Lothian Group discussion (Lothian City, Lothian Country Bus and East Coast Buses)

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Was just on 437 and it sounds awful. The engine doesn't sound right at all. These batch seem to have not aged well.

The turbos on most of that batch are very worn, which results in the noise. 437 is probably the worst of them in terms of noise.

They’re getting to that point where they’re best use is probably as peak time spares. Indeed, I’d suggest it’s possible that they may pick up this work in the near future.

They’re a batch I personally like. However, I know I of many drivers who would tell you they’re the worst in the fleet. They’ve never aged well, for whatever reason.

 

[computerSaysNo]

The turbos on most of that batch are very worn, which results in the noise. 437 is probably the worst of them in terms of noise.

They’re getting to that point where they’re best use is probably as peak time spares. Indeed, I’d suggest it’s possible that they may pick up this work in the near future.

They’re a batch I personally like. However, I know I of many drivers who would tell you they’re the worst in the fleet. They’ve never aged well, for whatever reason.

Speaking of turbos - the How to Drive Buses and Coaches book (from the same publisher as The Highway Code) instructs, after coming to a stop after driving, to leave the engine running for a while to allow the turbo to cool down aided by the bus cooling system, as it gets very hot during use and turning the engine off immediately could cause the bearings to seize. Does this advice apply only to older buses?

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

Speaking of turbos - the How to Drive Buses and Coaches book (from the same publisher as The Highway Code) instructs, after coming to a stop after driving, to leave the engine running for a while to allow the turbo to cool down aided by the bus cooling system, as it gets very hot during use and turning the engine off immediately could cause the bearings to seize. Does this advice apply only to older buses?

Given that only 426-437 have visible issues of this in the Lothian fleet, I’d be inclined to say no. However, I know of vehicles in other fleets that do. I guess it’s just a natural thing of it being worn with age.

Another common problem seems to be worn diff’s. This is not specific to any batch but there are examples of Gemini2’s and Gemini3’s of this. 458 is probably the worst sounding of them and it’s been doing it for several years now.

 

[Bus9120UK]

Vehicle movements at this time -
42/3 Central to Marine
391/2 Marine to Central
366/71/2/4 Central to Longstone (1148/9/51/2 out of use)

 

[ScotRail158725]

Was just on 437 and it sounds awful. The engine doesn't sound right at all. These batch seem to have not aged well.

Easily the worst buses in the fleet by a mile, they’ve aged like a pint of milk in the sun. Glad i dont ever encounter them anymore

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Sep 2025 ==

Vehicle movements at this time -
42/3 Central to Marine
391/2 Marine to Central
366/71/2/4 Central to Longstone (1148/9/51/2 out of use)

Are 1148-1152 withdrawn or just off the road?

 

[Lothianbus703]

Vehicle movements at this time -
42/3 Central to Marine
391/2 Marine to Central
366/71/2/4 Central to Longstone (1148/9/51/2 out of use)

6/7/10/905/906 Withdrawn

 

[Avenger20]

6/7/10/905/906 Withdrawn

Are we finally looking at some of the 7900s being sold on?

 

[paul47B]

Dont know if this is a one off thing or not but im on 708 and all its next stop announcements are all in French both the

Dont know if this is a one off thing or not but im on 708 and all its next stop announcements are all in French both the audio ones and on the screen

The 7 goes through Little France after all

 

[airantraigh]

Are we finally looking at some of the 7900s being sold on?

Is sad thinking about, especially when considering how revolutionary they were when they were first introduced as a hybrid single. I guess times change and route demand changes with it, but I never have had any issue with them, lovely wee buses. I am also a bit surprised considering how recently they have been fitted with their new AV equipment, but at the same time to be expected with new PSVAR rules.

 

[stevenedin]

Has 929, 930 and 931 been withdrawn now since Central no longer require them?

 

[LothianBusesPh]

The turbos on most of that batch are very worn, which results in the noise. 437 is probably the worst of them in terms of noise.

434 is worse for it.

 

[Lx008]

6/7/10/905/906 Withdrawn

Interesting that they choose to withdraw 905/906 days before the Uni semester (and therefore their usual route on the shuttle) starts up again.

Is there really enough capacity to be putting mainline buses on the shuttle?

 

[Bus9120UK]

Interesting that they choose to withdraw 905/906 days before the Uni semester (and therefore their usual route on the shuttle) starts up again.

Is there really enough capacity to be putting mainline buses on the shuttle?

Marine have gained 4 buses overall (gain 464-468 and 496, loss 391/2).
The 5 requires 3 further vehicles, the uni shuttle requires 2, so initially that looks like they are one bus too low. However, as far as I'm concerned Marine were already up a bus due to the cancellation of the school 12 service. Additionally, a morning peak 11 from Kaimes to George Street has been curtailed to Lauriston Place and will likely form one of the Uni shuttle buses as well.

 

[stevenedin]

939 has moved to Lothian Country.

 

[route101]

Was just on 437 and it sounds awful. The engine doesn't sound right at all. These batch seem to have not aged well.

What type of bus is 437?

 

[CN04NRJ]

What type of bus is 437?

B5TL, it's always had a loud turbo. I can't directly upload it here but 1129 seems to have a blown/damaged turbo too.

 

[Resuwen]

If people on websites can spot these faults then why wouldn’t Lothian have fixed them?

 

[ScotRail158725]

Quick question, does the N3 still start at West Maitland Street? I know the 3 no longer stops there but the app is still showing all the old routes still stopping at HC and HD, there was no mention of the N3 on the service change so am unsure if its been changed to follow the normal service or if it will still start there as its the first stop

If people on websites can spot these faults then why wouldn’t Lothian have fixed them?

The bus will still run fine its not a major issue other than an unwell sound

 

[danielhogg2005]

Quick question, does the N3 still start at West Maitland Street? I know the 3 no longer stops there but the app is still showing all the old routes still stopping at HC and HD, there was no mention of the N3 on the service change so am unsure if its been changed to follow the normal service or if it will still start there as its the first stop

The bus will still run fine its not a major issue other than an unwell sound

Night Services, Express Services & East Coast Buses still serve West Maitland Street.

 

[ScotRail158725]

Night Services, Express Services & East Coast Buses still serve West Maitland Street.

Okay thanks, the rest were mentioned it was only the N3 that wasnt mentioned

 

[Siemens Trains]

Quick question, does the N3 still start at West Maitland Street? I know the 3 no longer stops there but the app is still showing all the old routes still stopping at HC and HD

The app seems to show N25, N26 & N44 stopping at literally both HC and HD. All a bit confusing at the moment but I'm sure it will get sorted out. I think this service change publicity map is probably accurate (at least for N3!):

 

[LothianBusesPh]

If people on websites can spot these faults then why wouldn’t Lothian have fixed them?

The app seems to show N25, N26 & N44 stopping at literally both HC and HD. All a bit confusing at the moment but I'm sure it will get sorted out. I think this service change publicity map is probably accurate though:
View attachment 188046

N1 also stops at HD.

 

[Bus9120UK]

There's definitely been an effort to optimise the blocks on the BZL operated routes. Other than the mentioned interworking, there's also various services which now have short morning/late evening blocks (essentially one bus returning to the garage with another bus headed out in its place). This has also been set up for the 5 and 45 at Marine in anticipation of their conversions.

12, 13, 29 and 30 are at Longstone now. No doubt some will be purposed for the training school.
Central is left with 31-41 for the 36, 11 buses for a route of peak vehicle requirement 9. I'm expecting 191-193 to be withdrawn with 195/6 moving east now that 42/3 have moved to Marine.

 

[Scotrail314209]

So what things have actually changed in terms of bus allocation? Driving through Corstorphine earlier I did notice that a BZL was on the 1, is this now regular?

Is it likely that all the 7900H’s will go or just some?

 

[Bus9120UK]

So what things have actually changed in terms of bus allocation? Driving through Corstorphine earlier I did notice that a BZL was on the 1, is this now regular?

Is it likely that all the 7900H’s will go or just some?

The allocations are generally unchanged other than the BZLs on the 1 and new sunday 45. The Marine 7s are back to B9TLs and no longer B5TLs.

The Monday-Saturday 12 should be fixed to 7900s rather than a mix of those and B7RLEs as well. Interestingly the Sunday 12 today was fully B7RLEs though.

The 47 was fully B9TLs today. I presume it'll stay on XLBs Monday to Saturday but time will tell.

Over time 1141-1153 will disappear with native 11 plates in their place.

Routes 5, 23, 27 and 45 should eventually be fully converted to BZL operation.

 

[muffy]

I can only go by what the block numbers are on the open data source I've access to.
the 17:35 service 9 comes off the 17:17 arriving 9 and then doesn't do anything else.

The new early morning 44 does the 26 from Levenhall Roundabout, sorry omitted that.

May be unrealistically high but its what the block numbers show in the open data.
The 14 has had buses swapping already at weekends (early mornings)

Checking Lothian buses website for future dates (not the press release pdfs), 05:52 8 from ERI terminates short at Pennywell cottages (similar to what the short 8 from Leith St does) This is also the case for the 10:13 and 2055 service 9s from Kings Buildings.

Checking Lothian buses website again, you will see that the 10:30 and 11am service 24s to ERI do not stop at Stop IA like the full service 24 does - this also happens for the 12:45, 14:00, 17:18, 18:06, 19:17 run. The same is true of the 7 timetable due to the interworkings.

The evening 36 has a longstone block number hence my belief it will be longstone run. The 27 that works onto the 25/X26 has a marine block number so likely as you say is done by the shuttle bus.

Likewise the X40 has 5 blocks (4 during the day showing recovery time at livingston end.)

The 1629 appears to be fresh out of the garage and works 9's until 10pm then two 14s.

I noted yesterday that the incoming X40 at St John's headed straight to the garage with another bus coming in to do the outgoing service which means a PVR increase of 1.

 

[Jordan1296]

So what things have actually changed in terms of bus allocation? Driving through Corstorphine earlier I did notice that a BZL was on the 1, is this now regular?

Is it likely that all the 7900H’s will go or just some?

Since yesterday‘s service change, that looks as though that will now be standard. All buses on the 1 yesterday were BZL’s as are today’s.

 

[stevenedin]

I've noticed that 1 and 2 (7900s) seem to have on the 36 for the past few days. Is the 36 now at Central?

Also I've noticed that 172 hasn't been used for a while. I take it that's it finished?

 

[FlybeDash8Q400]

I've noticed that 1 and 2 (7900s) seem to have on the 36 for the past few days. Is the 36 now at Central?

Also I've noticed that 172 hasn't been used for a while. I take it that's it finished?

1 and 2, myself and @Bus9120UK think Central are at a slightly uncomfortable number for them to go. Ideally Central should have another couple of deckers in there and 40 has had a small absence of late. With a requirement of 9 for the 36, having just 11 vehicles feels incredibly ambitious to me. I think it is possible that 42 may return to Central if and when 49 returns, a vehicle that has been off for almost 7 months now. 50 has also been out of use of late.

It looks to me as if 12-15 and 23 will be the new route training fleet. 15 and 23 from before, with 12-13 coming from Central, while 29 released 14.

The last transfer from Central (30) should be an extra bus for Service 20. This is needed as it will now need to be a standalone bus, rather than one of the peak extra 36’s, which of course have gone to Central. The 2 has no runs of this nature that would allow it to work. The 30 and 38 don’t have the correct timings.

172, if I’ve read the map right, looks like it’s having work done on it. The high absences at Marine may explain why we haven’t seen 195-196 move to Seafield yet.

 

[alexf380]

172 has been over one of the inside pits at Marine for a good week and a half. It must be a fairly lengthy repair job.

193 appears to have finally settled in after not managing a full day in service for months on end. The suggestion that the three Enviros could be replaced by 195 and 196 IMO is a bad one as we really need five buses available for the Eve's local routes. Remember one B7 is technically allocated to the X7 each day.
If only there were six short wheelbase single decks sitting gathering dust somewhere...