls to dispatch a Turbo whilst in service, only issue is if there is a late runner and you have pressed the door close button, we cannot reopen the doors, and we are not allowed to let anyone in through the cab.

That's interesting . . . this happened to me at Wokingham on Saturday last. My SWR train from Egham was 5 minutes late arriving at Wokingham (6 minute connection) . . . I hared across the bridge and had the doors close in my face. The guard was operating from the rear cab, and shouted "stand clear" . . . the train actually departed about 20 seconds later. I was less than happy, and I regret that I gave the guard "the finger" (as it had completely disrupted my travel plans for the day).

I'll apologise here and now . . . seemingly he was unable to reopen the doors, so it was just one of those things.

 

[sir_gummerz]

Hi all. To what extent of misconduct would you say closing doors on a 166 from the rear cab, as a guard, would be? All BIL lights are off, PTI is clear, and the entire length of the train and platform is visible due to the straightness/curviture of the platform. Asking for a friend... Thanks.

This happens every day on gwr trains, it is not against any sort of rule or policy. Not really sure what you are asking here.

Unless do you mean the guard never leaves the cab, just looks out the window without stepping on the platform at all. This is against the rules but seen it happen alot in winter, expecially at small unsttaffed stations with no dispatcher.

All guards are ment to have both feet on the platform while conducting checks.

 

[Bayum]

Would it not be sensible for said friend to conduct their local operating procedure and their union if they’re in a sticky situation?

 

[godfreycomplex]

Would it not be sensible for said friend to conduct their local operating procedure and their union if they’re in a sticky situation?

Indeed

Though I agree that the answer to the statement as written is “not at all”

 

[paulwestwood]

That's interesting . . . this happened to me at Wokingham on Saturday last. My SWR train from Egham was 5 minutes late arriving at Wokingham (6 minute connection) . . . I hared across the bridge and had the doors close in my face. The guard was operating from the rear cab, and shouted "stand clear" . . . the train actually departed about 20 seconds later. I was less than happy, and I regret that I gave the guard "the finger" (as it had completely disrupted my travel plans for the day).

I'll apologise here and now . . . seemingly he was unable to reopen the doors, so it was just one of those things.

On Turbos Driver Opens the Doors, and Guards Close.
Guards do have the abilty to do a Local Door Only, at places such as Avoncliffe due to very short platform as there are station stop board with instruction to Drivers say Do Not Release Doors, Guard Local Door Only.
At most stations where Driver releases and we close, the only way to re open is to Buzz the driver to re open the doors.

 

[GordonT]

Surely it depends on your company's policy on dispatching from a back cab on that specific stock?

And also if there was a bit more to the inferred misconduct than is apparent from the original post.

 

[godfreycomplex]

And also if there was a bit more to the inferred misconduct than is apparent from the original post.

And if there was, this probably isn't the forum for it, alas.

 

[choochooplane]

This happens every day on gwr trains, it is not against any sort of rule or policy. Not really sure what you are asking here.

Unless do you mean the guard never leaves the cab, just looks out the window without stepping on the platform at all. This is against the rules but seen it happen alot in winter, expecially at small unsttaffed stations with no dispatcher.

All guards are ment to have both feet on the platform while conducting checks.

Yes. Without stepping on the platform at all and just looking out the drop window but still having view of the entire train.

 

[paulwestwood]

Yes. Without stepping on the platform at all and just looking out the drop window but still having view of the entire train.

We are not supposed to be doing that at all, that isn't what is taught or expected, also as part of our competence we have unobtrusive assessments, so if this was observed we would be in coversation with the Guards Managers.

 

[ModernRailways]

Yes. Without stepping on the platform at all and just looking out the drop window but still having view of the entire train.

This is in breach of the rule book procedure so could easily lead to dismissal (and has in the past).
Your ‘friend’ needs to speak to their union rep about this, it is beyond the pay grade of this forum.

 

[McReadie]

That's interesting . . . this happened to me at Wokingham on Saturday last. My SWR train from Egham was 5 minutes late arriving at Wokingham (6 minute connection) . . . I hared across the bridge and had the doors close in my face. The guard was operating from the rear cab, and shouted "stand clear" . . . the train actually departed about 20 seconds later. I was less than happy, and I regret that I gave the guard "the finger" (as it had completely disrupted my travel plans for the day).

I'll apologise here and now . . . seemingly he was unable to reopen the doors, so it was just one of those things.

701 doors cannot be released by the guard. To re-release the doors once they have closed is a process; guard contacts driver, driver has to agree, only then will doors be released.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Dec 2025 ==

Hi all. To what extent of misconduct would you say closing doors on a 166 from the rear cab, as a guard, would be? All BIL lights are off, PTI is clear, and the entire length of the train and platform is visible due to the straightness/curviture of the platform. Asking for a friend... Thanks.

The rules clearly state that you must step down onto the platform at some point.
If you didn't step down at the beginning, but did at the end for dispatch you'd get a stiff word from management but it shouldn't lead to a sacking.
If you didn't step down at any point then that could probably lead to a clause 9 issue, which would probably be dismissal.
This is my understanding of things.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Dec 2025 ==

Yes. Without stepping on the platform at all and just looking out the drop window but still having view of the entire train.

This would be a serious breach and dismissal issue.

 

[prasa]

Echoing other forum member comments, this friend really needs to talk to a rep to ascertain the extent of misconduct based on TOC and the very likely disciplinary action if caught.